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09/27/2013 07:58:25 PM · #26 |
I gave mine the same name. Didn't particularly like the name. Didn't think about the fact that their might be many other images using the same name in the past.
So it definitely was based on an old image, but there are more images with the same name. Don't know if that's why I'm getting hit. Probably. *sigh*
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09/27/2013 07:59:28 PM · #27 |
Originally posted by pixelpig:
Plus, there's the hint that if the original is not readily available, there is a suspicion that you just entered any image you wanted, disregarding the challenge description. |
I can say that I will search in every possible way the original before casting a low score, but to keep searching for an image because of lack of a clear indication can be quite annoying. |
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09/27/2013 08:00:39 PM · #28 |
Originally posted by pixelpig:
But some are giving low scores for not being able to conveniently compare the 2 images. |
That would be me. But really, the only thing I penalized was titles without either a challenge title, image ID, author and title. I even was nicer to those who just gave me a super well known image, or those who gave me a title I happened to recognize. I gave extra love and points for images that were well executed. That's fair enough I think? I also think it's unfair to expect the voters to go to great lengths to compare, it's incumbent upon you to consider these matters when challenges like this come up.
I think the fact is that some people are doing it, and penalizing much more heavily than I. (it would seem so given some scores I've been told about)
..
If it makes you feel better, just think of it as my having given a bonus to those who did make it easy and were considerate of my time as a voter.
Message edited by author 2013-09-27 20:04:48. |
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09/27/2013 08:02:39 PM · #29 |
Originally posted by Cory:
If it makes you feel better, just think of it as my having given a bonus to those who did make it easy. |
Ditto. Although I didn't hammer any with anything less than a 5. |
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09/27/2013 08:10:00 PM · #30 |
Originally posted by Art Roflmao:
Originally posted by Cory:
If it makes you feel better, just think of it as my having given a bonus to those who did make it easy. |
Ditto. Although I didn't hammer any with anything less than a 5. |
I usually vote a bell-curve that is shifted slightly right with a peak at 6/7, this one definitely had a leftward shift in the curve with wildly flat middle. (nearly equal numbers of 4, 5 and 6 votes) |
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09/27/2013 08:16:57 PM · #31 |
For anyone still wondering how to find the referenced DQed image - a quick review - because I asked this morning!
 Alexkc and Posthumous came through.
1. In the Image Search Box on the front page tap in the title of the image under question.
Check the results for a pic that comes close to the one under consideration. So far, it's been pretty obvious.
or
2. if you only know the image number, when any image is up, highlight the image number and change it to the image number in question
this bring up the image in question
or
if only a maker's reference is given, go to that user name and look for the tell-tail pinkee.
OR
If it's not in any of those three, then HA - low score, no matter what the quality of the submission is.
So? It takes a while. Got something better to do? Naw...
Oh, yes. And Cory? teammate? Friend? No you don't know which is mine in the Challenge you're getting heat for.
(but)
I'm sure glad you didn't tell me what you, ahem, really thought!
:) |
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09/27/2013 09:24:59 PM · #32 |
| How about 37 entries with the same title as the one in the DQ challenge - and not one resembles it (imo) and not one was DQ'd. I won't tell you how long it took me to open each of them in turn, but I'm not doing that on many more. |
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09/27/2013 10:09:15 PM · #33 |
In the words of Gob Bluth...I think I've made a huge mistake.
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09/27/2013 10:09:41 PM · #34 |
Originally posted by Cory:
BTW: an open offer, PM me a link to your original if I've commented on your entry telling you that I lowered your score (lowering the work I have to do!) and I'll absolutely bump you a point for doing so. I can't see any good reason to hold it against you if you fix the 'mistake'.
This isn't dependant on who the image belongs to, don't hesitate to ask for your extra-credit point by sending me a link to your original.
If yours is one of the ones I didn't look up (I did look up a couple of them), and I think you did a bang-up job, I might even bump it higher.
*Offer only valid for residents of Planet Earth.
(Disclaimer, I re-read the challenge voting rules before posting this. I believe I am acting well within the rules, if that is not true, please do let me know..) |
PMing during the challenge re a comment given should not be encouraged.
Marking down an image because you don't feel like taking the time to figure out the original should also be frowned upon.
Maybe your actions fall within the rules but I find them disrespectful to the efforts put out in entering the challenge. Sorry.
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09/27/2013 10:31:56 PM · #35 |
Originally posted by PennyStreet:
Originally posted by Cory:
BTW: an open offer, PM me a link to your original if I've commented on your entry telling you that I lowered your score (lowering the work I have to do!) and I'll absolutely bump you a point for doing so. I can't see any good reason to hold it against you if you fix the 'mistake'.
This isn't dependant on who the image belongs to, don't hesitate to ask for your extra-credit point by sending me a link to your original.
