DPChallenge: A Digital Photography Contest You are not logged in. (log in or register) 
 

DPChallenge Forums >> Rant >> U.S. ObamaCare...
Pages:   ... ...
Showing posts 451 - 475 of 992, (reverse)
AuthorThread
 08/09/2009 01:50:30 PM · #451
Originally posted by SDW:
...the problem is that one will be a US citizen but will claim the maximum dependents (which are not eligible on their own) giving them total benefits (the maximum allowable).

What you perceive as a benefit is a myth.

(and so is the notion that the current healthcare bill includes illegal immigrants).

Message edited by author 2009-08-09 13:51:24.
 08/09/2009 01:51:12 PM · #452
Make them ALL legal, I say.

Making villains of people who work seems a little warped. Why not make them tax payers.

They seem to be easy targets as opposed to the businesses that employ them illegally.

The welfare system should be overhauled, without question but that's piss in the ocean compared to corporate welfare and how they spent our money. We have a lot of misplaced anger that needs to be sorted out.

eric-I looked for a Cross Building kit and was unlucky in my search but this Vampire Defense Kit (from Transylvania) that I stumbled across might come in handy for all those nasty illegals. Those bastards are bringing us down...!!!

Message edited by author 2009-08-09 13:52:28.
 08/09/2009 01:55:16 PM · #453
Originally posted by pawdrix:
Making villains of people who work seems a little warped. Why not make them tax payers.

Many already are, although they don't collect social security or file for refunds.
 08/09/2009 02:03:13 PM · #454
Steve, donât get me wrong, one of the people I speak of was a friend, excellent worker, and eventually became a holder of a legal green card. But threw him I found out how easy it was to beat the system. Not all are workers, some just take advantage, he hated the what they did to his reputation.
 08/09/2009 02:07:20 PM · #455
Originally posted by scalvert:
Originally posted by SDW:
...the problem is that one will be a US citizen but will claim the maximum dependents (which are not eligible on their own) giving them total benefits (the maximum allowable).

What you perceive as a benefit is a myth.

(and so is the notion that the current healthcare bill includes illegal immigrants).


Come on scalvert link me to your states medicaid bill not some article. Show me. Don't just show me something a paper reported.

Ok, let me give you an example below. No I live in GA not CA.

The government way of subsidizing programs is far from flawless. Let me give you an example. Which of the two families are better off at the end of the month?

Family âAâ
Income $ 2200
Rent $675.00
Utilities $400.00
Groceriess $400.00
Insurance $508.00
After basic necessities $217 /mo leftover
*The above is not counting car payment, gas, tax, and other necessities such as clothing, education, savings, etc.

Family âBâ
Income: $5000.00
Rent: $250.00
Utilities: $150.00
Groceriess: $0.00
Insurance: $0.00
SSI: $674.00
After basic necessities $5274 / mo leftover

Message edited by author 2009-08-09 14:07:39.
 08/09/2009 02:40:01 PM · #456
Originally posted by SDW:
Come on scalvert link me to your states medicaid bill not some article. Show me. Don't just show me something a paper reported.

You questioned the healthcare bill's inclusion of illegal immigrants, not Medicaid. Regardless, you're chasing myths. The National Research Council concluded that immigrants will pay on average $80,000 per capita more in taxes than they will use in government services over their lifetimes.

Originally posted by SDW:
Which of the two families are better off at the end of the month?

Better check your math.
 08/09/2009 03:18:19 PM · #457
Originally posted by scalvert:
Originally posted by SDW:
Come on scalvert link me to your states medicaid bill not some article. Show me. Don't just show me something a paper reported.

You questioned the healthcare bill's inclusion of illegal immigrants, not Medicaid. Regardless, you're chasing myths. The National Research Council concluded that immigrants will pay on average $80,000 per capita more in taxes than they will use in government services over their lifetimes.


immigrants or non-citizens?

Originally posted by SDW:
Which of the two families are better off at the end of the month?

Originally posted by scalvert:
Better check your math.

Better if you knew that SSI is an income. I thought someone that seems to have all the answers would have known that. SSI (social security income) is a government program for disabled or retired persons at the state level. It provides them with a check of $674.00 in the state of GA (other states may be more or less).

Message edited by author 2009-08-09 15:18:57.
 08/09/2009 03:35:05 PM · #458
Originally posted by scalvert:
Originally posted by SDW:
Come on scalvert link me to your states medicaid bill not some article. Show me. Don't just show me something a paper reported.

You questioned the healthcare bill's inclusion of illegal immigrants, not Medicaid. Regardless, you're chasing myths. The National Research Council concluded that immigrants will pay on average $80,000 per capita more in taxes than they will use in government services over their lifetimes.

Originally posted by SDW:
Which of the two families are better off at the end of the month?

Better check your math.


