Entered a challenge? Then vote in that challenge!

10/07/2010 04:40:57 AM · #1

I've read some chatter about how slow voting has been in challenges recently. In particular the latest FS for September, that has received 293 submissions. I'm sure those who entered are hoping for as many votes as possible to gage how well their shot has been received. My shot, with less than 20 hours of voting left, has received just 105 votes. Thatâ��s well less than half of those that had entered! I donâ��t believe I have ever not voted 100% in challenges I have a photo in. Notice my voting total verses my received vote total:

Challenges Entered: 44
Votes Cast: 18,196
Avg Vote Cast: 6.1537
Votes Received: 6,752
Avg Vote Received: 5.2087

What Iâ��m proposing is that if you have entered in a challenge to take the time to vote on those that have also entered. Voting, I feel, is more important overall than comments that say â��Wow! Great shot! Not voting but if I was this would be a 10!â�� Actually, I would still like a comment like that :-)

For me itâ��s disappointing to vote on 1,000â��s of photos to only receive a significantly smaller amount in return. I may be missing something as to why people arenâ��t voting so please feel free to discuss as to why we should / shouldnâ��t be voting in challenges we have entered...

Editted for fat fingers...

Message edited by author 2010-10-07 04:42:55.

bobonacus

Canon EF-S 17-55mm f/2.8 IS USM

10/07/2010 04:52:50 AM · #2

I find I'm voting much more than entering at the moment but I go through phases. I don't feel I get as much from the site as I used to entering but I still enjoy seeing the entries and seeing how people have different ideas for the challenges. It is a time thing though, especially in free study as I'll only start voting if I know I can go through them all without just doing the 1 second vote on each

10/07/2010 05:07:17 AM · #3

Originally posted by bobonacus:

I appreciate your reasoning and wanting to give each photo the attention it deserves. When I get the time I love to examine each photo in detail and give in-depth comments on those that really move me (good or bad). Sometimes there is only enough time for the quick glance and voting on that initial impact the photo provides. I'm sure the recipient appreciates that more than not getting any vote (despite what they may say in the forums). I personally don't believe in Trolls (the athiest in me) but that my photo didn't have what it takes to interest someone with only one second to vote. Most of my photos are like that but those that ribbon usually appeals to most votes, quick and slow.

Message edited by author 2010-10-07 05:08:36.

tome

Canon EF 24-70mm f/2.8L USM

10/07/2010 05:52:59 AM · #4

I agree. Actually I'm one of them and I'm trying to correct my behavior. :)
On the other hand, this is what I'm noticing in my stats on almost every photo (ok, I know there aren't many yet and I'm not scoring really high, but still):

Avg (all users): 5.9543
Avg (commenters): 7.3333
Avg (participants): 5.6364
Avg (non-participants): 6.0343

Participants are particularly unhappy. Do I really want them to vote? :) Is it the same for your photos?

Nikon AF-S Zoom-Nikkor 28-70mm f/2.8D IF-ED

10/07/2010 06:03:31 AM · #5

Originally posted by tome:

I believe participants will always judge harder than others as they know the effort and inspiration devoted to produce the shot. Also, there would be a tendancy to vote in relation to the score they are receiving, that is, if they are receiving an average of 5.5xxx they may vote lower for all those that they believe are not as good as their own. I try very hard (thought probably not that well) to avoid this bias. At first I used to vote as soon as possible and try and not look at my own score until I've finished. I now feel I can seperate my emotion from my own score from how I vote. But for some this is not easy and this is probably the main reason for the discrepancy.

By the way, that everage score of yours is pretty awsome!

ETA
Yes, you want them to vote! A score of 7.3333 at the end with only a dozen votes is not as good as 5.9543 after being judged by hundreds of voters IMO

Message edited by author 2010-10-07 06:07:00.

VitaminB

Nikon D800

10/07/2010 06:19:13 AM · #6

I set it as my goal to reach 20,000 votes cast this year alone, and should reach it by the end of the month (ive only missed 2.5 challenges year). I think I will make it a side challenge next year.... 20K + votes.

Canon EF 28-80mm f/3.5-5.6 II

10/07/2010 06:28:13 AM · #7

Originally posted by VitaminB:

That is bloody brilliant! It's taken me 18 months to +18k and I thought that was good. I'll be in that side challenge for 2011. Can anybody beat this??

dtremain

Canon EOS 80D

10/07/2010 07:28:27 AM · #8

Participation in dpchallenge is voluntary, and very loosely defined. While it is frustrating at times, it works (mostly). For those who barely have enough time to get a shot in, and don't have hours to vote, they can participate. For those who are very serious, and want to learn, they can participate. For those who are uncomfortable voting in a challenge they have entered, they can participate. For those who have no trouble voting on anything, they can participate.
For me, I'm just glad there is a site where I can participate, regardless of my talent, skill, time availability, etc. There are great people here - why? Because they can participate at a level that is doable and comfortable for them.
There is no "should" - only "do"!

bohemka

Nikon D700

Sigma 12-24mm f/4.5-5.6 EX Aspherical DG HSM for Nikon

10/07/2010 07:51:23 AM · #9

I prefer to not have my average vote given to average vote received ratio enter my head at all. I try to comment on as many as I can in the challenges that I enter, but I do not score them. I just find it more enjoyable that way.

