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DPChallenge Forums >> Tips, Tricks, and Q&A >> Need urgent flash help please! - The results...
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 10/20/2009 05:36:01 AM · #1
Hello hello!

This Friday I'm going to be photographing an event at the Royal Geographical Society (London) in a big lecture theatre with a stupidly high ceiling. It's quite dark in there and I've been lent a Canon Speedlite 430EX to help me out. I'll be getting photos of the speakers as they give their talks.

Now, I've never used a flash before (other than on-board) and I assumed I'd just plug it in a go... but looking at this thing now there are loads of settings on the back like zoom and stuff! It's been a long time since I've felt this much like a photographic n00b :P To make matters worse, the speakers (and a lot of the delegates) are professional nature photographers from the likes of Nat Geo etc. I really need to look at least slightly competent!

Does anyone have any beginner tips for using this flash effectively in this situation?

Thanks! :)

edit: The event I'm talking about is WildPhotos incase anyone is interested. There are still tickets available. I was there last year and its a fantastic event! I could be biased since I help organise it, but as a photographer it's incredibly interesting and inspirational.

Message edited by author 2009-10-20 05:38:07.
 10/20/2009 05:59:04 AM · #2
Hi mate,
ok, not sure about this particular model, but you should be able to just leave it in E-TTL and it will take care of itself.

However, if it is a high ceiling you may want to shoot with direct flash and the problem you have there is the images could end up a bit `snap shotty` if shooting on any of the auto-modes.

What you may want to do is

1. Leave the flash in E-TLL
2. Setup the camera in Manual mode - expose for the available light, you may want to under expose by a 1/3 of a stop or even 2/3, as long as some light bleeds through - don't be too scared to up the ISO - just make sure you keep those shutter at a decent speed.

This should allow you to shoot with direct flash without having black backgrounds - obviously I am not aware of what available light you will have, but this should produce some pleasing shots.. just watch you shutter speed doesn't drop too much.

What lens do you intend to use - a f2.8 would be hugely advisable if you can blag one for the evening.
 10/20/2009 06:10:28 AM · #3
Hi, thanks for that! Yeh I don't think there's any chance of bouncing off the ceiling, it's pretty high. There should be a spotlight on the speaker but last year it was a little bit off-target. There's a little flip-out bit on the top of the flash which I'm guessing is a diffuser I should use?

I think I'll be stuck with my own lens collection which unfortunately consists of mainly budget lenses...

Canon EF-S 18-55mm f/3.5-5.6 IS
Canon EF 28-105mm f/4-5.6 II USM
Canon EF 50mm f/1.8 II
Canon EF 50mm f/2.5 Macro
Canon EF 75-300mm f/4.0-5.6 II/III USM
Vivitar AF Zoom 19-35mm f/3.5-4.5 Series 1 for Canon EOS

I think I'll be able to get fairly close, but I don't want to be restricted to 50mm so I'll probably go for the 28-105. I don't think I'm going to get much of a chance to rehearse either :S Nothing like learning on the job :P
 10/20/2009 06:37:42 AM · #4
If you use your 28-105 you're going to be cranking your ISO really badly to get any sort of ambient light in there so I hope you're comfortable with high ISO performance or your noise reduction methods. Is there any way at all to get something faster? If it's dark like you say, F4 is going to be brutal if you want any sort of ambient light. That spotlight might be a big PITA too in terms of dynamic range and will be even worse if the operator's sloppy.
The flip out thing is indeed a diffuser and will make your lighting less glaring and more even but will lower your power a bit. Your drop in power shouldn't be an issue since you're only lighting one person at a moderate distance.
Don't forget to bring double the batteries you think you'll need.
 10/20/2009 07:17:39 AM · #5
You can also increase / decrease the power of the flash from the camera using flash compensation in the same way you can increase / decrease the exposure using exposure compensation. So if you are able to bounce the flash off the ceiling you may want to increase the flash power and if you are using direct flash for a bit of fill you can reduce the flash power and use more ambient light
 10/20/2009 07:26:22 AM · #6
That flip-out diffuser, at least on my 580, gives wide-angle coverage down to (I think) 14mm. It will shorten the effective range of the flash.
 10/20/2009 08:02:33 AM · #7
If your can get your hands on a Gary Fong LIghtsphere I would recommend that. I would suggest the clear dome as this will spread the light around the room. Or your best option: rent a 580ex II keep that on board and place the 430 on a stand near the speaker and point it upwards (if you get a Gary fong put it on the 430). Read the instructions on how to set up the master and slave adn you should be good. ANd you will look like a pro.

At this point I would get there early and try setting everything on ETTL, then make adjustments if you have to. Carry lots of batteries!

Good luck


Message edited by author 2009-10-20 08:06:41.
 10/20/2009 08:32:52 AM · #8
Originally posted by Konador:
Hi, thanks for that! Yeh I don't think there's any chance of bouncing off the ceiling, it's pretty high. There should be a spotlight on the speaker but last year it was a little bit off-target. There's a little flip-out bit on the top of the flash which I'm guessing is a diffuser I should use?

I think I'll be stuck with my own lens collection which unfortunately consists of mainly budget lenses...

