| Author | Thread |
|
|
08/20/2008 04:19:04 PM · #1 |
Sorry if this is a bit of a confusing story. Need to rant a bit too.
Here's the thing. People nowadays buy expensive camera's and take photos. That's ok. They try and do some stuff with it. That's ok too. But when people are only been trying for 2 months and getting nice oppurtunities to do something commercial when they don't even know how to handle their camera, and not even getting paid for it, that makes me sad..
Is it so that the customers don't see quality anymore because people call themself "photographers" when they have a dslr? Can't they see talent anymore? Can't they see knowledge and do they have to go for the cheap way?
I've been studying my ass of and am really trying to start up a business. People tell me I have talent, and I can provide quality. But when the "photographers" can have these oppurtunities, without these quality aspects above, is it really about the price they have to pay? I'm even asking myself if I have to change my style to fit a bigger target-group. And that coming from me, well, that's big.
I'm not good at networking and getting myself into the market, I know that (step one = recognising the problem). I want to be the one doing the cool stuff, I want to be the one who can get the oppurtunities. So how can I go on the market? I have absolutely no clue. The past year I've been fooling around, and I like the thing I'm doing. But I want more.
I'm hoping some of you can give me some tips for business. Because I just don't know it anymore.
|
|
|
|
08/20/2008 04:27:38 PM · #2 |
After seeing the results of your first wedding shoot, I have no doubt you will do well once you build a client base and gain some word of mouth advertising. (That's the BEST kind!) There will always be some people who will shop on price only. Do you really want those gigs on a regular basis?
I am not in marketing or sales myself, and not self employed, so I have no advice from personal experience. However, I have heard good about this inexpensive book: Guerrilla Marketing You can't go wrong for $11 or so. (Hmmm, I actually appear to have it on my shelf.) |
|
|
|
08/20/2008 04:54:26 PM · #3 |
Originally posted by biteme:
Is it so that the customers don't see quality anymore because people call themself "photographers" when they have a dslr? Can't they see talent anymore? Can't they see knowledge and do they have to go for the cheap way? |
If you look at it from the clients POV, if you have nothing to compare it to then quality doesn't matter.
Some may also love the photos you take but can't afford the rates so they settle with what they can get.
Anyone who takes pictures with a camera is a photographer, anyone who gets paid to take pictures is a professional photographer, quality isn't relivant (I'm sure I'm going to get burned on this, just putting it in simplest terms).
I'm an amateur photographer (this doesn't mean I am good or bad, I just don't get paid for it). Figure out where you fit into the business and stick with that market, let your photo's do the talking.
Message edited by author 2008-08-20 16:55:11. |
|
|
|
08/20/2008 05:00:25 PM · #4 |
| I have asked myself this very same question over the last 2 years. Unfortunately, sometimes it *is* about price. You need to make sure you are pricing yourself based on your ability to capture images in comparison to other photographers in your area who do similar work. That being said, and assuming you've done this, sometimes people will still look for *price* rather than talent. Sometimes this can be a very hard pill to swallow. Case in point: my niece is getting married in October. I've been trying to book her wedding since she got engaged in January. I sent numerous emails, had several phone conversations with her, met with her and her fiance for over an hour, etc. In the end she decided to go with someone "cheaper" - this from a girl whose family is spending at *least* $20K on the wedding and reception. I hope she'll be happy with the result of what she's paying for. I've decided to just accept the fact that some people are bargain-hunters, plain and simple, and that isn't the client base that I want to work with. With DSLRs being more and more affordable, there will also be those who choose to call themselves photographers and work for next to nothing. Most of them won't stick around very long because they need to eat and pay bills like the rest of us, so don't worry about them - focus on your own work and find ways to set yourself apart from others. Keep at it, and look for every opportunity you can to get your name and work out in front of others! |
|
|
|
08/21/2008 12:17:35 AM · #5 |
Photography Business. Photography may come first, but business is business regardless of the product or service.
