|
| Author | Thread |
|
|
01/03/2011 10:42:09 PM · #101 |
Hmmm wonder how many of these accounts are legit....
Jeez Louise, calling someone unprofessional and then creating accounts just to say you KNOW someone would never act like that. Give me a break, probably the photog in question making these accounts. |
|
|
|
01/03/2011 10:45:59 PM · #102 |
By the way... Whoever it was that sent the rude, profanity-filled email to the other photographer should really be aware of how utterly stupid he sounds. Beside the fact that he (or she - can't tell) can't express himself in any way other than using profanity (the English language is far too broad to have to resort to profanity), his grammar is improper and he sounds like a complete idiot.
I'm sure there are many elementary schools willing to provide refresher courses to people like him (her). |
|
|
|
01/03/2011 10:49:39 PM · #103 |
When one fabricates, as the author of this thread did, to the extent that he did, friends will rise up to find the unjustified posting and respond.
|
|
|
|
01/03/2011 11:15:36 PM · #104 |
Just to make things clear before someone goes and starts commenting more on why new users are popping up in this thread, I am the son of the aforementioned photographer who is the apparent subject of this thread, so obviously I am biased in that fashion. I enjoy photography, but am far from good at it and at this point it is not a serious hobby of mine. As such, I made an account on this forum simply because the massive amount of slander bothered me to no end. In addition to that, the fact that people jumped on the authors side so fast is just a little bit absurd. It should be known by now the effect that online BS can have on someone's life, and that so many simply jumped on the flame boat is pathetic. I understand that at times it feels good to vent if something happened to you, but flat out insulting someone who you do not know, have never met, and know nothing about aside from what one person has told you says a lot.
That aside, the author of this thread disgusts me beyond belief. I read one of the emails that was sent to my father before coming to this site, and up until that point I had determined not to get involved. After all, nonsense is usually figured out without those not involved butting in. But after reading some of the hate mail that was sent, I really couldn't resist. My point in posting here, aside from the above, is to state that the guy I know is not the kind of person who would condescendingly "butt in" and start telling people what to do. He's not the kind of guy who bosses anyone around, nor does he ever act unprofessional in a public forum of any sort, especially not at a wedding. In my entire life, I have never seen him embarrass himself or anyone else publicly, and that's saying a lot. Furthermore, he is always open to critique of his work and frequents quite a few photography forums in order to better his own skills and work on his hobby. I am no professional with regards to photography, and I don't have the necessary experience to critique his work myself like others have done, but I can say that regardless how bad, average, good, or amazing the photography is, people have been happy with it.
PS: In response to the poster who suggested the new users here are the person in question, there are quite a few ways to determine if it's one person involved or many. Creating a forum conspiracy theory is fun and all, but is that really the reason you frequent this sort of discussion board? |
|
|
|
01/03/2011 11:17:52 PM · #105 |
Originally posted by RobertCockroachBlair:
I am disgusted. I was at that wedding. I watched your work. At no time were you encumbered by that other photographer. If you are that incompetent, you shouldn't take the gig. Your lies about his behavior disgust me. |
Cockroach, if I can call you that; you are out of line. Any shooter who is responsible for documenting an event has issues with guys like your friend. If your friend is a professional, as you say, then he knew how over the line it is to shoot a gig someone else has been hired with a flash and an umbrella. It is not done. Hobbyists are forgiven, Pros ought to know better. If you want to help out, you shoot with available light and with long glass, keep the main photographer's lines clear, and get what you can, but you never, never, take over the posing of the wedding party when the primary photographer is working even if you think the photographer who has been hired is not doing as good a job as you think you could do.
If the bride hired two photographers to shoot the main gig, then there is no clear right of way; but it sounds as if the second shooter offered to help out and felt that that gave him the same rights as the shooter who held the contract for the event. As you can see from the thread, this is a common issue, but if your friend is an experienced photographer, he ought to have known better.
Equally out of line; Plastering a photographer's web site with nasty notes because someone posted a story on a bulletin board.
