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05/07/2004 05:50:15 PM · #1 |
Ok so I've changed my mind more than most women do when dressing!
Am now sure there will be a 'D' in the name of my next camera.
Am new to dSLR's so have no 'baggage' to help sway me. Yesterday I placed an order for the D70 (dx kit) and today?, well, I reserved a 300D at the same shop (Jessops).
There was a Cannon rep in the shop and I enjoyed 30 mins playing with the 300D and the managers 10D. Maybe biased recommendations but they reckoned the cannon lenses were superior to the nikon?. I can get the 300D for £160 less than the D70 (with a scrunch bag thrown in). I like the feel of both cameras.
Anybody want to add their 2 cents? or help me by buying my A1?
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05/07/2004 06:03:09 PM · #2 |
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05/07/2004 06:06:28 PM · #3 |
I'd start by looking at several review sites first. Because it's slightly newer, the D70 is a smidge, and I'll emphasize *smidge* better than the 300 in a few small areas. That said, it's not really enough to sway me one way or the other. I got the D70 because I all ready had an investment in Nikon.
The arguments over lens superiorty can go on for years. Nikon users think Nikon is better, Canon users think Canon is better.:p. Now, with all that said I personally like the ergonimics of the Nikon better. I also liked the speed, the uber fast buffer, and last but not least I like Nikon glass better.
Go check out reviews on the types of lenses you will be using. There are several great sites that will give balanced reviews. Make sure to give the D70 equal play time in the store. Make the decision based on the information you can gather in the next week or so. It would suck to get the d300 and then decide you hate it. Vice versa with the D70.
So in the short run- Nikon rocks. :)
In the long run, both are solid cameras and either will do well for you. Take the time to make a good decision. This is a big investment.
Make sure you post some shots when you get your new camera!
--Clara
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05/07/2004 06:19:14 PM · #4 |
blemt is right, except Canon is better!
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05/07/2004 06:26:03 PM · #5 |
Well, since the 300D is older than the D70 I'd expect more users :) but then again it is 'tried and tested' by many.
Clara, I must agree with all you have said, thankyou. I have 16 hours to decide on the 300D if I want another 2.5% discount and am now thinking the saving of £160 will enable me to purchase a longer lens sooner rather than later.
I'd be happy to own either, maybe I'll sleep on it and toss a coin tomorrow?
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05/07/2004 06:39:14 PM · #6 |
Originally posted by Ecce Signum:
Well, since the 300D is older than the D70 I'd expect more users :) but then again it is 'tried and tested' by many.
Clara, I must agree with all you have said, thankyou. I have 16 hours to decide on the 300D if I want another 2.5% discount and am now thinking the saving of £160 will enable me to purchase a longer lens sooner rather than later.
I'd be happy to own either, maybe I'll sleep on it and toss a coin tomorrow? |
Bugs would probably have been worked out by now with the Canon...if there were any to begin with. Nikon has the moire and the back focus issues - no doubt they were blown out of proportion. But something to consider nonetheless.
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05/07/2004 06:41:52 PM · #7 |
Well I'm happy with my D70. I haven't encountered any moire or backfocus issues.
Just took this shot today, with the stock lens (18-70mm)
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05/07/2004 06:43:26 PM · #8 |
Originally posted by orussell:
Nikon has the moire and the back focus issues - no doubt they were blown out of proportion. But something to consider nonetheless. |
I haven't experienced either of these issues with my D70.
I personally would prefer to spend the extra money to get the added features of the D70. IMHO, if you spend less now, you just want to upgrade sooner, because of the locked down feature set of the 300D. Why not spend a little more to begin with and have a camera you can use longer? Just my 2 cents.
Edit: Comparison between D70, D100, 300D
Message edited by author 2004-05-07 18:48:50.