Advertising can do several things - make people aware you exist, make the phone ring, bring in money, drive up/create demand. What do you want, or need to have happen? You can make the best art in the world but if no one knows about it you'll never sell it. You can sell it on price (walmart mentality) or status (lord and taylor, mercedes, gucci) or rarity( limit the availability). Regardless you have to have a consistent, salable product, a system in place to produce it (workflow, product, filing/accounting, etc).
Advertising could be used to send 100 weddings to you. Can you shoot 100 weddings? Probably not (in one year). So you can turn away the biz, hire shooters to shoot for you, or raise your prices for the 20 weddings you can do. Supply and demand - advertising creates the demand.
You can use low cost guerrilla advertsing, word of mouth is always one way of doing it. But you can't force word of mouth to happen (which is why it's the best advertising). It takes time to have satisfied clients that spread the word. So do like the government - got a problem? Throw money at it! I keep asking business owners what they spend on advertising - the big photogs spend 15-20% of their sales (or what they want their sales to be). Samples are advertising, as well as ads or giveaways, website, etc. I'm at the county fair this year and I got to talking to a home improvement company that's been around 31 years. The owner does $3.5 million in sales a year and spends $300,000 to $350,000 a year in advertising - 10% of sales. And he gets lots of referrals/WOM - but still spends a ton of money to keep the business rolling in.
It also takes a while to get the business (unless you can throw money at it) and some luck. Right place at the right time type of thing - preparation meets opportunity one can say.
Key to success is persistance - most people give up before succeeding. Don't give up and you can't fail!
|
|
|
|
08/21/2008 01:41:45 AM · #6 |
| there's a great article in the new Rangefinder Mag. i think you might enjoy. link to online version |
|
|
|
08/23/2008 10:46:03 AM · #7 |
Quality shows... in time. Like you said, you've been working and studying. That will show through. When you're confronted with a difficult lighting and/or other situation and you know what to do, people remember that. It may not be as quick as you'd like ( I know it seems to take ages for me) but word of mouth does go around. YOU have the know-how, and YOU have the experience and the professional business habits, YOU know what your doing (and if you don't, your going to learn). So don't worry about every Bob and Better with a DSLR. They aren't competition. Not because they aren't good, but because you've put the work into it. Hard work always pays off.
Advance your style, shoot what you like, not what is popular (unless you just happen to like what's popular) and people will come to you. Not everyone will like your style, but the ones that do will talk about it. Besides, if EVERYONE liked your style, you would have a major overload. ; )
Don't second guess yourself, but DO look at yourself with a critical eye and listen to customers. Photography is a moving, growing thing. You can move forward in your own style, but you will have to keep pace.
Good business practices go a long way. Read etiquette books even if you have good manners. Learn the trade, and don't ever stop learning.
I wish you well, and I hope something in the above was helpful! |
|
|
|
08/23/2008 11:05:36 AM · #8 |
thank you all everybody very much for your replies.
I'm gonna set up an advertising plan in the coming week. Not the usual small piece in the papers, but in a different way.
I've been thinking about this a lot the past couple of days and talked about it with some people. That helped to get it a bit off my chest, but it's still eating me a bit. But I think that will pass.
I've realised I have to believe in myself. That's something that's been hard for me in my whole life, but if I don't, I won't be happy with the things I do in photography. I'm not gonna step down with my style and shoot what other people like, the commercial way, because I believe my style is different and from a quality of it's own (see, I can do it, I can believe in myself!)
|
|
|
|
08/23/2008 12:13:54 PM · #9 |
A Smile, A Handshake, and 3 business cards.
Make yourself visible to the market your looking for...make it obvious that you are a photographer. Say Hi to people, lots of people like to talk about photography. If they show any interest offer a card and give them 3. 1 for them and 2 to hand out(let them know this). It works AWESOME!!! and is super cheep.