"Remember, be nice. no matter where you go, there you are" B. Banzia
Message edited by author 2011-01-03 23:26:27. |
|
|
|
01/03/2011 11:25:38 PM · #106 |
Originally posted by Goodkat:
That aside, the author of this thread disgusts me beyond belief. I read one of the emails that was sent to my father before coming to this site, and up until that point I had determined not to get involved. After all, nonsense is usually figured out without those not involved butting in. But after reading some of the hate mail that was sent, I really couldn't resist. My point in posting here, aside from the above, is to state that the guy I know is not the kind of person who would condescendingly "butt in" and start telling people what to do. He's not the kind of guy who bosses anyone around, nor does he ever act unprofessional in a public forum of any sort, especially not at a wedding. In my entire life, I have never seen him embarrass himself or anyone else publicly, and that's saying a lot. Furthermore, he is always open to critique of his work and frequents quite a few photography forums in order to better his own skills and work on his hobby. I am no professional with regards to photography, and I don't have the necessary experience to critique his work myself like others have done, but I can say that regardless how bad, average, good, or amazing the photography is, people have been happy with it.
|
To address again why I felt that way, the other photographer never introduced himself or said "Hey I've been asked by the bride to shoot too, do you mind if I use my umbrella?" Infact when I first met him, I thought he was the minister, and when I asked him if he was he only said, "No I'm not.". That would have been a good time to introduce himself. When I was setting up lights, he used language such as, "Ohh you shouldn't do that." and "Thats not the way I'D do that". He never asked if I wanted his opinion, or even tried to be constructively suggestive. Phrases such as, "Do you think it might be goood to..." or "I've had good luck with...." go a lot better when you're trying to help.
Again, I have no beef with his skills, just his presentation of such, but as I said before, it was unprofessional of me to air them in public as I did. |
|
|
|
01/03/2011 11:31:34 PM · #107 |
I have been reading this thread with a mixture of fascination and horror. It's like a train wreck, you want to but can't look away. The only part I am actually HORRIFIED about is that someone from this site make have taken it upon themselves to contact the "interloping" photographer directly (a huge mistake of itself) but then allegedly subjected him to insulting language ("allegedly" simply because I did not read the email in question). While it may be a relief to vent in a thread such as this, contacting a third party with whom we have no other connection than the version of a colleague is beyond comprehensible. What were you thinking???!!!!
Message edited by author 2011-01-03 23:36:36. |
|
|
|
01/03/2011 11:35:09 PM · #108 |
Brennon, I accept your comments in the context that they were meant. I must tell you that the umbrella was only used outside the area in which the "main" photographer was working. Also, knowing Byron as many people do, he certainly would not intentionally interfere with any hired photographer's work. And, if the photographer, or helper, said anything to Byron to stop doing something, the man would stop doing it...period. He is just that type of person. He is considerate to a fault. So, if he was in error of protocol, a simple request would have gotten any response the maker of the remark would desire. Byron is also not critical of people, photographic equipment, or of even politicians. The remarks/comments attributed to Byron were total falsehoods. That is what made my blood boil.
Thank you, Brennon, for helping make the protocol issue clear to me.
Sincerely,
Bob |
|
|
|
01/03/2011 11:38:43 PM · #109 |
| This place is many different things but always entertaining... lol |
|
|
|
01/03/2011 11:40:38 PM · #110 |
Originally posted by RobertCockroachBlair:
Brennon, I accept your comments in the context that they were meant. I must tell you that the umbrella was only used outside the area in which the "main" photographer was working. Also, knowing Byron as many people do, he certainly would not intentionally interfere with any hired photographer's work. And, if the photographer, or helper, said anything to Byron to stop doing something, the man would stop doing it...period. He is just that type of person. He is considerate to a fault. So, if he was in error of protocol, a simple request would have gotten any response the maker of the remark would desire. Byron is also not critical of people, photographic equipment, or of even politicians. The remarks/comments attributed to Byron were total falsehoods. That is what made my blood boil.
Thank you, Brennon, for helping make the protocol issue clear to me.
Sincerely,
Bob |
I think your point is valid, I should have discussed it with him sooner than I did, that would have been the professional thing to do. I was extremely frustrated and confused by his actions, as well as it being very late(The wedding was from 10PM till roughly 3AM) and I made the choice to post to a peer group instead of letting it go as I should have. I appreciate that you wish to defend your friend, thats commendable, but is there anything else left to discuss here? Like I've said, if Byron would like to speak to me about it, he knows how to reach me... And I promise I'll do it professionally there as well. |
|
|
|
01/03/2011 11:55:40 PM · #111 |
Originally posted by RobertCockroachBlair:
So, if he was in error of protocol, a simple request would have gotten any response the maker of the remark would desire. |
I think this is the big take away form this whole issue. Good clear communication skills are essential when herding cats, or shooting an event. I do hope all this drama didn't impinge on the enjoyability of the event for the bride and groom.
