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06/21/2008 03:43:38 AM · #51 |
| This is going to be appealed and it will be won. The judge made an error and another judge will correct her. No big deal. If it were my kid, I would sue her for the court costs and send the bill to my ex. |
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06/21/2008 04:59:37 AM · #52 |
Originally posted by Jac:
This is going to be appealed and it will be won. The judge made an error and another judge will correct her. No big deal. If it were my kid, I would sue her for the court costs and send the bill to my ex. |
Which is great for precedent, but the kid still got her way and went on her trip... |
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06/21/2008 06:17:15 AM · #53 |
Originally posted by BeeCee:
Originally posted by Jac:
This is going to be appealed and it will be won. The judge made an error and another judge will correct her. No big deal. If it were my kid, I would sue her for the court costs and send the bill to my ex. |
Which is great for precedent, but the kid still got her way and went on her trip... |
It's the mother who got her kid to get her way. This wasn't hatched from the kid's mind.
This would definitely change my relationship with my daughter if it happened to my family. |
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06/21/2008 07:54:51 AM · #54 |
So where is this law of " no spanking"? I am one of those workers, and I do believe it is abuse of a child that one can not do. There is a difference between abuse and spanking/discipline.....
I to am appaled by the article, to me it sounded like major custody battle between parents and girl decided to carry it further , also at 12 years old and "inappropriate" in internet pics, isn't that teen porn? What about the pervs out there watching this? I agree dad should pack her stuff and get her out, but sounded like he had done this by moving her back w/ mom.....Course was the attorney a GAL or defense attorney? There is a difference.....Maybe they ought to put her in the book camp where there is no internet, no friends, etc....no what all it's cracked up tobe, maybe dad doesn't look so bad after all...lol
Courseover the years in my state we have had a few bratty kids end up in prison for killing parents for making rules at age 16 when they have had none all their lives....
If parents raise their kids w/ respect and teach them what No means in the beginning, you wouldn't have bratting children. Children love structure in their lives, course they never tell you that...lol
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06/21/2008 08:32:08 AM · #55 |
of course I am also wondering about the girlfriends parents? There should be a charge of contributing and failure to protect if you have 2 teens posting inappropriate pics on line.........There are pervs out there you know?
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06/21/2008 09:03:57 AM · #56 |
Originally posted by Jimbo_for_life:
well, heres the new age alternitive! if your kid is going crazy, bring them to the doctor(rather than letting them go burn up the energy they have by running around outside, getting cuts and scrapes like a normal kid and learning from them) and the doc will either say they are A: bipolar B:ADD or C:some other new syndrom as to why i kid has energy. and they can drug them up with druglh-283(notice, it cures all 3 syndroms/disorders.... and then the parents can be on there way... they did this to a girl that lived down the street from me, she got to be so rough and tough in childhood, then they drugged her up, and in highschool she was put in with in with the mentaly challenged/special needs kids, its a shame to see what the world is comming to.... sorry if i offend anyone by what i wrote, im not trying to, its just the truth of today. |
Yup, unfortunately this is true. I know a couple (seriously messed up individuals) with an 8 year old that they have had diagnosed as both bipolar and ADD. And the kid is drugged out of his gourd. Still an annoying brat, because his parents pay no attention to him except when using him as a pawn in their own war. It's a shame that folks can reproduce at will. |
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06/21/2008 09:08:55 AM · #57 |
I agree, been in the buisness for along time and I am appaled at the pyscotropic meds they give kids these days.......
Bi polar is the new catch all phrasefor mental health these days, glad I am not in THAT field...
And we thought the 70's was the age of the stoners! HA!
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06/21/2008 09:48:38 AM · #58 |
"the girl used a court-appointed lawyer in her parents' 10-year custody dispute to launch her landmark case against dear old dad"
A 12-year-old has been part of a 10-year custody dispute. This means her parents have been in and out of court with her since she was 2. If adults, her parents, can't sort out life questions outside court, is it that surprising that she'd start acting like this too?
