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02/22/2008 06:28:07 PM · #1 |
I suck at computer networking. That's what I've decided.
We have a bunch of computers here at home, and I have no trouble with any of them accessing the Internet via my router (Linksys WRT54GS v2). My problem is in getting the computers to consistently recognize each other, and to be able to share printers properly.
I just got a new laptop, and when I view the network, it will show a combination of random computers in the house, or often it won't show any of them. It just seems like my computers drift in and out of the network with no rhyme or reason to it. That's driving me bonkers. Why would they not show up consistently, when they're all connected with good signal strength? And yes, they're all assigned to the same workgroup.
For some weird reason, I was able to get my wife's computer to allow me to print on her printer through my old laptop, but I can't get it to print for my new laptop or my daughter's computer.
These things drive me nuts. If anyone has any insight based on what I've said here, please fire away. What am I doing wrong that would prevent the computers from always seeing each other? |
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02/22/2008 06:40:21 PM · #2 |
Do they all share the same workgroup name?
Right-click on the "My Computer" icon > select properties > click the tab that says "Computer Name" > The name under workgroup should all be the same.
In my house I use our last name as the workgroup name, but workgroup, home, or anything else is okay - as long as they are the same.
There should be a button named "Change" below that allows you to change the workgroup name.
This is a place to start ... of course it could be something else too :|
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02/22/2008 07:09:41 PM · #3 |
Do you have NetBeui protocol loaded in each Local Area Network connection? Is the computer your printer is connected to (assuming it's connected to a pritner somewhere) always turned on? If you turn the computer off, even if the printer is turned on, you won't be able to print to it. If you are running a stand alone print hub then it should be accessable all the time.
If you are running wireless, your network could be dropping out because of interference. Motors, microwaves, transmitters (ham radio or CB or something like that), etc., can interfer with your wireless router. Location can also affect it. People trying to hack into it from outside or in nearby apartments or houses will affect it also.
I assume you are getting a DHCP IP address from your internet provider. If so, you might also try doing a reset... open up a DOS window and type IPCONFIG /release (this will release your network info) and then IPCONFIG /renew (this will renew all of your network information.
When a computer drops off, see if you can ping it from another computer. If you can't, then it's not on the network at all and it could be the network card is asleep or locked up. Make sure your computer isn't going into hibernation or hard drives aren't going to sleep after a period of time. Go into your control panel and look for Power. Check that the drives don't turn off and it doesn't go into hybernation. It can drop off the network when it goes to sleep during idle periods.
Mike
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02/22/2008 07:11:16 PM · #4 |
| Do you have a firewall blocking IP addresses? I know Zone Alarm sometimes gives me fits, even if I give a whole range access. |
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02/22/2008 07:22:25 PM · #5 |
I've never gotten Windows networking to happily work with sharing printers and the like. Somehow, those much smarter than me seem to be able to get it working (such as at work), but at home, it never goes well.
Wish I could be more helpful. I'm guessing it has to do with workgroup names / permissions, but beyond that, I'm clueless. |
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02/22/2008 07:29:24 PM · #6 |
I'm lazy, so I just assign static IPs to each computer. When mapping drives or printers I type the path rather than browse for it because it's much faster. Then you can turn off DHCP in your router and your network gets a little bit more secure. Someday I'll get around to only allowing my MAC addresses, but, I'm lazy.
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02/22/2008 07:32:07 PM · #7 |
Originally posted by alanfreed:
What am I doing wrong that would prevent the computers from always seeing each other? |
If Windows, XP or Vista? |
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02/22/2008 09:25:44 PM · #8 |
They're all variations of Windows... the new laptop is Vista, and I have 4 XP machines. And again, yes... they're all in the same workgroup. When I say that things disappear on and off the network, I mean this can happen from one 5-minute period to the next. And it's not when interference would be an issue (like only when the microwave is on). Three of our computers are within feet of each other, and within feet of the router.
I dunno.
