Broke my body - should I break shutter too?

Samsung Galaxy S24, S24+, S24 Ultra

08/26/2011 09:55:25 PM · #1

So, in all my glorious foolishness I didn't worry about strapping my tripod on top of my camera and going for a bike ride...

Result: Bent rear body panel and broken top LCD.

Now, the good news is that my shutter button was already on the blink, and I was strongly considering having that repaired anyway.

The other thing is that I'm somewhere around 75k cycles on the shutter, that's dangerously close to MTF, so I'm wondering if I should break the shutter intentionally before I send it in - the repair is more or less a flat rate with a $100 variance, and I'm pretty sure I've already gotten towards the top end of that - so I think I want a new shutter while I'm at it - and since I doubt Canon will replace parts that are old but functional, I'm guessing that I'll have to make it malfunction - the question I really have is how do you think I'm best off breaking it to make it look like either I did something really dumb, or like it was a "natural" failure...

Thoughts?

Message edited by author 2011-08-26 21:56:15.

Bear_Music

Sony 24-70mm F4 Vario-Tessar T* FE OSS

08/26/2011 10:09:29 PM · #2

Geeze, Cory, where's yer ETHICS, man? Jejeje...

R.

Leica 18-56mm f/3.5-5.6 Vario Elmar-T ASPH

08/27/2011 02:44:32 AM · #3

Originally posted by Bear_Music:

Geeze, Cory, where's yer ETHICS, man? Jejeje...

R.

Right behind my sense of value... If I'm paying them to fix the thing, might as well give them something to fix... ;)

MAK

Leica CL

08/27/2011 03:33:01 AM · #4

Sorry to hear about this mate.. you could break it at the mirror flip up device it may look like the impact snapped it?

hahn23

Canon EOS-5D Mark IV

Canon EF 24-105mm f/4.0L IS II USM Lens

08/27/2011 04:36:33 AM · #5

This would be the first time Canon have encountered this sort of thing.

Skip

Canon EOS-1D X

Canon EF 300mm f/2.8L IS USM

08/27/2011 05:16:21 AM · #6

why don't you just put it in burst mode and sit on the shutter button until it stops taking pictures...seriously, just rack up 20,000 frames overnight for a few nights.

on the other hand, those MTF ratings are total BS. i've gotten double to triple that number on every canon i've owned, all the way back to 300D. right now if have over 475,000 on one of my mark IIn bodies...so it might take you more than a few nights to wear yours out ;-)

Qiki

Fujifilm X100T

Pentax DA 70mm f/2.4 Limited

08/27/2011 05:27:05 AM · #7

I'm confused. Why do you feel the need to act fraudulently? If you're paying for the repair, surely they'll replace whatever parts you ask them to replace. Am I missing something here?

tfarrell23

Sony DSC-F828

08/27/2011 05:49:42 AM · #8

Originally posted by Qiki:

I'm confused. Why do you feel the need to act fraudulently? If you're paying for the repair, surely they'll replace whatever parts you ask them to replace....

+1

Message edited by author 2011-08-27 05:50:33.

kenskid

Nikon D700

Nikon AF-S NIKKOR 24-70mm f/2.8G ED

08/27/2011 09:13:36 AM · #9

Since you already posted that you may commit fraud....if you decide to go ahead with it, make sure you don't use the US Postal Service !

dswann

Nikon D7000

Nikon AF-S DX Zoom-Nikkor 18-70mm f/3.5-4.5G IF-ED

08/27/2011 10:32:53 AM · #10

If it's not a warrenty repair, I would just inquire about the cost to replace the shutter also while they had it apart. You may find that the incremental cost to replace the shutter is very reasonable.

The MTF are just conservative averages. Like Skip said, you are likely to get significantly more than the published value, so it's probably nothing to worry about now. (Of course, some unlucky people will get less, so its a roll of the dice)

Pentax DA 70mm f/2.4 Limited

08/27/2011 11:12:50 AM · #11

First, it's not fraud, I'm quite within my rights to break my own things and pay to have them fixed. You really should learn a little more about the law before you start accusing people of committing fraud.

Secondly- I don't think the repair shop repairs whatever you'd like regardless of condition. Figure I'll just rip it up and say nothing, as I really don't want to lie and I don't want to sit around hammering on the shutter.

Qiki

Fujifilm X100T

08/27/2011 11:23:50 AM · #12

Sorry mate but I'm still confused. What sort of repairer wouldn't replace a part you asked them to, provided you are happy to pay them to do so? It seems analagous to a mechanic refusing to replace a set of spark plugs when asked to.