Instead of blaming the girl, I'd wonder about the people who brought her up this way... |
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06/21/2008 09:57:58 AM · #59 |
Its people like this that give the human race such a disgraceful taste.
There is an alien up there...somewhere....rolling over laughing at the stupidity of people..... |
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06/21/2008 10:04:40 AM · #60 |
Originally posted by purpleflutterby13:
"the girl used a court-appointed lawyer in her parents' 10-year custody dispute to launch her landmark case against dear old dad"
A 12-year-old has been part of a 10-year custody dispute. This means her parents have been in and out of court with her since she was 2. If adults, her parents, can't sort out life questions outside court, is it that surprising that she'd start acting like this too?
Instead of blaming the girl, I'd wonder about the people who brought her up this way... |
Like I said before, it's not the girl who instigated this, it's her mother. Newspapers are making it sound like it's the girl, all by her little self, that started the procedures against her dad. It's the mother's fault this went to court and it proves once again that some parents need to be s spade or neutered, just like animals, for the protection of children.
Court appointed lawyers in this province means the woman cannot afford a lawyer so the state pays for one. If she wants to take the husband to court for buying the wrong cereal for her kid, she'll be able to do it because she pays diddly squat to the lawyer or to the government while the husband has to pay for his lawyer because he makes just enough money to not be illegible for court appointed lawyers. Great system, isn't it? I have seen some woman burn out some men by dragging them in court until the man loses it and abandons everything and is seen as the guilty party when in reality he is just trying to stay afloat by not paying crazy lawyer fees. |
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06/21/2008 10:18:17 AM · #61 |
Originally posted by Jac:
Originally posted by purpleflutterby13:
"the girl used a court-appointed lawyer in her parents' 10-year custody dispute to launch her landmark case against dear old dad"
A 12-year-old has been part of a 10-year custody dispute. This means her parents have been in and out of court with her since she was 2. If adults, her parents, can't sort out life questions outside court, is it that surprising that she'd start acting like this too?
Instead of blaming the girl, I'd wonder about the people who brought her up this way... |
Like I said before, it's not the girl who instigated this, it's her mother. Newspapers are making it sound like it's the girl, all by her little self, that started the procedures against her dad. It's the mother's fault this went to court and it proves once again that some parents need to be s spade or neutered, just like animals, for the protection of children.
Court appointed lawyers in this province means the woman cannot afford a lawyer so the state pays for one. If she wants to take the husband to court for buying the wrong cereal for her kid, she'll be able to do it because she pays diddly squat to the lawyer or to the government while the husband has to pay for his lawyer because he makes just enough money to not be illegible for court appointed lawyers. Great system, isn't it? I have seen some woman burn out some men by dragging them in court until the man loses it and abandons everything and is seen as the guilty party when in reality he is just trying to stay afloat by not paying crazy lawyer fees. |
My understanding is that the girl has her own attorney appointed to her because she's in the middle of a long, drawn out and messy custody battle. Basically, since the court doesn't feel that either parent is really interested in the child's best interest, the court appointed someone whose job it is to do just that.
I don't know how it is in Canada, but here in the US, court-appointed attorneys are not available to adults for civil/family cases like divorce.
Message edited by author 2008-06-21 10:21:07. |
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06/21/2008 11:10:20 AM · #62 |
| I'm dismayed at the people -- most of them parents -- saying they'd kick a twelve-year-old girl out of the house to fend for herself. That's not only impractical, cruel, and illegal, it's horrifyingly heartless, irrespective of whatever way the situation is twisted to make it appear to be a social slight against the parent. If ever there was unconditional love, surely it's what a parent has for his only daughter. |
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06/21/2008 11:57:09 AM · #63 |
Originally posted by Louis:
I'm dismayed at the people -- most of them parents -- saying they'd kick a twelve-year-old girl out of the house to fend for herself. That's not only impractical, cruel, and illegal, it's horrifyingly heartless, irrespective of whatever way the situation is twisted to make it appear to be a social slight against the parent. If ever there was unconditional love, surely it's what a parent has for his only daughter. |
Kind of drastic to me to kick a 12 year old out onto the streets. There's a lesson to be learned from this for everyone involved including the judge. This judge should be reprimanded but I live in Canada and I know that won't happen. Judges on a mission to change the world should be disbarred from their positions. |
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06/21/2008 02:27:51 PM · #64 |
With the recent spat of decisions by judges like this sort of crap, I've become more convinced that the solution to reform is not in fact killing all the lawyers - but rather the judges. I made this realization when I discovered that for all the sleazeballness of lawyers - they're powerless without crappy judges.