And to add from the link YOU provided. The following:

Immigrants are more likely to be uninsured and therefore less likely to consume health care services.19 Nearly 44 percent of documented immigrants were uninsured in 2005, more than three times the uninsured rate for the native born.20 There is no accurate data on the number of undocumented immigrants who are uninsured, but chances are very high that the percentage is well beyond 44 percent.
One survey of uninsured California farm workers found that only half of the males and one-third of the females had seen a physician in the past two years, even though nearly one in five had an occupational illness or a chronic health problem such as high blood pressure, high cholesterol serum, or obesity.21 Chronic diseases account for about 75 percent of health care costs in the United States,22 which demonstrates that if these individuals had health insurance, they would be better able to manage their health and reduce health care costs for everyone.

Now let me see(humm...thinking)...that must mean they go to ER's to get emergency care. They have to be getting FREE care when needed or the article would not say "it would reduce health care cost for everyone."

NO Coverage = Pass the bill on to others.
08/09/2009 03:45:11 PM · #459
Originally posted by scalvert:

What benefits?


Free hospital care to her and her child. Citizenship to the child who when of legal age can help Mom with becoming a citizen.
 08/09/2009 04:16:54 PM · #460
Originally posted by SDW:
Now let me see(humm...thinking)...that must mean they go to ER's to get emergency care. They have to be getting FREE care when needed or the article would not say "it would reduce health care cost for everyone."

Think harder (or even a little). Emergency room care is *NOT* primary health care. Would you rather wait for doctors to confirm your citizenship before treating an emergency? From the same page you quoted: "Contrary to popular belief, immigrants also rarely use emergency room services. ...While immigrant children visit the ER less often than U.S. born children, because they are often sicker when seeking care, their ER expenditures are more than three times higher, suggesting that access to primary and preventive care could have prevented the illness from worsening and ultimately, reduced medical costs.

Originally posted by FireBird:
Originally posted by scalvert:
What benefits?

Free hospital care to her and her child. Citizenship to the child who when of legal age can help Mom with becoming a citizen.

The only free care provided is ER and childbirth (essentially helping U.S. citizens at birth). Primary care is not free, and illegal parents are routinely deported when caught. The children confer little advantage to parents seeking citizenship later.

This is an utter waste of keystrokes.
 08/09/2009 04:35:19 PM · #461
Originally posted by pawdrix:
Originally posted by LoudDog:
Originally posted by scalvert:
And lastly, you have no business whining about a healthcare plan if you can't offer ANY alternative. The status quo is not a plan. "...Missouri Republican Rep. Roy Blunt was tapped to head a GOP health care task force in February, which was charged âwith crafting Republican solutions to increase Americansâ access to quality, affordable health care,â but which so far has produced no plan and seems unlikely to do so."


Note, I wasn't saying either plan was good or bad. I was just pointing out yet more misinformation being spewed by the left.


LD-I wouldn't call those plans. They seems more like ideas, at best so I wouldn't say there's any disinformation until something concrete is produced.


Well, if that is how you define a plan, then the dems have not put out a plan either???
 08/09/2009 04:37:27 PM · #462
Originally posted by scalvert:
Originally posted by SDW:
Now let me see(humm...thinking)...that must mean they go to ER's to get emergency care. They have to be getting FREE care when needed or the article would not say "it would reduce health care cost for everyone."

Think harder (or even a little). Emergency room care is *NOT* primary health care. Would you rather wait for doctors to confirm your citizenship before treating an emergency? From the same page you quoted: "Contrary to popular belief, immigrants also rarely use emergency room services. ...While immigrant children visit the ER less often than U.S. born children, because they are often sicker when seeking care, their ER expenditures are more than three times higher, suggesting that access to primary and preventive care could have prevented the illness from worsening and ultimately, reduced medical costs.


Scalvert you said it "they are one of the causes of higher medical cost". Isn't that what your saying???

Message edited by author 2009-08-09 16:38:30.
 08/09/2009 04:37:39 PM · #463
Originally posted by scalvert:
Originally posted by LoudDog:
Originally posted by scalvert:
And lastly, you have no business whining about a healthcare plan if you can't offer ANY alternative. The status quo is not a plan. "...Missouri Republican Rep. Roy Blunt was tapped to head a GOP health care task force in February, which was charged âwith crafting Republican solutions to increase Americansâ access to quality, affordable health care,â but which so far has produced no plan and seems unlikely to do so."

Note, I wasn't saying either plan was good or bad. I was just pointing out yet more misinformation being spewed by the left.

That quote was from Factcheck.org, not the "left." It was a simple statement of fact â there IS no Republican plan.