Nikon AF-S NIKKOR 24-70mm f/2.8G ED

08/27/2011 11:29:14 AM · #13

Originally posted by Qiki:

I guess the difference is faith. I would prefer to ensure that they replace the unit instead of hoping they do. And in this economy I wouldn't at all be surprised if they have been told to do no preventative maintenece, cost savings and all. Keep in mind Canon has what amounts to an almost flat rate for repairs, so it's very much in their interest to let it break again soon and have me send it in for another repair.

kenskid

Nikon D700

08/27/2011 11:34:07 AM · #14

First off....I said MAY COMMIT FRAUD. That means I DON'T KNOW FOR SURE.

Second - there is another post that said "Why do you feel the need to act fraudulently?" That is MORE of an accusation than MY post....why did you feel necessary to jump on me?

Third - I'd like to see your warranty or other insurance that says you can break your product on PURPOSE in order to get a new part that is getting close to it's natural end. My guess is that it doesn't say you can do that.

Fourth - By "break my own things and pay to have them fixed" How does that come into play? Does your papers say "even if you BREAK your shutter on purpose we will only charge you $100 and repair that part and all other parts...so go ahead and hammer away?"

My advice now is GO FOR IT....Break the shutter and send it in. Why did you post the question? You asked if you should do this and myself and another member said it sounds like fraud. I said Don't use the post office because of ambiguous mail fraud laws.

My guess is that you WON'T break the shutter on purpose. Why? Because two members felt you may be breaking the law along with your shutter.

On that note...let's see how long it takes you to attack the other member that asked about fraudulent activity.

Originally posted by Cory:

Message edited by author 2011-08-27 11:39:32.

Pentax DA 70mm f/2.4 Limited

08/27/2011 11:44:29 AM · #15

Originally posted by kenskid:

First off....I said MAY COMMIT FRAUD. That means I DON'T KNOW FOR SURE.

Second - there is another post that said "Why do you feel the need to act fraudulently?" That is MORE of an accusation than MY post....why did you feel necessary to jump on me?

Third - I'd like to see your warranty or other insurance that says you can break your product on PURPOSE in order to get a new part that is getting close to it's natural end. My guess is that it doesn't say you can do that.

Fourth - By "break my own things and pay to have them fixed" How does that come into play? Does your papers say "even if you BREAK your shutter on purpose we will only charge you $100 and repair that part and all other parts...so go ahead and hammer away?

My advice now is GO FOR IT....Break the shutter and send it in. Why did you post the question? You asked if you should do this and myself and another member said it sounds like fraud. I said Don't use the post office because of ambiguous mail fraud laws.

My guess is that you WON'T break the shutter on purpose. Why? Because two members felt you may be breaking the law along with your shutter.

On that note...let's see how long it takes you to attack the other member that asked about fraudulent activity.

Originally posted by Cory:
First, it's not fraud, I'm quite within my rights to break my own things and pay to have them fixed. You really should learn a little more about the law before you start accusing people of committing fraud.

Secondly- I don't think the repair shop repairs whatever you'd like regardless of condition. Figure I'll just rip it up and say nothing, as I really don't want to lie and I don't want to sit around hammering on the shutter.

Qiki

Fujifilm X100T

08/27/2011 11:51:58 AM · #16

Originally posted by Cory:

Originally posted by Qiki:
Sorry mate but I'm still confused. What sort of repairer wouldn't replace a part you asked them to, provided you are happy to pay them to do so? It seems analagous to a mechanic refusing to replace a set of spark plugs when asked to.

I guess the difference is faith. I would prefer to ensure that they replace the unit instead of hoping they do. And in this economy I wouldn't at all be surprised if they have been told to do no preventative maintenece, cost savings and all. Keep in mind Canon has what amounts to an almost flat rate for repairs, so it's very much in their interest to let it break again soon and have me send it in for another repair.

OK, now I see where you are coming from. I had assumed (as had others it seems) from your initial post that you had some sort of accidental damage cover and were trying to convince the repairer that the shutter damage had been caused by the same accident that caused the other breakages. I have to say tho, that if I had as little faith in a repairer as you seem to have in Canon, then I'd be looking for another service company. Surely there has to be other third party service providers who can do your repairs for you?

kenskid

Nikon D700

Nikon AF-S NIKKOR 24-70mm f/2.8G ED

08/27/2011 11:55:29 AM · #17

Nah...didn't say my name....sorry...

My "I do give a damn" advice" is to NOT break it on purpose. Send it with the legit damage and ask them about the shutter replacement and pay to have it fixed...if it makes price sense.

I'll have the beer after I finish cutting this Louisiana grass in the 100 degree heat !

Kskid

Originally posted by Cory:

Man, chill out.

Take a look at my post, did I say your name?

And what is granted in the warranty makes no difference since this isn't a warranty repair.

Please be clear on this: I've attacked no one, but you keep up the hysterical behavior and I will get annoyed enough with you to directly tell you off.

Now, go have a beer or something and relax- clearly you need it.