It is a good idea when you arrive at an event to introduce yourself to the bride and groom and their parties, and ask who you ought to go to with concerns (like this), you don't want the bride bothered, but you ought to know who is the contact person, the planner, the best man, the brides mother; whoever it might be, clarity and planning make the little problems stay little. |
|
|
|
01/04/2011 12:20:40 AM · #112 |
Originally posted by MercyDillingham:
By the way... Whoever it was that sent the rude, profanity-filled email to the other photographer .... |
Please feel free to submit a ticket regarding any such email ... our TOS forbid that kind of communications, and I have no problem with extending that requirement to messages sent to people referred-to here, as well as actual members.
There seems to me to be a factual disagreement about the events, with the OP saying "he said/did this" and people who "know" the person saying "he'd never do that."
In most "hearings" more weight is given to first-hand testimony than to hearsay or mere opinion ... personally, I suspect that the actual events and conversations fell somewhere between the two versions we've heard here so far. |
|
|
|
01/04/2011 12:30:07 AM · #113 |
| Good thing this didn't happen during the wedding. |
|
|
|
01/04/2011 02:08:40 AM · #114 |
Originally posted by GeneralE:
Originally posted by MercyDillingham:
By the way... Whoever it was that sent the rude, profanity-filled email to the other photographer .... |
Please feel free to submit a ticket regarding any such email ... |
Or better yet, post the emails here with email addresses! DPCLeaks! We will burn villages! :D
Seriously, dpcers on occasion go bat-sh*t crazy...
|
|
|
|
01/04/2011 02:45:57 AM · #115 |
Originally posted by jdannels:
Originally posted by GeneralE:
Originally posted by MercyDillingham:
By the way... Whoever it was that sent the rude, profanity-filled email to the other photographer .... |
Please feel free to submit a ticket regarding any such email ... |
Or better yet, post the emails here with email addresses! DPCLeaks! We will burn villages! :D
Seriously, dpcers on occasion go bat-sh*t crazy... |
well i mean cmon, this is a site of some 90,000 users! every community has wingnuts.
And also, while I understand Generals sentiment, I don't think it makes sense to apply this sites TOS to what users do on another site.
Message edited by author 2011-01-04 02:46:50. |
|
|
|
01/04/2011 04:33:55 AM · #116 |
Does anyone have the feeling this thread kind of backfired?
This thread alone is worth my renewal fee!! |
|
|
|
01/04/2011 05:39:27 AM · #117 |
So to clarify, how much of the original post is true?
Did he give you a card and tell you to give him a call when you was ready for an apprenticeship? (in the OPs words) - what did he (or didnt he) say?
I think we are all invested in this thread now and NEED SOME ANSWERS!!
And this part
"I'm actually fairly certain he was NOT trying to be helpful. He was being very condescending.
He was making snide comments most of the time. For example, my radio triggers failed part way through the portraits and I switched to cables. He said that 'no professional would EVER bother with cables.' That's when I finally started to loose some cool and replied back that real professionals always have a backup plan, and that I could have used my optical triggers if he'd stop flashing his light all over the place.
I think part of it was that he has older and felt that automatically made him more experienced.
He also had the audacity to hand me a business card and tell me to call him when I was ready for an apprenticeship."
True?
Message edited by author 2011-01-04 05:44:22. |
|
|
|
01/04/2011 07:54:05 AM · #118 |
Originally posted by RobertCockroachBlair:
It is if you are a pirate LOL |
Cool!...Wait a minute...What? |
|
|
|
01/04/2011 07:58:48 AM · #119 |
Originally posted by punk_kaos:
That's when I finally started to loose some cool |
Sometimes, I like to put on some tight pants, a fishnet t-shirt and go down to the club to let loose some cool myself! Nothing to be ashamed about. |
|
|
|
01/04/2011 09:01:39 AM · #120 |
Note to anyone ranting in the future. DO NOT post any way to contact the person you are ranting against. Someone will take it as an invitation to be a white knight and harass them.
It happens in every forum where something like this happens.
To the people who have just registered here to defend your friend, this thread is nowhere near as nasty as it could have gone. I've seen far, far worse flaming. You've got his back, but that doesn't mean that he was completely in the right either. Everyone sees what they want to see when friends/relatives are involved.
|
|
|
|
01/04/2011 09:38:38 AM · #121 |
Welcome RobertCockroachBlair, MercyDillingham and Goodkat. DPC is a friendly place, as we like to say about ourselves.
