High ISO noise, amplified? - DPChallenge Forums

Pentax DA 18-55mm f/3.5-5.6 AF

02/24/2008 03:24:35 PM · #1

I took some pictures of a friends gig last night, mostly for practice. I used ISO 1600 (a combination of deliberate act and then forgetting to set back afterwards), and while the color picture is pretty noisy- the b&w conversions seem to have amplified the noise massively- is there a way to avoid this? (I used the channel mixer)

Here are the (semi) usable shots.

chris48083

Pentax K10D

02/24/2008 03:40:03 PM · #2

where you shooting with a flash? you seem to be overexposing a bit, which will contribute to more noise, when i shoot gigs i shoot with apature priority (so i can set it to the biggest apature and let the camera figure out what the apprioprate shutter speed is on the fly, since its the biggest apature (f3.5 and lower) it will also be the fastest reasonable shutter speed). try also using the noise reduction in photoshop or noise ninja.

nice shots though, people are usually pretty tolerant grain/noise when you are talking about live stuff like that, its the worst possible condistions to shoot in (fast action in low light).

edit: remember image content far outways quality. if you have a shot that is noisey or grainy but the shot is AWESOME, then you have a shot, do what you can to get rid of it, but capture the moment first.

Message edited by author 2008-02-24 15:42:57.

02/24/2008 03:47:23 PM · #3

Yeah, I was either bouncing from the side wall or above in most of the shots (except that of the dummer, I was couldnt bounce for him so it had to be direct flash and f19 to control the light). Im pretty bummed about the overexposure, I think they were panic shots ;)

Cheers Chris, it was my first attempt at that sort of shooting, and now I know I still have so much to learn! Focusing on the vocalist was a pain, running all over the shop lol. So many of my shots were unusable, annoying as they looked fine in the LCD.

Thanks for your help!

MelonMusketeer

Nikon D7000

Nikon MF 50mm f/1.4

02/24/2008 03:55:48 PM · #4

If you had to shoot at f19 to control the flash level at iso 1600, you should have lowered iso to 400 or maybe 200. I usually try to shoot that type situation with wide open aperture, iso 400 or 800, and adjust the flash back some for closer shots, and back up for long shots. You were close in for the ones you posted.
Try practice shooting in a similar place and lighting, and see what you can get from your camera with different settings. I agree that with the kinds of shots you were going after, the grain is not a show stopper. It gives the photos a 1960's ish look, like push processed triX pan B&W film.

Pentax DA 18-55mm f/3.5-5.6 AF

02/24/2008 04:04:14 PM · #5

Yes I think lower ISO for the direct shot would have been much better. I had been using 1600 before for a shot with no flash (again, of the dummer), and in a panic of trying to get all the shots forgot to set it back to a lower ISO. I had also tried 1600 and f1.8 at the beginning with spot metering, but with no luck- the place they were playing in was basically the corner of a dark bar on the floor, no lighting etc. I had originally planned to shoot with no flash, but when I got to the venue I soon found that it would be impossible. The rest, as I mentioned- is me being forgetful haha :S

edit: Does anyone know if its something in the b&w conversion (through the channel mixer) that seems to amplify the noise?

Message edited by author 2008-02-24 16:11:10.

chris48083

Pentax K10D

02/24/2008 04:10:16 PM · #6

Originally posted by andersbs:

So many of my shots were unusable, annoying as they looked fine in the LCD.

amen to that!! that is the most rediculasly frustrating thing on this planet (even more so then politics and girlfriends).

melonmusketeer is right on, keep shooting these events, they are a ton of fun and you can make some decent money at it if you get good. keep us posted on how things turn out!

Nikon AF-S Nikkor 70-200mm f/2.8G ED VR II

02/24/2008 04:14:33 PM · #7

Thanks guys!

Oh yes haha, there's me kneeling during the gig between photos thinking 'I can't wait to see these full size!', little did I know.... ;) Hopefully they'll do some more soon, i'd love to get the chance to take some more shots- but this time coming a little more prepared with knowledge! (and a little less forgetfullness)

MattO

Nikon D4

02/24/2008 05:06:35 PM · #8

One of the shots shows aperture priority with +2/3 exposure and you were using flash. I also saw F19 in some shots, I would recommend going full manual and using ETTL on the flash. Shoot wide open with your prime or stop down just a touch. You should easily be able to go to 800 ISO F2.5 and then you will have alot better shots.

Matt

02/24/2008 05:15:36 PM · #9

Thanks Matt, I have a friend who does this kind of photography a lot, and he shoots manual. I think I should give it a go next time, im very glad to have my 50mm- having the f1.8 makes life a little easier in this situation.

MelonMusketeer

Nikon D7000

Nikon MF 50mm f/1.4

02/24/2008 08:53:02 PM · #10

Here's a blast from the past for ya. It's from the days when I used to play music and shoot photos at places where we were playing.
[thumb]650775[/thumb]

Canon 12x IS USM (S3 IS built-in Lens) -- 36-432mm (35mm EQ)

02/25/2008 03:52:20 AM · #11

Sweet! What kind of music were you playing? I sort of wish my vocalist would have stayed still, it was slightly difficult to focus on someone dressed in black and running back and forth!

danielv

Canon EOS-350D Rebel XT

Canon EF 85mm f/1.8 USM

02/25/2008 08:26:51 AM · #12

you should reduce noise before converting to B+W. a color shot has more information, and gives better result for noise reduction. Especially if you shot in RAW.

Message edited by author 2008-02-25 08:27:22.

MelonMusketeer

Nikon D7000

Nikon MF 50mm f/1.4

02/25/2008 09:08:11 AM · #13

Originally posted by andersbs:

Sweet! What kind of music were you playing? I sort of wish my vocalist would have stayed still, it was slightly difficult to focus on someone dressed in black and running back and forth!

In that case, focus on a spot that you know your subject will cross, and time your shot to catch the subject at that spot.

We were playing a mix of country-rock and Southern rock at the time. Before that it was all the current stuff from late 60's early 70's like Zep, Santana,Stones,Deep Purple,Hendrix ect. That didn't sell well in the area we lived in, so we switched to a more laid back music. We wrote about 1/4 of the music that we played.

GeneralE

Canon PowerShot S3 IS

02/25/2008 09:46:29 AM · #14

Originally posted by andersbs:

edit: Does anyone know if its something in the b&w conversion (through the channel mixer) that seems to amplify the noise?

I usually find that the most noise is in the Blue channel, and the least in the Green channel. If I want a grainy look I will often copy just the Blue channel to a grayscale image, and sometimes I'll "convert" to B&W by just using the Green channel.

If you look at the channels separately before starting the conversion, you should be able to tell where the worst of the noise is.