If yours is one of the ones I didn't look up (I did look up a couple of them), and I think you did a bang-up job, I might even bump it higher.
*Offer only valid for residents of Planet Earth.
(Disclaimer, I re-read the challenge voting rules before posting this. I believe I am acting well within the rules, if that is not true, please do let me know..) |
PMing during the challenge re a comment given should not be encouraged.
Marking down an image because you don't feel like taking the time to figure out the original should also be frowned upon.
Maybe your actions fall within the rules but I find them disrespectful to the efforts put out in entering the challenge. Sorry. |
Just see nam's comment above. She's done as you suggested, and has now spent hours looking for images, tell me how that isn't disrespectful of her time as a voter? Should I not reward those who made my life easier, and made it convenient to judge the merits of their redo? That's the way the real world works, make it easy for people, or they really won't bother.
Disrespectful? No offense intended, but really? disrespectful of the efforts put out? I gave higher scores than 'average' for this challenge, and I commented on every entry, paying special attention to those which suffered due to my refusal to spend lots of time searching. |
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09/27/2013 10:56:39 PM · #36 |
Originally posted by Cory:
Originally posted by PennyStreet:
Originally posted by Cory:
BTW: an open offer, PM me a link to your original if I've commented on your entry telling you that I lowered your score (lowering the work I have to do!) and I'll absolutely bump you a point for doing so. I can't see any good reason to hold it against you if you fix the 'mistake'.
This isn't dependant on who the image belongs to, don't hesitate to ask for your extra-credit point by sending me a link to your original.
If yours is one of the ones I didn't look up (I did look up a couple of them), and I think you did a bang-up job, I might even bump it higher.
*Offer only valid for residents of Planet Earth.
(Disclaimer, I re-read the challenge voting rules before posting this. I believe I am acting well within the rules, if that is not true, please do let me know..) |
PMing during the challenge re a comment given should not be encouraged.
Marking down an image because you don't feel like taking the time to figure out the original should also be frowned upon.
Maybe your actions fall within the rules but I find them disrespectful to the efforts put out in entering the challenge. Sorry. |
Just see nam's comment above. She's done as you suggested, and has now spent hours looking for images, tell me how that isn't disrespectful of her time as a voter? Should I not reward those who made my life easier, and made it convenient to judge the merits of their redo? That's the way the real world works, make it easy for people, or they really won't bother.
Disrespectful? No offense intended, but really? disrespectful of the efforts put out? I gave higher scores than 'average' for this challenge, and I commented on every entry, paying special attention to those which suffered due to my refusal to spend lots of time searching. |
I didn't enter - would have but I fell asleep - was planning to just use the title of the DQd entry. Shouldn't that be enough? Maybe I need to go through and vote first to understand the problem.
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09/27/2013 10:58:26 PM · #37 |
I spent maybe an hour, maybe not quite. Managed to vote on 10 but only a few were really easy to find. Left comments on another five but haven't decided how to vote - just can't find them.
I will finish and I will vote 100% (except a couple I saw ahead of time) but it will take a few days.
I will mark down some images, and it won't be because I didn't feel like taking the time to figure out the original; it will be because I could not do so or because it took me a completely unreasonable amount of time to do so.
And my thanks to all the entrants who figured out that we were going to need this information in order to vote this challenge. |
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09/28/2013 09:45:50 AM · #38 |
Originally posted by nam:
I spent maybe an hour, maybe not quite. Managed to vote on 10 but only a few were really easy to find. Left comments on another five but haven't decided how to vote - just can't find them.
I will finish and I will vote 100% (except a couple I saw ahead of time) but it will take a few days.
I will mark down some images, and it won't be because I didn't feel like taking the time to figure out the original; it will be because I could not do so or because it took me a completely unreasonable amount of time to do so.
And my thanks to all the entrants who figured out that we were going to need this information in order to vote this challenge. |
I will vote today so I can see what you're up against... but, generally, when I vote I vote on any entry I ask myself.... Does it connect with me? Does it have technical merit? THEN... does it fit the topic. Sometime one of more of these things will be blatant enough to warrant a mark up or down, but I feel it's a fair way to judge.
I always assume entrants have made their best attempt at meeting the challenge and, in this case, if I can't find the original I will assume that there is one and vote on the current entry what I believe it's worth as a photograph.
In good conscience, I would much rather err on the side of giving credit for the work presented.
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09/28/2013 09:47:44 AM · #39 |
Originally posted by Cory:
BTW: an open offer, PM me a link to your original if I've commented on your entry telling you that I lowered your score (lowering the work I have to do!) and I'll absolutely bump you a point for doing so. I can't see any good reason to hold it against you if you fix the 'mistake'.
This isn't dependant on who the image belongs to, don't hesitate to ask for your extra-credit point by sending me a link to your original.
