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09/10/2008 03:11:33 PM · #276 |
Originally posted by thegrandwazoo:
Originally posted by Flash:
I hope you are not representing this as an example of your sound research and basis for your informed choice. |
Check this it seems to be from a reputable source, Time. It was sited in the article Judith posted.
"Stein says that as mayor, Palin continued to inject religious beliefs into her policy at times. "She asked the library how she could go about banning books," he says, because some voters thought they had inappropriate language in them. "The librarian was aghast." That woman, Mary Ellen Baker, couldn't be reached for comment, but news reports from the time show that Palin had threatened to fire Baker for not giving "full support" to the mayor."
Oh yeah that is who I want a heartbeat away from the big chair. |
Scalverts post and link above address that. You may want to read it. |
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09/10/2008 03:14:05 PM · #277 |
But FactCheck.org doesn't really go into the entire story. try this...
Seattle Times |
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09/10/2008 03:14:07 PM · #278 |
Originally posted by scalvert:
To be fair, several points in that article are based on internet rumors. |
These rumors do not help the cause of Democrats - in my opinion. It has given rise to a new McCain ad that I suspect will be well received as it shows a pack of wolves with the intro that FactCheck.org has proven many attacks as false.
edit to add: What really surprises me is the the amount of time both the bloggers and the Obama campaign have given to specifically addressing Palin - the bottom of the ticket. Heard someone say recently - "there is a saying here that as long as you're getting kicked in the rear, it means you're out front".
Message edited by author 2008-09-10 15:18:05. |
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09/10/2008 03:17:16 PM · #279 |
Originally posted by Flash:
Originally posted by thegrandwazoo:
Originally posted by Flash:
I hope you are not representing this as an example of your sound research and basis for your informed choice. |
Check this it seems to be from a reputable source, Time. It was sited in the article Judith posted.
"Stein says that as mayor, Palin continued to inject religious beliefs into her policy at times. "She asked the library how she could go about banning books," he says, because some voters thought they had inappropriate language in them. "The librarian was aghast." That woman, Mary Ellen Baker, couldn't be reached for comment, but news reports from the time show that Palin had threatened to fire Baker for not giving "full support" to the mayor."
Oh yeah that is who I want a heartbeat away from the big chair. |
Scalverts post and link above address that. You may want to read it. |
From Scalverts link:
Palin asked a "What if?"
His link to me confirms the quote above and Just the mere fact that she would consider it enough to ask scares the hell out of me. Mind you I am a libertarian and really have no "dog" in this fight but that is over the top to me.
I think she is a poor choice for McCain and he is my guy. I was born in and I live in Arizona and until he announced her as his running mate I was most likely going to vote for him now I am not so sure. This choice will be a hard one for me and the more I read the harder it gets ... |
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09/10/2008 03:24:06 PM · #280 |
Originally posted by Flash:
These rumors do not help the cause of Democrats - in my opinion. |
The internet rumors noted are just that- internet rumors, and not necessarily started or supported by the party. |
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09/10/2008 03:25:44 PM · #281 |
Originally posted by thegrandwazoo:
His link to me confirms the quote above and Just the mere fact that she would consider it enough to ask scares the hell out of me. |
Except the link also clearly states that the librarian was employed through her term which is a direct contradiction to the implied "firing" from the "news report".
Again - Palin may or may not have been a good sound choice - but she certainly has alot of folks with their hackles raised. Its hard to play good offense when your defense is on the field. Biden is seriously preparing and has tagged Mi Govenor Granholm to practice with for 4 days. We'll see if it helps. I sure suspect that Palin will have some practice prep as well. |
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09/10/2008 03:30:57 PM · #282 |
| I find it very odd that after the last 8 years of Republican presidency and with the stage set for a Democratic complete takeover of House, Senate and Whitehouse, how Obama and Biden are positioning themselves as underdogs. That is some slick advertising. |
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09/10/2008 03:35:07 PM · #283 |
Originally posted by Flash:
I find it very odd that after the last 8 years of Republican presidency and with the stage set for a Democratic complete takeover of House, Senate and Whitehouse, how Obama and Biden are positioning themselves as underdogs. That is some slick advertising. |
Not as slick as McCain hijacking the "Change" Motto from the Obama campaign:) |
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09/10/2008 03:35:40 PM · #284 |
Originally posted by Flash:
the link also clearly states that the librarian was employed through her term which is a direct contradiction to the implied "firing" from the "news report". |
Not quite. "in January 1997, Palin fired Emmons, along with the police chief. According to the Chicago Tribune, Palin did not list censorship as a reason for Emmons’ firing, but said she didn’t feel she had Emmons’ support. The decision caused “a stir” in the small town, according to a newspaper account at the time. According to a widely circulated e-mail from Kilkenny, “city residents rallied to the defense of the City Librarian and against Palin’s attempt at out-and-out censorship, so Palin backed down and withdrew her termination letter.” |
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09/10/2008 03:37:59 PM · #285 |
Enough - Obama responds to McCain BS
I have to agree with him ... the lies are comming fast and furious from the McCain camp ... the Lipstick diversion the sick and twisted education ad that McCain is running ...