Originally posted by Louis:
Originally posted by alanfreed:
What am I doing wrong that would prevent the computers from always seeing each other? |
If Windows, XP or Vista? |
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02/22/2008 09:36:47 PM · #9 |
In a peer to peer network, one computer takes on the role of "master browser" and the other computers often take some time to register to it and show up when browsing the network. I run into the same thing and have frequently run into some customer networks where a device will not show when browsing. It's not reliable and it's an irritating side effect of the way this sort of file sharing works.
You should be able to access the shared item if you know the network pathname to the item, even if you cannot see it when browsing.
A workaround to this is when you are seeing the network share, right click on the computer or share, and create a shortcut to it on your desktop. Now you will always be able to click that icon and get to it.
Message edited by author 2008-02-22 21:37:36. |
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02/22/2008 09:58:49 PM · #10 |
I'm a network admin by trade. So far, Slippy and yospiff are on the case. The browsing process, which yospiff alluded to, is a big pile of crap in a windows environment. I too highly recommend talking to other computers directly rather than browsing to them. Specifically, click on Start, click on Run, type in \\computer (where computer is the name or IP address of the destination machine). This will bring up a window with all shared resources on the remote machine.
Feel free to shoot me PMs with specific questions, or post them here as well and I'll help you out. |
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02/22/2008 10:06:34 PM · #11 |
Do your computers connect via Ethernet or Wi-Fi?
If they connect via Wi-Fi have you checked to make sure they are not connecting to another wireless device that could have a stronger signal?
Are your computers' IP Addresses set statically or are they set for DHCP?
If they are set for DHCP what is the limit set for simultaneous DHCP clients on your router (default should be 25 or 50)?
Did you buy Windows Vista intentionally? (Hehe) |
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02/22/2008 10:11:23 PM · #12 |
I have the Linksys WRT54G. Did yours come with the setup CD?
Windows or Vista, should not matter.
Are all of your computers connected wireless or is your main computer hardwired in port 1?
Is your printer a wireless printer |
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02/22/2008 10:21:28 PM · #13 |
I'm going to guess that it's a problem with Vista. It doesn't like to play with XP with printers.
If you want to access an printer hosted by an XP-based machine using a Vista workstation, you need to attach to the printer in a somewhat non-intuitive way.
Here is a link to try.
Here
This is the way I have my pc's at home configured (2 xp, 2 Vista, 2 routers, 3 printers).
I have the same router - it shouldn't be causing a problem. Do make sure all the pcs are in the same workgroup.
Message edited by author 2008-02-22 22:22:32. |
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02/22/2008 10:36:39 PM · #14 |
Well, that's good to know (that the browsing process sucks by nature). And you are right about being able to access other machines directly -- that does work consistently, and I had actually mapped one of my network drives today for just that reason. I'll probably just continue mapping network drives that I use often, and that'll be that. I'm assuming that the laptop won't get too annoyed if I go somewhere and it can't find the mapped drives? I assume it just won't find them, and it'll be satisfied with that, instead of throwing some sort of fit like older machines used to (I can remember getting a bunch of pop-ups in Windows NT if it couldn't find a network drive during bootup).
Thanks to everyone else for responding... just to answer a couple other questions: YES! They're all in the same workgroup! :) I have a couple printers, no they're not wireless. They're attached to PCs on the network. The PCs all get their IPs through DHCP, not fixed IPs, and there are plenty more addresses available than what I'm using.
Oh... one question... yospiff... I was reading your comments about having one PC that acts as a "master browser." Is it possible to assign a certain machine to that task? How do I know which one is currently doing that? I wonder if the machine in my basement is doing that -- it would have the weakest signal of any of them.