To the rest of DPC, I don't really want to know who on this site sent hate mail to the (allegedly) intrusive photographer, but really, what were you thinking?
|
|
|
|
01/04/2011 10:53:57 AM · #122 |
Originally posted by smardaz:
Originally posted by punk_kaos:
That's when I finally started to loose some cool |
Sometimes, I like to put on some tight pants, a fishnet t-shirt and go down to the club to let loose some cool myself! Nothing to be ashamed about. |
Whoops, way to go spelling! (Thanks smardaz this thread needed to lighten up...) |
|
|
|
01/04/2011 11:42:14 AM · #123 |
Where are Art and Slippy when you need them?
ahhh.... this reminds me of the good old days. |
|
|
|
01/04/2011 12:05:09 PM · #124 |
Originally posted by BrennanOB:
Originally posted by RobertCockroachBlair:
I am disgusted. I was at that wedding. I watched your work. At no time were you encumbered by that other photographer. If you are that incompetent, you shouldn't take the gig. Your lies about his behavior disgust me. |
Cockroach, if I can call you that; you are out of line. Any shooter who is responsible for documenting an event has issues with guys like your friend. If your friend is a professional, as you say, then he knew how over the line it is to shoot a gig someone else has been hired with a flash and an umbrella. It is not done. Hobbyists are forgiven, Pros ought to know better. If you want to help out, you shoot with available light and with long glass, keep the main photographer's lines clear, and get what you can, but you never, never, take over the posing of the wedding party when the primary photographer is working even if you think the photographer who has been hired is not doing as good a job as you think you could do.
If the bride hired two photographers to shoot the main gig, then there is no clear right of way; but it sounds as if the second shooter offered to help out and felt that that gave him the same rights as the shooter who held the contract for the event. As you can see from the thread, this is a common issue, but if your friend is an experienced photographer, he ought to have known better.
Equally out of line; Plastering a photographer's web site with nasty notes because someone posted a story on a bulletin board.
"Remember, be nice. no matter where you go, there you are" B. Banzia |
yes, yes, and yes.... |
|
|
|
01/04/2011 12:48:54 PM · #125 |
The bride asked Byron to be there and shoot pictures. It was, admittedly, on my suggestion that she contact him since she was sincerely concerned with expencses. Byron was, indeed, the friend of the Mad of Honor. I know them both. I've known Byron for several years. I will testify to his professionalism from MANY encounters with him. I am a professional pirate performer and the subject of many photographers (I guess we're colorful characters by nature and attract photograpers as flowers attract bees LOL ). I also got to know Byron on a personal basis. He is no "rude" or "inappropriate" person.....not in the least. I've watched him work. He worked his magic at our wedding two months ago. He is a worthy person who does not deserve the ridiculous lies that were slanderously spewed by the author of the thread. He was not only requested to be there, he was asked to shoot the wedding for free....which he delicately declined with all the understanding and grace that I have come to admire in Byron. Again, it was at my suggestion that he be contacted by the bride. The assistant to the eventually hired from Craiglist photographer, slandered Byron and lied to the hired photographer about what Byron might have said. Note: I was there...also, I've known Byron for quite some time on two levels. If, indeed, Byron was crossing some arbitrary established secret photographer's code of ethics by using an umbrella to difuse the flash in an environment that seems to have called for, such a matter could have been addressed easily and without issue by the parties involved. No such conversation took place. That is the problem. The person "in charge" of the photographic record of the wedding chose not to deal with the "problem". Instead, he slandered Byron on this posting board and incited the lunitic fringe to go to Byron's website and attack him there. Sadly, a man who is gentle in nature and sincere in his emotional posture, was indeed, attacked and further dragged through the mud and sludge that apparently is the fruit of the people who read this posting board. I found that unbearable and could not stand by and see a man of Byron's character and gentle nature slandered and attacked by such filth. That is the motivation for me to come here. I am not a photographic professional and am unaware of some of the protocols of the trade. That is why I thanked Brennan for pointing out the issue to me without the flame of antagonistic ferver. I am sincere in thanking him for his education and his beneficial position.
What I find sad is that 1) the author was chicken shit enough to not directly, and appropriately, address the issue with Byron; and 2)That people accepted the lies as truth so easily and readily without any shred of challenge or reasonable question to the truthfullness of the slanderous statements made about Byron.
So, yes, I am a registered member of this board.
Also, I am more than real...I'm a consumer. I am also an advocate, participant, and publicist of many public events that hire (or purchace) photographic works by freelance people. I am certain that people that I know will think four or five times before hiring anyone who supported the author's lies and slanderous behavior towards a person of proven integrity and ethics.
|
|
|
|
Current Server Time: 08/26/2025 07:49:49 PM  |
Home -
Challenges -
Community -
League -
Photos -
Cameras -
Lenses -
Learn -
Help -
Terms of Use -
Privacy -
Top ^
DPChallenge, and website content and design, Copyright © 2001-2025 Challenging Technologies, LLC.
All digital photo copyrights belong to the photographers and may not be used without permission.
Current Server Time: 08/26/2025 07:49:49 PM EDT.
|