When are we going to get to issues? |
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09/10/2008 03:49:10 PM · #286 |
Originally posted by nomad469:
Enough - Obama responds to McCain BS
I have to agree with him ... the lies are comming fast and furious from the McCain camp ... the Lipstick diversion the sick and twisted education ad that McCain is running ...
When are we going to get to issues? |
When one of the candidates starts talking about them again? Dunno.
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09/10/2008 03:52:33 PM · #287 |
If they keep having the respond to the other's stupidity then maybe never.
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09/10/2008 03:53:42 PM · #288 |
Originally posted by cpanaioti:
If they keep having the respond to the other's stupidity then maybe never. |
I heard that! It's kinda like your guys debating over the debate. :-) |
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09/10/2008 03:55:05 PM · #289 |
Originally posted by thegrandwazoo:
Originally posted by cpanaioti:
If they keep having the respond to the other's stupidity then maybe never. |
I heard that! It's kinda like your guys debating over the debate. :-) |
Yup.
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09/10/2008 03:59:35 PM · #290 |
This clip is what was posted here. Maybe all the sound-bites are extracted while the talk of issues remain largely unproliferated? Perhaps the rest of his presentation actually talked about some issues?
Message edited by author 2008-09-10 16:52:13. |
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09/10/2008 05:19:10 PM · #291 |
VIDEO: Obama: 'Spare me' CNN - Wed Sep 10, 12:00 PM ET
Hearing it from his own lips is powerful. Great, brief speech.
EDIT: Oops, didn't realize that was the same speech that nomad469 had linked to earlier.
Message edited by author 2008-09-10 17:23:11. |
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09/10/2008 05:24:21 PM · #292 |
Originally posted by Flash:
...I suspect that if this story has legs... |
You are such a freaking sexist! |
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09/10/2008 06:00:16 PM · #293 |
Originally posted by scalvert:
To be fair, several points in that article are based on internet rumors. |
If you're referring to the point about Palin firing the librarian and asking that books be banned, there are several versions of that story floating around, and even factcheck.org seems murky on many of the details. But it is clear that Palin did ask about banning books, and did fire the librarian or ask for her resignation, (and I also read another source that said the only reason Palin reversed herself is because there was talk of a recall election at that point). Some versions of the story have Palin firing the librarian not because she was unwilling to ban the books but because Palin felt the librarian didn't exhibit the appropriate loyalty. So it was really a loyalty test? Either way, whatever the motivation, the incident speaks volumes about Palin. |
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09/10/2008 06:08:24 PM · #294 |
Originally posted by Flash:
I hope you are not representing this as an example of your sound research and basis for your informed choice. |
You might consider doing some research on McCain's record with respect to women's issues before you jump on his campaign's phony sanctimony bandwagon. |
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09/10/2008 06:44:33 PM · #295 |
Originally posted by thegrandwazoo:
His link to me confirms the quote above and Just the mere fact that she would consider it enough to ask scares the hell out of me. Mind you I am a libertarian and really have no "dog" in this fight but that is over the top to me.
I think she is a poor choice for McCain and he is my guy. I was born in and I live in Arizona and until he announced her as his running mate I was most likely going to vote for him now I am not so sure. This choice will be a hard one for me and the more I read the harder it gets ... |
Yes, this will be a very hard choice for a libertarian. Firstly, don't be under the illusion that McCain will make government smaller. Republicans never do. You might want to hinge your decision on the Iraq War:
CONS: the war is a huge government expenditure. As a libertarian you should be horrified at the amount of tax money thrown into a useless war, with so much of that money going into foreign nations.
