| Author | Thread |
|
|
11/15/2008 07:25:01 PM · #26 |
I can't remember the original context in which I recently heard this wonderful twist on the American revolutionary mantra, but I think it applies to the churches who demand a free voice in the political arena:
"No representation without taxation!" |
|
|
|
11/15/2008 07:43:27 PM · #27 |
Originally posted by Louis:
Originally posted by dponlyme:
Anytime anyone expects you to check your brain at the door and simply do as they say its not a good thing. |
This statement is the height of irony. |
see next post |
|
|
|
11/15/2008 07:47:35 PM · #28 |
Originally posted by Jac:
Originally posted by dponlyme:
Anytime anyone expects you to check your brain at the door and simply do as they say its not a good thing. |
/picks up jaw from desk
I'm stunned by this comment dp. Do you understand why? |
I think because you wrongly assume that is what I and all Christians do. I find this utterly insulting as I'm sure you intended. The facts of the matter as I see them is that you do not have any respect for a person who believes in God. You can have your jaw dropping irony and I will have my respect for even those who do not respect me. I understand where you are coming from.. I've been their and believe me when I say it is much better where I am at now:Knowledge and truth not arrogance.
Message edited by author 2008-11-15 19:48:00. |
|
|
|
11/15/2008 09:20:13 PM · #29 |
Originally posted by dponlyme:
Originally posted by Jac:
Originally posted by dponlyme:
Anytime anyone expects you to check your brain at the door and simply do as they say its not a good thing. |
/picks up jaw from desk
I'm stunned by this comment dp. Do you understand why? |
I think because you wrongly assume that is what I and all Christians do. I find this utterly insulting as I'm sure you intended. The facts of the matter as I see them is that you do not have any respect for a person who believes in God. You can have your jaw dropping irony and I will have my respect for even those who do not respect me. I understand where you are coming from.. I've been their and believe me when I say it is much better where I am at now:Knowledge and truth not arrogance. |
It isn't arrogance. It's a simple fact that, in order for you to believe what you believe, in the way you believe it, you are required to willfully ignore a host of facts and an irresistible quantum of reason. Even you agree on this point. That it is so baldly stated may not be palatable to you, but we hardly need to dredge up the sore feelings of past threads to make this point. It has nothing to do with respect (yours is rather acid in tone), and it has nothing to do with you; but rather, it has everything to do with what you've (apparently chosen) to intellectually inherit. |
|
|
|
11/15/2008 09:56:38 PM · #30 |
Originally posted by Louis:
Originally posted by dponlyme:
Originally posted by Jac:
Originally posted by dponlyme:
Anytime anyone expects you to check your brain at the door and simply do as they say its not a good thing. |
/picks up jaw from desk
I'm stunned by this comment dp. Do you understand why? |
I think because you wrongly assume that is what I and all Christians do. I find this utterly insulting as I'm sure you intended. The facts of the matter as I see them is that you do not have any respect for a person who believes in God. You can have your jaw dropping irony and I will have my respect for even those who do not respect me. I understand where you are coming from.. I've been their and believe me when I say it is much better where I am at now:Knowledge and truth not arrogance. |
It isn't arrogance. It's a simple fact that, in order for you to believe what you believe, in the way you believe it, you are required to willfully ignore a host of facts and an irresistible quantum of reason. Even you agree on this point. That it is so baldly stated may not be palatable to you, but we hardly need to dredge up the sore feelings of past threads to make this point. It has nothing to do with respect (yours is rather acid in tone), and it has nothing to do with you; but rather, it has everything to do with what you've (apparently chosen) to intellectually inherit. |