FrankRobinson

Canon EOS-50D

Canon EF-S 17-55mm f/2.8 IS USM

10/07/2010 09:20:35 AM · #10

Personally I decided some time ago specifically not to vote in challenges in which I am entered. I am quite competitve by nature and I just don't think it is a good idea for me. On the other hand, I completely see where you are coming from, and I have decided to try and give back by joining the critique club instead, where my competitive hackles are not raised! ;o)

I do have a suspicion that I am not the only competitive one out there - the disparity between participant score and non-participant score normally shows on my photos too, with up to a whole point of difference between the two. I have to put a lot of this down to participants treating other shots more harshly because their own are suffering - which is, of course, self perpetuating!

hahn23

Canon EOS-5D Mark IV

Canon EF 24-105mm f/4.0L IS II USM Lens

10/07/2010 10:24:29 AM · #11

The more votes the better, as long as they are not ghost accounts, which I'm sure Admin and SC are closely monitoring.

My record:
Votes Cast: 62,529
Votes Received: 66,509

My voting deficit is something I'm endeavoring to correct. I strongly believe we should give back more votes than we receive. I'll get there by the end of the year. I almost always vote 100% in each challenge. I object to the rule allowing votes to count when only voting 20% of a challenge, but I understand the reason. Voters' ability to cherry pick vote on images based on review of thumbnails is problematic. (Uh, I don't expect this situation to change, as it's been written in stone since the beginning of DPC time.)

The stats on my profile page are cumulative back to my date of registration at the site. Over 4.5 years, my average score cast and rec'd have changed. Fine to show the cumulative grand total, but the most recent 12 months data would be more meaningful. And, finally, the average vote stats conceal a lot of range detail. I'd prefer to see column charts showing the distribution of votes.... both cast and rec'd. (Not holding my breath waiting for a change, but these things seem to fit the topic.)

Yo_Spiff

Olympus OM-D E-M5 Mark III

Olympus 12-100mm f/4.0 M.Zuiko ED IS PRO

10/07/2010 12:26:45 PM · #12

Some people have a policy of not voting in anything they are entered in, as they feel it biases them. I prefer voting when I am entered, as I have interest in seeing others take on the topic. I only feel biased if I have given pre-challenge feedback on an entry, so I skip those.

I've voted 34% of the freestudy. I'll do some more if I have time before rollover.

VitaminB

Nikon D800

Nikon AF-S Zoom-Nikkor 28-70mm f/2.8D IF-ED

10/08/2010 09:22:58 PM · #13

Originally posted by Abra:

Originally posted by VitaminB:
I set it as my goal to reach 20,000 votes cast this year alone, and should reach it by the end of the month (ive only missed 2.5 challenges year). I think I will make it a side challenge next year.... 20K + votes.

That is bloody brilliant! It's taken me 18 months to +18k and I thought that was good. I'll be in that side challenge for 2011. Can anybody beat this??

Thanks

Im sure many can beat this though. I have missed the odd challenge, but I imagine there are some that have never missed a challenge in years. I can imagine that

alanfreed doesnt miss much
Top 50 Vote givers

It will take me two more years at 20K+ per year to crack that list.

Jon_H

Pentax DA 16-45mm f/4.0 ED AL AF

12/07/2010 12:39:06 PM · #14

Having read this thread i still dont accept that out of 246 entrants to the November FS the average number of votes received for the participants is currently just about scraping 100.

The arguements for not voting because "im competitive" do not wash as i would certainly fall into the competitive category but the best photos will still get the best marks etc.

"Im too busy" should not be an excuse as we all have a full week to vote, if you are going to enter surely you will view the competition and if you are doing that then you have the time to vote.

If you enter you should give something back to the others who have took the time to enter and vote, after all without the votes we dont know how we are doing.

alohadave

Pentax K-5

12/07/2010 03:34:51 PM · #15

Originally posted by Abra:

[quote=tome]I believe participants will always judge harder than others as they know the effort and inspiration devoted to produce the shot. Also, there would be a tendancy to vote in relation to the score they are receiving, that is, if they are receiving an average of 5.5xxx they may vote lower for all those that they believe are not as good as their own. I try very hard (thought probably not that well) to avoid this bias. At first I used to vote as soon as possible and try and not look at my own score until I've finished. I now feel I can seperate my emotion from my own score from how I vote. But for some this is not easy and this is probably the main reason for the discrepancy.

I don't judge any differently whether I'm entered or not, and I'm not obsessive about my score. If you try to judge other entries based on your scores, then you are letting someone else determine how you are going to vote.

I try to judge each entry on it's own merits, not on a scale of all the entries.

amsterdamman

Canon EOS-5D

Canon EF 70-200mm f/2.8L IS USM

12/07/2010 03:59:48 PM · #16

Hi guys, I'm still new to DPC and so have recently done the five stages of DP Scoring Grief.
Before you enter its all fun and games (average given:7.2)
Then you "try" (the first step to failure) BAM it starts...
1 Denial - There is no way my image is worth such a low score! (average given:5.9)
2 Anger - Those SOB's I'll show them how to score like a troll!! (average given:3.3)
3 Bargaining - Ok, I'll score yours as well as you score mine... (average given:4.4)
4 Depression - ugh! no matter what I do, they still crush me.. (average given:5.8)
5 Acceptance - I guess that subject was lame, I better work harder. Those are nice rocky Icelandic shores, Oh! Great wine Glasses!! (average given:6.7)

Jon_H

12/07/2010 05:01:49 PM · #17

Maybe a few extra rules as part of any challenge submission.

1, Vote on a minimum of 50% or submission is dqd.

2, Vote 1,2,or 3 and a valid comment should be left.

we can all say we are too busy etc, but we are all here to learn one way or another, voting and comments are what help us improve, are they not?

KristinaG