Commenting setup - DPChallenge Forums

Canon EF-S 18-55mm f/3.5-5.6 IS

07/06/2004 07:28:19 AM · #1

One of the most common complaints on the site and one that can lead to "mile long" threads appears to be the receipt of nasty or malicious comments.
In one of the many previous threads on the subject, a suggestion was made to return to anonymous commenting as a means of getting more people to add their comments to images in the challenges..as apparently many do not comment because of irate recipients Pm`ing them and complaining about the comment they left.

I was against anonymity in principal.. because (IMO)it would lead to more comments of the "nasty and unhelpful" sort.
However, giving it more thought, I wondered if combining an anonymous commenting setup with a scoring system for the comment,(instead of ticking a "helpful" box)..might give us the best of both worlds.

Commenters would not need to fear a backlash from their comment..but if it was rude or insulting, the receiver would score it accordingly, which would show up on the commenters profile page..(probably providing a more accurate reflection of the quality of peoples comments.
More importantly..if you are a consistently nasty commenter..this would be highlighted with one look at your profile page and could be acted on by SC if they deemed it necessary..rather than people having to complain about isolated incidents.

I realise that it may be far too complex a project to be worth setting up..and there are probably other draw backs that I`ve not yet considered, but it did seem to me to be a reasonable prospect for discussion.

Konador

Canon EOS-500D Rebel T1i

07/06/2004 07:39:08 AM · #2

That sounds like quite a good idea. Perhaps the option of remaining anonymous until the end of the challenge could be chosen by each individual user, so people can still remain un-anonymous if they wish.

Tamron SP AF 17-35mm f/2.8-4 Di LD Aspherical IF for Nikon

07/06/2004 07:45:28 AM · #3

Originally posted by Konador:

A nice addition Ben which might help suit all tastes.
The main thing to me is to try to encourage as many people as possible to comment and also to discourage unhelpful and rude comments.

Node

Nikon D300

07/06/2004 08:29:02 AM · #4

That sounds like a great idea, BUT how about combining the two! IE What if the commenter was to remain anonymous untill the end of the challenge and the receiver of the comment could tick one of lets say 3 boxes (Helpfull, Not Helpfull, (Rude?)) before the end of the challenge but not after.

Just a thought! Mmmm don't know if rude is right but couldn't think of anything else.

digistoune

Canon EOS-20D

07/06/2004 09:07:56 AM · #5

That's an interesting idea but what if you make a comment that is direct and helpful without being rude but the photographer takes offense anyway? I've seen that happen a lot. That might reverse the effect of trying to elicit more comments.

Nikon AF Nikkor 50mm f/1.8

07/06/2004 11:05:28 AM · #6

Originally posted by digistoune:

Rather than boxes with helpful, unhelpful etc, I was thinking of scoring the comments just like the challenge ie. 1-10 with (as a guide) say 5 for a middle of the road remark such as "nice picture"
6-10 for comments which contain useful tips
5 down to 1 for comments which range from unhelpful to downright nasty.

On your profile, instead of the number of comments marked "helpful" which, let`s face it, doesn`t mean a lot the way the system is at the moment..you would have an average score.. which would surely be an encouragement to leave helpful..courteous, comments.
I think this would only work if the commenting was anonymous during the challenge..otherwise scores might be influenced by whoever sent the comment.

Edited for typos

Message edited by author 2004-07-06 11:13:22.

wwwavenger

07/06/2004 11:11:06 AM · #7

Slashcode (Slashdot.org) has a system like this. Comments are moderated by randomly-chosen users who get mod-points for comments they choose to rate and then other users are allowed to meta-moderate those ratings. Each user gets a "karma" rating based on how their comments are moderated and meta-moderated. If you had bad "karma" all your comments start with a lower "score". It's an extrememly effective system.

Edit: Last time, I promise.

Message edited by author 2004-07-06 11:15:01.

wwwavenger

07/06/2004 07:39:24 PM · #8

Bump

What do you guys think about a comment moderation system?

soccerdad

Fujifilm FinePix S2 Pro

07/06/2004 09:35:13 PM · #9

I saw this thread this morning and thought about it on and off during the day. Basically, I think we loose more by making comments anonymous than we gain.

First, a comment that comes with a name allows a click on the profile. In addition to some summary data about voting style, ranges, overall comment "helpfulness", more importantly, we get to learn some things about the photographers style, likes and dislikes (through favorites.) This allows us to judge the value of the comment to us as photographers (if we both like flowers, but they hate my picture, I know what that means.)

The second issue might be even more important, we get to judge the photographer's frame of reference, through bio details, photo selection, challenge participation, etc. This helps us to judge a comment that might say "...nothing extraordinary here..." in this week's challenge, when someone from an urban environment might view something a suburbanite sees completely differently.

In short, I am a big fan of more comments, but not a fan at any cost. I think the precious few comments are better than comments with no context.

Note: I think comments remaining anonymous during voting, might be OK. We would probably all go back and look at the profiles. But, Konadors idea of optional anonymity seems best to me.

Bran-O-Rama

Canon EOS-5D

Canon EF 24-70mm f/2.8L USM

07/06/2004 09:41:45 PM · #10

I myself would like to receive more comments. I am here, afterall to improve my photography. I have made 237 comments and only received 39. Upon checking my received comments, several were actually my replies to other's comments so in actuality, I've received much less. I'm close to getting 1 comment for every 8 comments that I make. I'd really like people to critique my work. As of now, my purple entry has only 2 comments :(

I've put off updating my portfolio many times because of the lack of comments I receive.