I have been thinking of getting a wind jacket printed with
"I'LL SHOOT YOU IN A HEARTBEAT"
Scott Stanley Photography
(phonenumber)
(website)
Getting comfortable with approaching people to sell your service takes time and lots of practice. But works awesome! For an Example..I am a framer by trade I build new homes. When I see someone with lawnchairs or a BBQ in their new sod back yard I know these people want to spend time in their yard...I let them know I build decks and fences..WHAM!!!..SOLD! Lots of people just don't know where to look so they wait for it to come to them or for a referral from friends or family. |
|
|
|
08/23/2008 08:18:10 PM · #10 |
Originally posted by DarkRider:
I have been thinking of getting a wind jacket printed with
"I'LL SHOOT YOU IN A HEARTBEAT"
Scott Stanley Photography
(phonenumber)
(website)
|
HA! Brilliant idea. I love the jacket. Please post pictures if you ever do this.
The three business cards though, I'm not so crazy about. I think it makes you look a little needy (not the image you want to portray). It's a little unprofessional in my book. Give them one, and they can show it to others if they want.
But that jacket... brilliant. : D |
|
|
|
08/23/2008 10:51:39 PM · #11 |
| Ron Foxcroft was a guest speaker back in College (Inventor of the Fox40 Whistle and Owner of Fluke Transportation) was the one that told me to use the 3 cards. It has worked wonders for me. I have had lots of calls "got your card from a friend". |
|
|
|
08/24/2008 01:01:15 AM · #12 |
Find something inspiring or fun to do. If it helps build some public recognition all the better.
I wanted to do a Trash The Dress with a wedding dress. I got some prom dresses instead. So far so good, it's been fun. Then the past two days it's starting to take off - and I don't know where it may lead.
I cover the county fair for their scrap book in exchange for a commercial booth and some advertising. It is what you make of it, and this year i've made a lot of it. I am the Queen's personal papparrazzi for one - and that makes if fun and interesting.
I got my TTD model to come out for a few hours and trash a dress at the fair - talk about getting noticed! Take a pretty girl in a prom gown out into the muddy arena 15 minutes before the Demo Derby starts with 5,000 people watching in the stands. Fun? YOU BET! Better yet was the rumour that spread that said it was the Fair Queen sitting in the mud. Nope. But today the Queen did sit in mud in a prom dress...and a lot more. Fun? YOU BET!
Here's one from yesterday. Am I psyched and motivated? YES! Am I getting noticed as a photographer that doesn't do the same old sh!t as everyone else? YOU BET! I have a blog and school starts Monday - do you think I'll get a bajillion hits when I post the pics of the fair queen (and the princess came too in this dress here)? The princess is already spreading it around like wildfire that I got a pic of her milking a goat (ok, i have mentioned I live in a rather rural area haven't I?)
What is exposure like this worth?
//www.pbase.com/cpphotography/image/102048602.jpg
//www.pbase.com/cpphotography/image/102048603.jpg
|
|
|
|
08/24/2008 10:08:46 AM · #13 |
Originally posted by DarkRider:
Ron Foxcroft was a guest speaker back in College (Inventor of the Fox40 Whistle and Owner of Fluke Transportation) was the one that told me to use the 3 cards. It has worked wonders for me. I have had lots of calls "got your card from a friend". |
Maybe it's a regional thing. A good deal of people here would look at you like your crazy if you gave them three cards, but hey if it works, do it. ; ) |
|
|
|
08/24/2008 10:49:57 AM · #14 |
| don't stop dreamin!!! once you know what you want to do ---you'll figure out how to do it!! believe in the dream!!it will all work out! |
|
Home -
Challenges -
Community -
League -
Photos -
Cameras -
Lenses -
Learn -
Help -
Terms of Use -
Privacy -
Top ^
DPChallenge, and website content and design, Copyright © 2001-2025 Challenging Technologies, LLC.
All digital photo copyrights belong to the photographers and may not be used without permission.
Current Server Time: 08/10/2025 06:37:37 PM EDT.