But really, I think we need to drag these judges out in public and tar and feather them. Like the judge who recently would not let a raped woman use any terminology to describe her incident. If that was my daughter, that judge would find himself not making much more decisions.
I believe in the rule-of-law, so long as it is accomplishing justice - if it is failing to do so, then I believe everyone has the inherent right to take justice in hand. Some view vigilantism as evil. I do not. If you tell me that my daughter was brutally raped by a repeat offender who is an illegal alien who has repeatedly been caught only to be handed over to Mexican authorities and released. Then sorry, I will take matters into my own hands. It's the right of EVERY father in a society who's system of justice has fallen into corruption and incompetance.
The truth...this judge was just trying to make a name for themselves. And it's dispicable. |
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06/21/2008 07:00:45 PM · #65 |
| I was surprised this didn't happen in Florida. Canada is the new Florida I guess. ...but much colder. |
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06/21/2008 07:30:01 PM · #66 |
... after sober second thoughts I do believe I will refrain from jousting with that person that attacked my heritage.
Ray
Message edited by author 2008-06-21 19:33:01. |
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06/21/2008 10:23:06 PM · #67 |
If it were my daughter, I'd tell her, "The judge says I can't ground you, but she didn't say anything about whooping your ass with a belt little girl." ;)
Message edited by author 2008-06-21 22:23:32.
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06/21/2008 10:26:03 PM · #68 |
Originally posted by Mick:
If it were my daughter, I'd tell her, "The judge says I can't ground you, but she didn't say anything about whooping your ass with a belt little girl." ;) |
Actually, with the proposed new law one would be charge for spanking their child in Canada.
Ray |
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06/21/2008 10:50:05 PM · #69 |
Originally posted by RayEthier:
Originally posted by Mick:
If it were my daughter, I'd tell her, "The judge says I can't ground you, but she didn't say anything about whooping your ass with a belt little girl." ;) |
Actually, with the proposed new law one would be charge for spanking their child in Canada.
Ray |
That's probably because of all the pussy draft dodgers that ran off to Canada.
No problem. Drag her across the border, whoop her behind, then take her home.
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06/21/2008 10:54:08 PM · #70 |
Originally posted by Mick:
Originally posted by RayEthier:
Originally posted by Mick:
If it were my daughter, I'd tell her, "The judge says I can't ground you, but she didn't say anything about whooping your ass with a belt little girl." ;) |
Actually, with the proposed new law one would be charge for spanking their child in Canada.
Ray |
That's probably because of all the pussy draft dodgers that ran off to Canada.
No problem. Drag her across the border, whoop her behind, then take her home. |
What pray tell would have you suggest such a thing. Surely you have an appreciation of the fact that none of the draft dodger could hold office here. As it relates to the second part of your comment, where you committed the offense is not an issue of consideration. If the charge can be corroborated you would find yourself before the tribunals.
Ray
Message edited by author 2008-06-21 22:57:54. |
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06/21/2008 11:32:27 PM · #71 |
Originally posted by Louis:
I'm dismayed at the people -- most of them parents -- saying they'd kick a twelve-year-old girl out of the house to fend for herself. That's not only impractical, cruel, and illegal, it's horrifyingly heartless, irrespective of whatever way the situation is twisted to make it appear to be a social slight against the parent. If ever there was unconditional love, surely it's what a parent has for his only daughter. |
I don't know......I'd certainly have to think really hard about where I'm placing my love and allegiance if my kid ever went and got a lawyer if I grounded her.