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05/07/2004 07:13:34 PM · #9 |
Given the comparison cbeller posted, and this "conclusion" text below, I'd buy the D70:
Overall conclusion
Shortly after Canon announced the EOS 300D (Digital Rebel) and it made its way into reviewers hands it was fairly clear that Canon were offering a formidable package at an excellent price which would be the mark for affordable digital SLR's of the future, with image quality almost identical to the EOS 10D and a sub-$1000 price it caused a significant ripple in the market. Now however it's clear that Nikon were well aware of this and had the D70 up their sleeve, a camera which is a significant step ahead of the EOS 300D in terms of build quality and feature set and a match, and in some instances better from an image quality point of view.
Nikon have achieved three major improvements with the D70 (compared to the competition / the D100): (1) They have improved the performance of the camera, with its instant on availability, very fast shutter release, superb continuous shooting and image processing speed and smart use of its buffer. (2) They have maintained build quality while still delivering a smaller and lighter camera, the D70 doesn't feel much less well built than the D100 but is lighter, it certainly feels much more like $1000 worth of camera than the EOS 300D could. (3) They have improved image sharpness and detail, while we could niggle about moiré the compromise between artifacts and sharpness is worth it, in many instances the D70 delivering more detail than our previous benchmark, the EOS 300D / EOS 10D CMOS sensor.
There's not much more for me to add other than I am very pleased to see Nikon stepping up with a quality camera which doesn't compromise on build quality, feature set or image quality and yet offers superb value for money. There's no risk involved in the D70's slightly higher price compared to the EOS 300D (Digital Rebel), it's absolutely worth it.
Highly Recommended
So which one should I buy? A question I get asked several times a day, and I wouldn't like to say. In a new addition to my reviews (after the amount of feedback I normally get) I've added a link to a specific forum in which you can discuss the review or ask me specific questions which I've not answered in these pages.
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05/07/2004 07:25:19 PM · #10 |
Chris, sounds like you got this from Steves digicams?
Now I'm swinging back to the D70. Oh, and I asked the Cannon rep to sell me the 300D rather than fulfill my order for the D70, his first words were "you should compare the D70 to the 10D not the 300D" makes you wonder?
Message edited by author 2004-05-07 19:26:22.
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05/07/2004 07:51:21 PM · #11 |
Originally posted by orussell:
Bugs would probably have been worked out by now with the Canon...if there were any to begin with. Nikon has the moire and the back focus issues - no doubt they were blown out of proportion. But something to consider nonetheless. |
*cough* backfocuswasalsoanallegedcanonproblem*
Ahem, sorry about that, frog in the throat. :)
Backfocus my tush. Sorry, but it's irritating to see people talking about the "backfocus" problem on this camera. The majority of BF problems come from people using the presets and not realizing that the camera is defaulting to closest object focusing. There is a small, and I mean small but vocal minority who are saying their camera has a BF problem. Many of these users are on their third, fourth, and in some cases fifth camera.
You wanna calculate the statistical odds of every camera having a bf problem? :)
Now the moire problem is present at the extreme ranges on some lenses. Nikon Capture clears the problem out well.
I personally consider the moire problem more significant than BF. Most indicators are that the BF problem clears up as users learn how use a dSLR autofocus system.
Ecce, again, read the reviews on both systems. The only issue noted in multiple reviews is the moire issue. So don't let the BF bandwagon scare you off. :)
--Clara
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05/07/2004 08:07:16 PM · #12 |
Originally posted by Ecce Signum:
Chris, sounds like you got this from Steves digicams? |
No, this was the conclusion section of the D70 review in the link that cbeller posted, on dpreview.com. If you haven't read the review on the D70 and 300D you should. Very extensive review. |
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05/07/2004 08:46:17 PM · #13 |
my buddy and i go out on the streets of new york every weekend. hes got the 300 i've got the 70. afterward, we set up the ole laptop and digital projector and beat the tar out of each other as to who's got the better camera :)
theres honestly no discernable difference.
even zooming in tightly in photoshop, both have pros and cons.
the nikon just looks better than ed's camera ;) |
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05/07/2004 09:46:26 PM · #14 |
 - 
Message edited by author 2004-05-07 21:47:19.
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05/07/2004 10:04:09 PM · #15 |
Originally posted by the-O-ster:
theres honestly no discernable difference.
even zooming in tightly in photoshop, both have pros and cons.