Canon EF-S 18-55mm f/3.5-5.6 IS
Canon EF 28-105mm f/4-5.6 II USM
Canon EF 50mm f/1.8 II
Canon EF 50mm f/2.5 Macro
Canon EF 75-300mm f/4.0-5.6 II/III USM
Vivitar AF Zoom 19-35mm f/3.5-4.5 Series 1 for Canon EOS

I think I'll be able to get fairly close, but I don't want to be restricted to 50mm so I'll probably go for the 28-105. I don't think I'm going to get much of a chance to rehearse either :S Nothing like learning on the job :P


Ben,
If you can get to Essex you can borrow a 24-70 f2.8 + Sigma 500 Super ETTL + Canon 550EX + stofen omnibounce - as long as I get it back the same evening/early next morning. If you could get around early enough I'll run you through some techniques.

Just re-read your thread and I shot a wedding at the RGS about 2 years ago - is the event going to be in the Map room? As I recall that is quite a bright room., it has high ceilings, but also white walls. It backs onto the Royal Albert Hall doesn't it?
 10/20/2009 10:17:45 AM · #9
Thanks everyone - I'll make sure I bring lots of spare batteries! A lightsphere did cross my mind but I'm not sure where I can get one at such short notice. I might look at the master/slave thing if I can get another flash, but I don't want to interfere with the speakers too much when they're on stage. They will have their photographs projected behind them so that might help with avoiding a black background and balancing out the exposure... These are some examples from last year, but they were taken by professional, not me!

Thanks for the very kind offer Mark. Unfortunately I don't think I'll be able to pick it up. I'm going up to London from Bristol with Wildscreen on Thursday to set everything up, and on Friday we start at 8am with a late finish. The event actually runs through until Saturday evening too where I'll need to be there to help out, but the main pictures I need to get are of Nick Nichols (www.michaelnicknichols.com) during his keynote presentation on Friday, and people mingling during the drinks reception in the evening.

We have exhibitions set up in the Map Room but the main event will be in the Ondaatje Theatre. You can see the Royal Albert Hall from the gardens :)
 10/26/2009 12:34:31 PM · #10
Thanks for the help everyone. I thought I'd post some images here with my results!

It was a great learning experience, not only due to the inspirational speakers, but learning 'on the job' about how to get the shots I needed.

I quickly decided I couldn't use the flash during the presentations because it completely wiped out the slides on the background. I played around with the settings and ended up using ISO1600 (Thank goodness for the fantastic high-iso performance of my new 500D!). Even at this ISO I was restricted to using my 50mm 1.8, but I think I managed to get a good variety of shots.

The conditions however, were darker than I'd anticipated, as you can see from this crowd shot and an early attempt at photographing Nat Geo photographer Kevin Schafer:


The awaiting audience


Kevin Schafer

The only chance I had of getting any decent photos was at the start and end of each presentation, when the house lights came up a little bit. I had to go and ask the AudioVisual guys to leave the lights on a bit longer at the start so I could fire a couple of shots off quickly.


Solvin Zankl


Vincent Munier

I also had a chance at the end of each talk during the Q&A sessions, with the compere Jonathan Scott on stage too.


Thomas P. Peschak


Karen Mitchell

Luckily the main keynote session was at the very end of the day, so I had plent of time for trial and error before! However, they gave the speaker, Nat Geo photographer Michael "Nick" Nichols, a clip-mic so he could walk around the stage. I didn't want to stand in everyone's way but I think I still got a few good shots with the 50mm.


Nick Nichols


Jonathan Scott and Nick Nichols

I used the bounced flash during the breaks and drinks reception to get photos of people mingling and talking, and it was very effective there with the lower ceilings. I ended up with a few shots with odd shadows from ceiling beams and the like, but overall I think it definitely helped. Another photographer took over from me on the Saturday, so I could relax a little more during those sessions which was nice! I have to send these "press shots" to the pro-photographers now, which is going to be scary! Let's hope they don't judge me too harshly :P
 10/26/2009 12:40:26 PM · #11
Nice work, especially considering the lighting conditions. You did the best with what was available. I think you were right that flash would have caused more problems than it solved here.
 10/26/2009 03:58:02 PM · #12
A thought on using your flash to balance the slideshow with the flash. From what I remember doing was to meter for the screen, and set the shutterspeed to either 1/60th or 1/30th of a second to keep with the cycle time of the projector. This prevents those black lines on the slideshow presentation you can get with other shutterspeeds. Then I think the flash, in eTTL mode(I used Nikon equivalent, but basically Auto mode) just filled in the dark areas, which would be the speaker. I don't have a great example but here is one using the technique. I also used a full CTO filter/gel on the flash to change the white balance of the flash to incandescent so the white balance would be the same for inside the building.
 10/26/2009 04:52:30 PM · #13
^^^ that's pretty good advice - me thinks ^^^

you could probably practice it by lighting something in front a of a TV or monitor with a flash and some sort of weaker light ( a desk lamp maybe ). it might help you work out the balance between the power of the flash, and the ambient light available. then that balance could be used as a guide to minimize hassle in the future.

shutter speed controls ambient light.
aperture controls flash light.
ISO as a fallback adjustment.

my guess would be a 1/60th shutter speed would effectively expose the slideshow, and an aperture of f:8 with some tweaking of the flashes power ( manual mode ) would have worked out pretty well. that sort of depends on the distance to subject though - but shooting with a 50mm 1.8 i'm guessing you weren't too far away.

the issue IMO - with using e-TTL - would be having to meter the slideshow for every shot -vs dialing a group of settings you could use over and over, and still get consistent results. i may be off base - but i think that's how i would approach it.



Message edited by author 2009-10-26 17:04:12.
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