That whole concept is inconceivable to me with the relationship I do have with my 13 year old daughter, but that's crossing a pretty serious line.
I'd pretty much have to assume if my own kid sued me a half dozen years before majority that the relastionship was done.
I have unconditonal LOVE for my little girl, but I don't know if I could LIVE with her if she sued me for grounding her.
But that's such an alien concept to me......
Actually, my wife and I were just talking the other day about what a great kid she is, and how lucky we are that she is so terrific.
We figure all the bad sh*t skipped a generation......if we'd gotten the kid we deserved, she'd have horns and fangs!
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06/21/2008 11:49:17 PM · #72 |
Originally posted by NikonJeb:
...if we'd gotten the kid we deserved, she'd have horns and fangs! |
ROFL, that may be true for far more here than will admit, lol! We definitely weren't angels growing up and we tested the waters of defiance many a time, but NEVER, never would have had the gall to do something like suing my parents. My brain wasn't wired to even think about something like that. (Plus, my dad was the deputy states attorney, so not cool...muahahaha) Kids today seem to have so much more "nerve" and...and....uh...."confidence" towards adults and authority than we did as kids. Very brazen in their actions.
Edited for typo...
Message edited by author 2008-06-21 23:50:05. |
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06/21/2008 11:52:00 PM · #73 |
There's kind of a larger issue lurking in the background here, a very troubling one. Stepping away from this particular case, which does seem pretty ludicrous on the face of it, let's look at what's actually going on, in an institutionalized way, in America right now. I say "America" because that's all I can speak to from personal experience.
Think about what everyone's been saying here: "If MY daughter...." this/that/or the other.... Notice the possessive?
Now, for the longest time, that's been the real, practical state of affairs; for all intents and purposes you OWNED your children until they reached maturity. As we moved into the 20th century it started to be the case that if you really, really did awful things you could "lose" your children, but it really didn't happen all that often.
But since, say, the early 70's (I'm not sure when this change really accelerated) the state became more and more involved in overseeing the welfare of children. "Family Services" has become an institution in its own right and it is, in many ways, a dangerous one. Why? Because it's about the only legal area in this country where you are guilty until proven innocent (with the possible exception of tax laws). Family Services can, and frequently do, remove children from the custody of their parents with little or no tangible evidence, just a suspicion, on the premise that it's critically important to "protect the child" while the truth of the matter is being investigated. And those investigations can stretch on easily for months, and often for years. It's completely pathetic. I have seen good families torn irredeemably apart by the actions of "Family Services" and "Child Protective".
And the kids are learning this, they are smart that way. They know if they are pissed off all they have to do is make baseless accusations to a person in authority, who is bound by law to report the accusations even if s/he doesn't really believe them, and the shit will hit the fan.
What does this have to do with the case that prompted this thread? Not a whole lot, except that the mere fact that the judge is willing and able to render a decision like that shows how far away we have strayed from family autonomy (the backbone of any strong society IMO) and into government control of individuals' lives. The bottom line is, extrapolating from rulings like this one can easily imagine a situation where the courts deny, for example, a parent's right to raise his child "in the church" (whichever church is relevant, be it orthodox Judaism, say, or Catholicism, whatever) if the child simply says he doesn't want to do it.
Because here the court has said, in so many words, that the parent does not have the right to make and enforce rules, basically. And that's just insane, if you ask me...
R.
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06/21/2008 11:58:34 PM · #74 |
| The dad should counter sue her for terrorising him..... maybe THEY can send her to some Bay... |
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06/22/2008 12:21:25 AM · #75 |
It's coming to a country near you soon:
Wiki Link, "Wild in the Streets"
It's a bit of a read, but I remember seeing the movie when it came out, and wondered if it would ever really happen.
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