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Well said, which is why I find it so amusing when so many people INSIST their camera just has to be the best and anyone thinking otherwise is uninformed.
Best advise, which guided me, I saw somewhere was "if you already own Canon lenses go Canon, if Nikon lenses go Nikon".
The camera are so close, so very very close, that the difference in the end lies with the photographer.
There are truly AMAZING photos with each here alone.
I think the more valid debate is on lens quality, not just now but the future directions both companies are taking .... and I have no idea there which is taking the better path.
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05/07/2004 10:11:00 PM · #16 |
We can't split them... Technically the same. Look at the price tag and case closed.
Message edited by author 2004-05-07 22:12:30. |
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05/07/2004 10:24:40 PM · #17 |
| My daughter and husband have the D300 and I have the D70. They got theirs for Christmas and I just got the Nikon last month. I kept changing my mind too. I have had problem with Moire but the little feature in Paint Shop Pro takes care of that rather nicely. The moire was with the ISO at 200. Even with this bit of a problem I am happy with the camera. |
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05/07/2004 10:34:57 PM · #18 |
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05/07/2004 10:42:20 PM · #19 |
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05/07/2004 10:46:21 PM · #20 |
Originally posted by Pedro:
Get both. :) |
That would work. Then you can donate the Digital Rebel to charity. ;)
--Clara
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05/07/2004 11:56:58 PM · #21 |
Originally posted by BooZon:
We can't split them... Technically the same. Look at the price tag and case closed. |
Exactly...you get so much more with the D70 for the price. Glad somebody with a Rebel pointed that out. :-)
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05/08/2004 06:38:32 AM · #22 |
Get the 10D if you want the features of the d70 and the image quality of the 300D. ISO 100 which the nikon can`t match.
But at the end of the day it`s not what car you drive.
Message edited by author 2004-05-08 06:42:20. |
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05/08/2004 07:26:12 AM · #23 |
Have you considered the 4 colour option by going with a Sony / Carl Zeiss combination. I think that it is worth a look as i had the choice of the Rebel D70 and the F828. If it was an SLR I'de suggest going Contax or Nikon but it's digital and I believe that Sony are a front runner in digital technology, not always reflected by the price of an object or even the fact that you can change the lenses around. Why spend time swapping lenses when Sony supply a Carl Zeiss 28-200mm fully manual focasing (night focus and night shot) Macro lens that will give you all you need rather than lugging a box of lenses around...
Just an option. If you are determined to go for the Canon or Nikon then i personally feel that Canon make better lenses than Nikon and let's face it.. at the end of the day, the most important feature of a camera HAS to be the lens. That's why i went for the Sony..
hope My spanner in the works helps you out a bit. |
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05/08/2004 09:17:23 AM · #24 |
Most reviewers agree that the D70 is a better camera, but the differences aren't huge. In terms of photo quality, there's a bigger difference between cheap and pro lenses on either camera than between the cameras themselves. It probably comes down to whether you think this will be your last camera. If you're going to replace it in 2-3 years with a newer model anyway, then you might save $400 on the Rebel and put the difference towards lenses you can carry forward. You'd be locked into Canon in the future, but I doubt you'll regret it.
You can get the Digital Rebel with kit lens ($900 at JandR.com), a 28-105mm f/3.5-4.5 lens ($230 at B&H), and the highly regarded 50mm f/1.8 lens ($70 at B&H- and surprisingly in-stock) and still save $100 over the D70 (to be fair, the D70 comes with a better-rated kit lens). I know these aren't Canon L lenses, but they're a good starter suggestion. Good luck with your purchase. Either way, you're going to love it. |
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05/08/2004 09:32:32 AM · #25 |
Originally posted by marbo:
Get the 10D if you want the features of the d70 and the image quality of the 300D. ISO 100 which the nikon can`t match.
But at the end of the day it`s not what car you drive. |
I have yet to see where the 300D image quality is any better than the D70. If nothing else, they are on par with each other.
The D70 not having ISO100 isn't a big deal either. I have shot in bright daylight and don't notice a problem and don't have a noise issue.
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