Agreed that we don't need to dredge up sore feelings from past threads but it continually amazes me how you and others can feel that I ignore a 'host' of facts and an irresistable 'quantum' of reason. Nothing can be further from the truth. We all have access to the same 'facts'. It's just the case that my knowledge of them has not led me to what I would consider 'arrogantly' thinking that everything is necessarily provable scientifically. Knowledge is not bound in it's entirety to scientific endeavor. Human reasoning is limited by our own capacity. We only have five senses. Yes we have created instruments that can measure things we could not ordinarily perceive but do you think we have uncovered enough that necessarily voids the possibility of the existence of a creator? I have had so many experiences that I'm sure you and others would chalk up to coincidence but when you put them all together and you see that there is a pattern, a discernable path that you are being directed on it is hard to discount the possibility of intervention by a supreme being. When I pray, I get answers to my prayers. Sometimes they come as thoughts that are loud and clear and go completely contrary to my own thinking. Sometimes they come as events that happen that defy logic. None of these things happened when I did not have faith. None of these things happened when I did not pray. I know you will discount all of these things but I want you to know that I am not denying facts or ignoring reason but rather considering them and coming to the conclusion that these facts and reasoning may not be completely reflective of the true reality in which we live. |
|
|
|
11/16/2008 02:56:20 PM · #31 |
Originally posted by GeneralE:
Churches are corporations, and are treated like other corporations for tax purposes. Any corporation, church/religious or not, which agrees to certain rules and guidelines can be tax-exempt under section 501(c)3 of the IRS code -- one of those provisions is a limitation on particiation in partisan political activity. |
NOT true!!!
|
|
|
|
11/16/2008 04:25:55 PM · #32 |
Originally posted by RonB:
Originally posted by GeneralE:
Churches are corporations, and are treated like other corporations for tax purposes. Any corporation, church/religious or not, which agrees to certain rules and guidelines can be tax-exempt under section 501(c)3 of the IRS code -- one of those provisions is a limitation on particiation in partisan political activity. |
NOT true!!! |
Under current law Churches are automatically tax-exempt according to IRS Code § 508(c)(1)(A):
Special rules with respect to section 501(c)(3) organizations.
.(a) New organizations must notify secretary that they are applying for recognition of section 501(c)(3) status.
...(c) Exceptions.
.....(1) Mandatory exceptions. Subsections (a) and (b) shall not apply to—
.......(A) churches, their integrated auxiliaries, and conventions or associations of churches.
AND the code reads as follows:
Sec. 501. Exemption from tax on corporations, certain trusts, etc.
.(c) List of exempt organizations —
...(3)... organized and operated exclusively for religious [purposes]...no substantial part of the activities of which is carrying on propaganda, or otherwise attempting, to influence legislation, (except as otherwise provided in subsection (h)), and which does not participate in, or intervene in (including the publishing or distributing of statements), any political campaign on behalf of (or in opposition to) any candidate for public office.
Sounds like a high price to pay for being tax exempt to me. As for the notion that Churches should be tax exempt just because they're churches, well , that seems like it should be as much a violation of the first amendment as taxing the churches because they're churches. I think the government should be neutral with regard to religious institutions. Their monetary exchanges should be subject to the same laws as everyone else. It does not infringe on their right to free exercise any more than requiring churches to build according to local building codes. Churches rely on public roads and emergency services, why shouldn't they help pay them just like everyone else? |
|
|
|
11/16/2008 04:33:45 PM · #33 |
Originally posted by GeneralE:
Churches are corporations, and are treated like other corporations for tax purposes. Any corporation, church/religious or not, which agrees to certain rules and guidelines can be tax-exempt under section 501(c)3 of the IRS code -- one of those provisions is a limitation on particiation in partisan political activity. |
Some churches are corporations. I would wager that most, especially smaller ones, are not, though that is a trend that is changing. |
|
Home -
Challenges -
Community -
League -
Photos -
Cameras -
Lenses -
Learn -
Help -
Terms of Use -
Privacy -
Top ^
DPChallenge, and website content and design, Copyright © 2001-2025 Challenging Technologies, LLC.
All digital photo copyrights belong to the photographers and may not be used without permission.
Current Server Time: 08/27/2025 10:19:49 AM EDT.