If yours is one of the ones I didn't look up (I did look up a couple of them), and I think you did a bang-up job, I might even bump it higher.
*Offer only valid for residents of Planet Earth.
(Disclaimer, I re-read the challenge voting rules before posting this. I believe I am acting well within the rules, if that is not true, please do let me know..) |
Sorry, I've thought about this overnight and still am having a real problem coming to grips with the idea that you are asking entrants to expose their entry to you DURING VOTING with an offer of a reward to change the vote you handed them.
You may have read the rules and deemed this to be compliant, but it sounds like vote manipulation to me. |
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09/28/2013 10:14:54 AM · #40 |
Originally posted by PennyStreet:
Originally posted by Cory:
BTW: an open offer, PM me a link to your original if I've commented on your entry telling you that I lowered your score (lowering the work I have to do!) and I'll absolutely bump you a point for doing so. I can't see any good reason to hold it against you if you fix the 'mistake'.
This isn't dependant on who the image belongs to, don't hesitate to ask for your extra-credit point by sending me a link to your original.
If yours is one of the ones I didn't look up (I did look up a couple of them), and I think you did a bang-up job, I might even bump it higher.
*Offer only valid for residents of Planet Earth.
(Disclaimer, I re-read the challenge voting rules before posting this. I believe I am acting well within the rules, if that is not true, please do let me know..) |
Sorry, I've thought about this overnight and still am having a real problem coming to grips with the idea that you are asking entrants to expose their entry to you DURING VOTING with an offer of a reward to change the vote you handed them.
You may have read the rules and deemed this to be compliant, but it sounds like vote manipulation to me. |
Cory, one of the great things about the challenges here is that the identity of the photographer and the notes/story of how they achieved the photo are not visible during voting. The system is in place because it creates a level playing field for everyone who participates that the photo will be judged on it's own merits without any outside 'influences' swaying the voter. Inviting participates to PM you with details and you will change your vote should it merit while we are in the voting stage, destroys that anonymous nature, sets up a temptation some may not be able to resist, and falls under swaying the voter to change the vote in favor of the participant. I have no problem if you are inviting them to discuss why you voted the way you did but to state you will change it after further discussion it becomes a biased vote and, I feel, vote manipulation because you have now been swayed. Now I know you have good intentions and are doing this to be helpful but it actually hurts the whole fair process). Just my two cents.
Message edited by author 2013-09-28 10:16:45. |
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09/28/2013 11:26:57 AM · #41 |
I identified 34 of the 41 images (kept a list) and voted on all. I think the whole process took an hour and a half. I will finish commenting later... maybe some bumps as that happens.
There are a number of really excellent retakes in there..... some updated from the originals, some copies.. all worth a look - I encourage you to do so! |
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09/28/2013 11:35:52 AM · #42 |
Originally posted by PennyStreet:
I identified 34 of the 41 images (kept a list) and voted on all. . . . |
Percentage wise 34/41 is much better than the 10/15 I have done so far so I'm encouraged. Apparently most of the hard to find ones came up first in my voting queue :) I'm off to do another batch. |
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09/28/2013 12:06:40 PM · #43 |
My only response is that it would have been unfair to not be consistent.
The first half dozen PM's were completely unsolicited, so if I gave those folks a 'makeup' point, isn't it then only fair to make sure that all of those who were affected had a chance too?
Again, I've read the rules carefully, and I am quite certain I am acting within the bounds of those rules.
If I wasn't, don't you think SC would have either contacted me by now, or removed my 'offending' post?
Tell ya what though. I'll go remove all the fixed points I added and everyone who's score drops today can thank those who are crying about it here and via PM.
Screw fairness huh? Screw Redemption. Let's be really silly about the rules instead, because, like, I totally can't tell who half the damned images belong to anyway.
Message edited by author 2013-09-28 12:17:03. |
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09/28/2013 12:27:01 PM · #44 |
If I could find 34 of the 41 originals you could too. It didn't take very long and it's all legal.
Anybody who is having trouble, may I point out that there is a search by image name Photos/Search (I suggest a filter for Challenge entries)
There is a search by profile name Community/Photographer Profiles (brings up profile.. look for pink DQs)
and you can type any image ID into the scroll bar at the top - go here //www.dpchallenge.com/image.php?IMAGE_ID=INSERT NUMBER
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09/28/2013 12:43:07 PM · #45 |
Let's all calm down before this gets out of hand ... this is a complicated situation because there was no easy mechanism for people to link to the photo they were re-creating, and for some people this is an important factor in computing their vote.
However, the real intent of the rules is to prevent photographers from soliciting a change in votes. For a voter to state that they'll vote down any photo for which they can't find the inspirational source image is not that unreasonable ΓΆ€” people vote images down based on all kinds of criteria ΓΆ€” and as long as the criteria are applied equally (i.e. every "unidentifiable" picture is docked exactly one point) I think we can live with what's going on.