Originally posted by kenskid:
First off....I said MAY COMMIT FRAUD. That means I DON'T KNOW FOR SURE.

Second - there is another post that said "Why do you feel the need to act fraudulently?" That is MORE of an accusation than MY post....why did you feel necessary to jump on me?

Third - I'd like to see your warranty or other insurance that says you can break your product on PURPOSE in order to get a new part that is getting close to it's natural end. My guess is that it doesn't say you can do that.

Fourth - By "break my own things and pay to have them fixed" How does that come into play? Does your papers say "even if you BREAK your shutter on purpose we will only charge you $100 and repair that part and all other parts...so go ahead and hammer away?

My advice now is GO FOR IT....Break the shutter and send it in. Why did you post the question? You asked if you should do this and myself and another member said it sounds like fraud. I said Don't use the post office because of ambiguous mail fraud laws.

My guess is that you WON'T break the shutter on purpose. Why? Because two members felt you may be breaking the law along with your shutter.

On that note...let's see how long it takes you to attack the other member that asked about fraudulent activity.

Originally posted by Cory:
First, it's not fraud, I'm quite within my rights to break my own things and pay to have them fixed. You really should learn a little more about the law before you start accusing people of committing fraud.

Secondly- I don't think the repair shop repairs whatever you'd like regardless of condition. Figure I'll just rip it up and say nothing, as I really don't want to lie and I don't want to sit around hammering on the shutter.

Message edited by author 2011-08-27 11:56:47.

08/27/2011 11:57:55 AM · #18

Originally posted by Qiki:

Originally posted by Cory:

Originally posted by Qiki:
Sorry mate but I'm still confused. What sort of repairer wouldn't replace a part you asked them to, provided you are happy to pay them to do so? It seems analagous to a mechanic refusing to replace a set of spark plugs when asked to.

I guess the difference is faith. I would prefer to ensure that they replace the unit instead of hoping they do. And in this economy I wouldn't at all be surprised if they have been told to do no preventative maintenece, cost savings and all. Keep in mind Canon has what amounts to an almost flat rate for repairs, so it's very much in their interest to let it break again soon and have me send it in for another repair.

OK, now I see where you are coming from. I had assumed (as had others it seems) from your initial post that you had some sort of accidental damage cover and were trying to convince the repairer that the shutter damage had been caused by the same accident that caused the other breakages. I have to say tho, that if I had as little faith in a repairer as you seem to have in Canon, then I'd be looking for another service company. Surely there has to be other third party service providers who can do your repairs for you?

Hehe, good advice for sure, but I trust them far less than Canon.

I actually expect Canon to do an excellent repair job, they've always fixed my stuff very well - I just also understand how a business thinks and works - and anything that can save costs and generate future revenues is preferred over other choices.

And I've got no accidental coverage or anything of the sort - this is a full-on out of my pocket repair, no warranty or anything of the sort - My major concern is that the repairer may think I hate my gear and do a shoddy repair because of that.. (kinda like how I always take my car to the shop very clean, so they'll know that I value it and hopefully value it a little more themselves.)

Message edited by author 2011-08-27 12:03:32.

Lytro Illum Light Field Digital

08/27/2011 12:02:40 PM · #19

Originally posted by kenskid:

It's cool man.

I would be VERY interested to hear from anyone who's tried this tactic.

Has anyone here asked Canon to replace a non-broken part? Were you successful?

yakatme

Nikon AF-S Nikkor 17-35mm f/2.8D IF-ED

08/27/2011 12:03:41 PM · #20

Cory, off topic a little regarding breaking it on purpose...Southern Photo Technical Service here in Miami is a great repair shop that I've taken my cameras to several times. They are on NW 163rd Street just east of I-95. They are good and fast although a tad bit pricey.

08/27/2011 12:10:05 PM · #21

Originally posted by Bear_Music:

Geeze, Cory, where's yer ETHICS, man? Jejeje...

R.

In light of the subsequent comments, I think I should actually be serious and address this quickly.

I studied ethics in college and do understand the finer points of ethical decision making, under multiple systems of ethics.

Long before I posted here I considered the ethics of the situation, and here was my conclusion:

Canon will repair whatever is broken at a given rate - they really don't care how it was broken, only that it needs fixed.

This is a paid repair, not warranty.

No-one is harmed in any way by my actions.

Canon may benefit slightly as they will be able to go all the way to the top of the repair price scale, perhaps pocketing another $30 or $40, while replacing a part that costs a few dollars and takes a few minutes of a techs time - with a profit of probably $10-$20.

The one pitfall here could be lying, which is, by my system of ethics, wrong - but my intention is not to lie, it is simply to avoid questions or the implication that I don't care about my gear, which could affect the quality of my repair.

All of that considered, I see absolutely no ethical dilemma.

Message edited by author 2011-08-27 12:10:35.