How could it be a statement of fact that the republicans have not proposed a plan when I pointed out two republican proposed plans I found with google in just a few minutes? Factcheck better try a little harder next time.
 08/09/2009 04:50:35 PM · #464
Originally posted by LoudDog:
Originally posted by scalvert:
Originally posted by LoudDog:
Originally posted by scalvert:
And lastly, you have no business whining about a healthcare plan if you can't offer ANY alternative. The status quo is not a plan. "...Missouri Republican Rep. Roy Blunt was tapped to head a GOP health care task force in February, which was charged âwith crafting Republican solutions to increase Americansâ access to quality, affordable health care,â but which so far has produced no plan and seems unlikely to do so."

Note, I wasn't saying either plan was good or bad. I was just pointing out yet more misinformation being spewed by the left.

That quote was from Factcheck.org, not the "left." It was a simple statement of fact â there IS no Republican plan.


How could it be a statement of fact that the republicans have not proposed a plan when I pointed out two republican proposed plans I found with google in just a few minutes? Factcheck better try a little harder next time.


Lets be real here. Those are not plans. At best those are ideas of a plan. Besides, if the republicans are going to come up with anything it should be a slight revision of Obama's plan not something entirely new. Why? Because the republicans are not in power. Their ideas have already been voted down so they should be working within the context of the democrat plan since after all there's a mandate for it.

Message edited by author 2009-08-09 16:52:01.
 08/09/2009 04:53:23 PM · #465
Common Sense is the foundation that stabilizes ones intellectual mind; devoid of is the equivalent of constructing a domicile on sand.

If your congressman or congresswoman is not willing to place themselves on the same plan; ask yourself, Why? Whats wrong with it? After all they work for us not the other way around. A little common sense goes a long way.

Message edited by author 2009-08-09 16:57:08.
 08/09/2009 05:08:00 PM · #466
Originally posted by yanko:


Lets be real here. Those are not plans. At best those are ideas of a plan...


It looks like they're against having a "Death Panel"...and just as this was beginning to get exciting. Bummer.

Bartertown Hall Meetings should keep things lively though. (see:Mad Max 3)

"Ladies and gentlemen, boys and girls... dyin' times here."

Message edited by author 2009-08-09 17:52:39.
 08/09/2009 05:22:45 PM · #467
Originally posted by SDW:
Common Sense is the foundation that stabilizes ones intellectual mind; devoid of is the equivalent of constructing a domicile on sand.

If your congressman or congresswoman is not willing to place themselves on the same plan; ask yourself, Why? Whats wrong with it? After all they work for us not the other way around. A little common sense goes a long way.


My understanding is that the legislation doesn't provide for a SINGLE plan but creates an insurance exchange wherein a public/government-run plan and private insurance companies compete. The public plan would offer different levels of care, just as private insurance companies do now. No private insurer would be forced to participate in the system, and no individual or employer will be forced to join the public plan. Individuals and businesses are free to choose from among them. So I don't know what you mean when you say that our congressmen and women are "not willing to place themselves on the same plan."
 08/09/2009 06:00:31 PM · #468
Anyone from MAssachusetts, like to chime in on this?

It appears to be a work in progress with no hold on skyrocketing costs but I assume with political will the Fed could make a big dent on that problem.
 08/09/2009 08:02:26 PM · #469
Originally posted by Judith Polakoff:
Originally posted by SDW:
Common Sense is the foundation that stabilizes ones intellectual mind; devoid of is the equivalent of constructing a domicile on sand.

If your congressman or congresswoman is not willing to place themselves on the same plan; ask yourself, Why? Whats wrong with it? After all they work for us not the other way around. A little common sense goes a long way.


My understanding is that the legislation doesn't provide for a SINGLE plan but creates an insurance exchange wherein a public/government-run plan and private insurance companies compete. The public plan would offer different levels of care, just as private insurance companies do now. No private insurer would be forced to participate in the system, and no individual or employer will be forced to join the public plan. Individuals and businesses are free to choose from among them. So I don't know what you mean when you say that our congressmen and women are "not willing to place themselves on the same plan."


It depends on when and to whom he [Obama] and Congress speaks. They go back and forth on the issue. But to me it's clear they want a single payer system.

Message edited by author 2009-08-09 20:03:22.
 08/10/2009 11:24:10 AM · #470
(CNN) -- The Senate's second-ranking Democrat slammed recent town-hall protests over health care on Sunday, insisting they violate "the democratic process,"

Bold emphasis mine.

Gotta love those who point out the problem of speaking up as a violation of democracy.

Message edited by author 2009-08-10 11:24:33.
 08/10/2009 11:29:40 AM · #471
Originally posted by Flash:
(CNN) -- The Senate's second-ranking Democrat slammed recent town-hall protests over health care on Sunday, insisting they violate "the democratic process,"

Bold emphasis mine.

Gotta love those who point out the problem of speaking up as a violation of democracy.