PROS: Bush-McCain are in the process of dismantling and destroying the United States Armed Forces. They are doing it by substituting them with "Contractors." Soldiers in the private sector. They are also contracting out relief work (qv. Katrina) to contractors (sometimes the same contractors, such as Blackwater). They will also do more than Obama to keep health care from being Universally guaranteed. They will keep health care completely in the private sector (but on the down side, they will use tax money to subsidize industry. Republicans do this constantly, not something a libertarian should like).
Personally, I understand the libertarian point about small government. However, I think that the military, disaster relief, and health care are core concerns of the citizenry and should be handled by government, not corporations with a profit motive.
Good luck with your decision! I hope you don't make it on knee-jerk antiliberalism. |
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09/10/2008 06:56:56 PM · #296 |
Originally posted by posthumous:
Good luck with your decision! I hope you don't make it on knee-jerk antiliberalism. |
I won't that is for sure. I think my decision will be based on who will be more uncomfortable for Bush to hand over the keys to after the election ... :-P |
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09/10/2008 09:01:21 PM · #297 |
Originally posted by thegrandwazoo:
Originally posted by posthumous:
Good luck with your decision! I hope you don't make it on knee-jerk antiliberalism. |
I won't that is for sure. I think my decision will be based on who will be more uncomfortable for Bush to hand over the keys to after the election ... :-P |
That's a tough one! hahahaha |
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09/11/2008 12:35:05 AM · #298 |
Quoted from a blog article linked on ABC News:
....And interestingly, the Truth Squad call was full of half-truths and statements that weren't true at all.
Speaking on behalf of the McCain campaign, former Massachusetts Gov. Jane Swift tonight flatly stated that Obama had called Palin a pig.
"[T]he formation of the Palin Truth Squad couldn't have happened too soon, as we saw when Sen. Obama in Lebanon, Va., this evening uttered what I can only deem to be disgraceful comments comparing our vice presidential nominee Gov. Palin to a pig," Swift said.
"Sen. Obama owes Gov. Palin an apology," she said.
Asked why she was so confident Obama was "comparing" Palin to a pig, she said Palin was the only one of the four candidates on both parties' tickets who wears lipstick.
"She is the only one of the four candidates for president, or the only vice presidential candidate who wears lipstick," Swift said. "I mean, it seemed to me a very gendered comment."
But, Swift added, if "as part of his apology Sen. Obama wants to say, no, he was calling Sen. McCain -- who is a true hero in our country -- a pig, then I suppose we could wait en masse for an apology to that, as well."
It was pointed out to Swift that, after the line about the pig, Obama had said, "You can wrap an old fish in a piece of paper called 'change,' it's still gonna stink after eight years."
Swift then suggested that Obama was calling McCain a fish.
"I have a fourth-grader and two second-graders at home," she said. "I would not teach them that this is sort of a high-minded debate on policy issues when they are calling people rotten old fish or a pig. In fact, it sounds a lot like some of the least intelligent debates on the playground sound like at our elementary school."
A reporter then reminded Swift that in December, McCain was asked about criticisms coming his way from then-opponent Gov. Mitt Romney, R-Mass., and McCain replied, "Never get into a wrestling match with a pig. You both get dirty, and the pig likes it."
Was McCain calling Romney a pig? a reporter asked Swift.
Of course not, Swift said.
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I think this is pretty good evidence that being a former Governor of a state don't make you too smart...or honest...or whatever. Oh wait, really I only needed to point to Bush for that one.
Message edited by author 2008-09-11 00:37:40. |
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09/11/2008 12:44:43 AM · #299 |
I like that she referred to herself, however obliquely, as a pitbull. You know there are lots and lots of places that have banned pit bulls as unfit to be around people...
*note - i am against breed discrimination, and know some very sweet dogs that come under the collective "pit bull" breed designation |
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09/11/2008 12:48:17 AM · #300 |
| The Mass. Gov. doesn't sound too Swift. Maybe her fourth-grader can read the actual quote and explain it to her? :-/ |
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