Sending purely "explanatory" PMs has never been prohibited; in this case I sent one (two, actually) myself, but only to point to the original, not to request (or expect) a score change, which could just as easily (and justifiably) be a deduction as a bonus point after the comparison has been made. |
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09/28/2013 12:45:16 PM · #46 |
Originally posted by PennyStreet:
If I could find 34 of the 41 originals you could too. It didn't take very long and it's all legal.
Anybody who is having trouble, may I point out that there is a search by image name Photos/Search (I suggest a filter for Challenge entries)
There is a search by profile name Community/Photographer Profiles (brings up profile.. look for pink DQs)
and you can type any image ID into the scroll bar at the top - go here //www.dpchallenge.com/image.php?IMAGE_ID=INSERT NUMBER |
Seriously. I do this for a living. I COULD have found all of them. But I refused to do so if the photographer didn't make it easy. But, I've already said that five times here haven't I? Clearly you don't wish to hear it, you seem to think that I should be expected to spend hours voting.
Nope. Sorry. I'll spend 10 to 30 minutes voting. MAX.
I also previously tried to spend some time leaving comments on my favorites and on my lowest votes.
That's it. Done with this conversation 100%.
Also 100% done with leaving comments on my low votes. Thank yourselves, you keep DPC a fair and friendly place, where honesty will always come second to the rules and nice comments, and no-one shall ever hear why they're getting those 1's 2's and 3's. You can always rationalize why someone should have voted different, you can always tell the voter it's their fault, but guess what, if your image missed the mark, it was YOUR fault, not mine.
As I said to someone who mentioned that there was no written requirement on the title, streets don't come with 'look both ways before crossing' signs everywhere but common sense tells us we should. The same should have been true of the titles here, common sense and courtesy should have compelled the entrants to give some method of locating the original outside of the use of the same title. period.
Cheers. |
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09/28/2013 12:55:31 PM · #47 |
Originally posted by GeneralE:
Let's all calm down before this gets out of hand ... this is a complicated situation because there was no easy mechanism for people to link to the photo they were re-creating, and for some people this is an important factor in computing their vote.
However, the real intent of the rules is to prevent photographers from soliciting a change in votes. For a voter to state that they'll vote down any photo for which they can't find the inspirational source image is not that unreasonable ΓΆ€” people vote images down based on all kinds of criteria ΓΆ€” and as long as the criteria are applied equally (i.e. every "unidentifiable" picture is docked exactly one point) I think we can live with what's going on.
Sending purely "explanatory" PMs has never been prohibited; in this case I sent one (two, actually) myself, but only to point to the original, not to request (or expect) a score change, which could just as easily (and justifiably) be a deduction as a bonus point after the comparison has been made. |
But for a voter to state publicly that he/she will change a score if they receive a PM in response to a comment they sent? Meaning they will then have full disclosure on whose image it is?
I think this is bending the rules too far. You are SC and I'm not so maybe my opinion doesn't matter but it's come up before how we should be discouraged from responding to comments until after rollover.
I spent ALOT of time on this challenge and then didn't enter (still kicking myself for that)... my point is that t took a lot of work to find a DQ that I could emulate. I have to assume that other entrants spent considerable effort on this as well. Sorry, but I feel the voters should be trying a bit harder to do their part. It wasn't really that hard to figure most of them out. |
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09/28/2013 12:59:21 PM · #48 |
The joke here is that the only time voting manipulation has arguably occurred here was when I was pressured into reversing all of my vote adjustments.
Just a fun thought. |
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09/28/2013 01:07:24 PM · #49 |
Originally posted by Cory:
The joke here is that the only time voting manipulation has arguably occurred here was when I was pressured into reversing all of my vote adjustments.
Just a fun thought. |
I don't read here where anybody pressured you into anything. You are making all your own decisions.
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09/28/2013 01:32:31 PM · #50 |
Originally posted by PennyStreet:
But for a voter to state publicly that he/she will change a score if they receive a PM in response to a comment they sent? Meaning they will then have full disclosure on whose image it is?
I think this is bending the rules too far. You are SC and I'm not so maybe my opinion doesn't matter but it's come up before how we should be discouraged from responding to comments until after rollover. |
I agree with you in most cases, but I am willing to "bend" a little more in this situation -- I don't expect it to set and trend or precedent.
At this point I think it best to trust Cory to vote fairly whether he knows the photographer or not. As I said, if the change is "standardized" -- that is, he voted on all the photos first but penalized all "unlinked" photos exactly one point, and then restored that one point (and nothing else) after receiving the link -- then I think it's fine. I don't think it would be fair to adjust the scores more than that. |
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