The "protetsers" are being bussed in by the Republicans to disrupt the meetings, dude. They aren't "real", grass-roots protests. And yes, they DO therefore violate the "democratic process", in more-or-less exactly the same way that process used to be violated by the political machines that surrounded polling places with intimidating thugs; it's just a lot less overt, of course...

R.
 08/10/2009 11:52:47 AM · #472
And arenât you glad that right now the government is being run by people who donât hate government?

I've never been a big fan of our gov't but they certainly saved our asses this time around.

"a foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds,? adored by little statesmen and philosophers and divine"

Emerson is beginning to ring truer to our present state than ever before.

SDW-These are shouting matches NOT Freedom Of Speech. Regardless of where they are coming from their behavior is uncivilized and their only goal seems to be shutting down discourse. Burning in effigy and newly elected Congressman or painting a Hitler mustache on an Obama poster is a fear tactic and a little over the top, don't you think. "And if they were (bussed in)" to answer your question that's rigging. Congressmen answer to their constituents not people from out of state or other districts...I mean, c'mon.

Message edited by author 2009-08-10 12:12:15.
 08/10/2009 11:58:46 AM · #473
Originally posted by Bear_Music:
Originally posted by Flash:
(CNN) -- The Senate's second-ranking Democrat slammed recent town-hall protests over health care on Sunday, insisting they violate "the democratic process,"

Bold emphasis mine.

Gotta love those who point out the problem of speaking up as a violation of democracy.


The "protetsers" are being bussed in by the Republicans to disrupt the meetings, dude. They aren't "real", grass-roots protests. And yes, they DO therefore violate the "democratic process", in more-or-less exactly the same way that process used to be violated by the political machines that surrounded polling places with intimidating thugs; it's just a lot less overt, of course...

R.

Bear_Music I usually agree with a lot you say but this time I don't. The democratic party and congress along with the whitehouse wants people to believe that. Show me evidence of the people being bused? Not just words written by some newspaper or reported third-party by a reporter. Show me pictures, show me video.

And even if they were, whats the difference between them (people going against something they don't believe in) and the other protest over the years???
I think the government got blindsided and didn't see the amount of people that is against the plan. Or for now against it because of so many issues.

Message edited by author 2009-08-10 12:06:22.
 08/10/2009 12:09:47 PM · #474
Originally posted by Bear_Music:
Originally posted by Flash:
(CNN) -- The Senate's second-ranking Democrat slammed recent town-hall protests over health care on Sunday, insisting they violate "the democratic process,"

Bold emphasis mine.

Gotta love those who point out the problem of speaking up as a violation of democracy.


The "protetsers" are being bussed in by the Republicans to disrupt the meetings, dude. They aren't "real", grass-roots protests. And yes, they DO therefore violate the "democratic process", in more-or-less exactly the same way that process used to be violated by the political machines that surrounded polling places with intimidating thugs; it's just a lot less overt, of course...

R.


You wouldn't be speaking of "Chicago" style politics would you? Or perhaps the San Franciscan's who disrupt church services or military recuiting stations or...or...or
Are their rights not protected?

Rachel Maddow spent nearly 3 minutes discussing one such event, charaterizing the speakers as Right wing zealots. Her only example was a past republican who left her position 2 years ago and claimed she was without political affiliation. This was Maddow's PROOF of a Republican conspiracy.

If Democrats had any history of speaking out against the intimidation tactics they have imployed for decades and were videotaped using this last election with Beret wearing, baton weilding intimidators that the Attorney General has dropped all charges against, then I might give you a little consideration on your concern - but really, who is trying to intimidate who here?
 08/10/2009 12:11:16 PM · #475
Originally posted by SDW:
And even if they were, whats the difference between them (people going against something they don't believe in) and the other protest over the years???


The difference is that the Republicans are out-and-out lying, spreading disinformation in a shameful manner. "Death lists"? C'mon, give me a break... This whole process is illustrating just how badly the politics of America have broken down into an us vs them battle of power brokers, with the voice of the citizens having virtually no meaning. The Republicans have had 8 years to do something and they ain't done squat. Now the Dems are trying to do something and the Republicans are fighting them on a shamefully inappropriate level, because they realize that if ANY form of health care reform is passed their party is in deep doo-doo for the foreseeable future. All this happy hoo-hah about how much it's gonna cost us is completely beside the point.

Yes, I'm pissed off...

R.
Pages:   ... ...
Current Server Time: 08/10/2025 04:18:19 AM

Please log in or register to post to the forums.


Home - Challenges - Community - League - Photos - Cameras - Lenses - Learn - Help - Terms of Use - Privacy - Top ^
DPChallenge, and website content and design, Copyright © 2001-2025 Challenging Technologies, LLC.
All digital photo copyrights belong to the photographers and may not be used without permission.
Current Server Time: 08/10/2025 04:18:19 AM EDT.