Node

Nikon D300

Tamron SP AF 17-35mm f/2.8-4 Di LD Aspherical IF for Nikon

07/07/2004 09:29:57 AM · #11

I do like the 1 - 10 scale, seems much fairer and people would strive to increase their average comment score. I don't think it will increase the amount of comments as with everything only the minority will leave more comments than the average person BUT I think people would think more about the comments that they do leave increasing the quality!

And with the option for anonymity well I kinda like to see who has commented as well but I'm all for it until voting has ended as long as the receiver of the comment can only vote on the scale before the end of voting as well so no one is tempted to give higher scores for friends or people they have respect for no matter what they say.

Why not take it a step further and award 1st 2nd and 3rd places for the highest rated commentators in each challenge? Set some guidelines like they must have commented on 20% of the challenge, now that might help increase the number of comments!

What do ya recon?

Canon EF 24-105mm f/4.0L IS

07/07/2004 10:55:18 AM · #12

Originally posted by Gurilla:

That`s more or less exactly as I saw it working..Nice idea about awards for the best comment average for the challenge that should certainly help to make folk think more about their input but it all may be too much work to implement..I was kinda hoping someone in the know would have said whether this was a possibility or not.

scalvert

Canon EOS-5D Mark III

07/08/2004 03:21:26 PM · #13

Personally, I think comments are a tough thing to regulate with scoring. Comments are made without the benefit of knowing the circumstances for a photo. I might "helpfully" suggest showing more on the left side of an image without knowing that the photographer cropped out a garbage can, or suggest less color manipulation when there really wasn't any. I received a comment on a portrait photo suggesting that there was obviously too much makeup on my model when she wasn't wearing any at all. Such comments may not be intended to offend, but they aren't particularly helpful either. How would you score "nice shot," or "this doesn't really appeal to me?" They are both valid statements of opinion that could help you judge the popularity of your technique or concept.

I try to make some suggestion for improvement on most comments I leave, even if I'm giving a score of 9 or 10, but some folks simply don't accept any form of criticism as helpful. I mark every comment as helpful simply to acknowledge that I have noted that person's opinion and appreciate the effort of leaving the note. If a comment were particularly offensive without good reason, I would probably regard the author as a lunatic and simply ignore it.

OneSweetSin

Nikon D3000

07/08/2004 03:39:36 PM · #14

As much as I hate to say it as of today I really wish all comments would be held off til after the challenge is over. Would stop a lot of the negativity being left behind, and a lot of those who leave rude and nasty comments probably wouldn't want to go back and look at the photos a second time just to be nasty with comments.

dr rick

Canon EOS-300D Rebel

Canon EF 28-135mm f/3.5-5.6 IS USM

07/08/2004 03:53:19 PM · #15

Originally posted by OneSweetSin:

True enough. But a lot of those who leave nice helpful comments probably wouldn't go back just to leave comments either. I know from experience that when I'm voting that if I don't leave a comment right then, I probably never will.

Tamron SP AF 17-35mm f/2.8-4 Di LD Aspherical IF for Nikon

07/08/2004 03:55:00 PM · #16

Originally posted by scalvert:

A lot of good points here Shannon that I will try to answer.
On the subject of giving advice when we don`t know the circumstances behind the construction of the image...A very valid point but one that we will have to live with regardless of the setup we use to comment, unless the details of how the picture was taken are allowed to be viewed at the time of voting and there have been many objections to this in the past because of the possibility of revealing to much information which could give the photographers identity away.I feel this particular "problem" is better resolved with a scoring system as you can give it the score it deserved rather than tick a box to say how useful this "useless" comment was.
How would I score "nice shot" or "This doesn`t really appeal to me"..well at the end of the day that is down to the individual but I would regard the bland type of comment as a middle score of 5 neither helpful or unhelpful..unless as a guide to the general acceptance of your work with individuals.

I agree that the system can`t please everyone as some people will still score 1 and 2 for comments giving good advice..just as they do for excellent challenge photos (although that may be able to be eliminated using the same score adjustment technique as for challenges).
I still feel however, that it would encourage more commenting and hopefully deter the "nasty" commenter..but agree also that it would probably be a nightmare to implement...sadly

Message edited by author 2004-07-08 15:56:54.

Node

Nikon D300

07/08/2004 04:10:03 PM · #17

I still feel however, that it would encourage more commenting and hopefully deter the "nasty" commenter..but agree also that it would probably be a nightmare to implement...sadly

I can't see why it would be a nightmare! All the tally software is already in place to count the Photo scores, wouldn't it be a simple matter of using the same software (or a seperate copy) to tally comments as well as long as it is kept to the same 1 - 10 system?

It seems easy from where I am but I don't know how these things work, maybe someone with a better knowledge of this could reply.

I think its a good idea and worth pursueing and I hope it dosen't get lost in the dead message bin.

scalvert

Canon EOS-5D Mark III

Canon EF 24-105mm f/4.0L IS

07/08/2004 04:41:44 PM · #18

Maybe it's just a series of checkboxes: Helpful, Not Helpful, Appreciated, N/A... instead of a scoring system. I think this is something that has been suggested many times before. It's hard enough to get people to vote and comment on the challenges themselves (more people entered the June Free Study than voted on it). Now we'd have to vote on the comments? I know it would only be for our own comments, but still...

This might be easier to solve with just a more detailed explanation of the voting and commenting process from the admins posted prominently on the home page (not just in the FAQs).