In case it helps, here's the whole network. Geez, what a tangled mess:
New Laptop: "Krusty" - Windows Vista
Old Laptop: "Homer" - Windows XP
Wife's Computer: "Marge" - Windows XP Pro (with a printer that I have only been able to connect to on old laptop)
Daughter's Computer: "Flanders" - Windows XP
Downstairs Computer: "Smithers" - Windows XP (has an Epson printer attached to it. Vista machine doesn't like it)
Other WiFI devices (which don't normally use home networking stuff):
Palm TX
Wii
Wife's work computer
Originally posted by freakin_hilarious:
The browsing process, which yospiff alluded to, is a big pile of crap in a windows environment. |
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02/22/2008 10:38:18 PM · #15 |
Originally posted by alanfreed:
They're all variations of Windows... the new laptop is Vista, and I have 4 XP machines. And again, yes... they're all in the same workgroup. When I say that things disappear on and off the network, I mean this can happen from one 5-minute period to the next. And it's not when interference would be an issue (like only when the microwave is on). Three of our computers are within feet of each other, and within feet of the router.
I dunno.
Originally posted by Louis:
Originally posted by alanfreed:
What am I doing wrong that would prevent the computers from always seeing each other? |
If Windows, XP or Vista? |
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Try this: On your Vista laptop, click Start/Control Panel/Network and Sharing. Under "Sharing and Discovery", ensure "Network discovery" and "File sharing" are "On" (logged on with an account with admin privelages, usually this is default).
This is to ensure basic file and printer sharing stuff works in Vista so you can use your wife's printer. You may have a lower-level network problem, and some of the other suggestions might be more suitable - but they might not be. Your WRT54GS wireless router and the protocol it's using might be the cause (I have that LinkSys wireless router and have the occassional problem). |
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02/22/2008 10:47:57 PM · #16 |
| I think it is possible to assign one computer as the master browser, but i'll have to research what needs to be done to set it as a default. I'll get back to you on that. |
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02/22/2008 10:49:09 PM · #17 |
Originally posted by Louis:
Try this: On your Vista laptop, click Start/Control Panel/Network and Sharing. Under "Sharing and Discovery", ensure "Network discovery" and "File sharing" are "On" (logged on with an account with admin privelages, usually this is default). |
Yup, they were already "on."
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02/22/2008 10:54:22 PM · #18 |
ahem ... Ok Administrators... let an Engineer take a crack at this ... :)
The WRT54G by default blocks port 137 138 139 and 445 by default.
These are the well known ports that are normally associated with file sharing on m$ ad-hoc networks.
Make sure that on your router these ports are open to the INSIDE of your network.
NEVER the outside. Once this is done they should be able to see each other by name
Message edited by author 2008-02-22 22:55:06. |
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02/22/2008 11:03:22 PM · #19 |
They DO see each other by name, but only intermittently. So I'm guessing this isn't the issue -- otherwise I'd never see the other names. I think that yospiff and others are probably on the right track by saying that the computer assigned the task of "master browser" is probably an issue.
I definitely appreciate the help... but I think that some of the suggestions posted earlier can be shot down by the fact that "sometimes" everything does show up on the list of networked computers. Some of these things I would think should only be true if I *never* saw the other names show up.
In any event, I'm all goofed up on NyQuil, so I'm calling it a night. I'm mostly hoping that I can get at least one printer to work, since it'll stink to have to e-mail things to myself elsewhere on the network to print them. Very Amish :)
Originally posted by nomad469:
ahem ... Ok Administrators... let an Engineer take a crack at this ... :)
The WRT54G by default blocks port 137 138 139 and 445 by default.
These are the well known ports that are normally associated with file sharing on m$ ad-hoc networks.
Make sure that on your router these ports are open to the INSIDE of your network.
NEVER the outside. Once this is done they should be able to see each other by name |
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02/22/2008 11:09:28 PM · #20 |
It looks like a registry edit is needed to set a computer as the preferred master borwser, and if you are not comfortable with it and know what you are doing, then don't mess with the registry.
Here's a link with instructions on how to set a preferred master browser.
And here's another link with a lot of additional information on how this all works, and some more detailed explanations for this problem.
Message edited by author 2008-02-22 23:11:24. |
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02/22/2008 11:12:35 PM · #21 |
Originally posted by alanfreed:
...it'll stink to have to e-mail things to myself elsewhere on the network to print them. Very Amish :) |
Well, if you *really want to get Amish, there's always sneakernet! |
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02/22/2008 11:16:27 PM · #22 |
Originally posted by kirbic:
Well, if you *really want to get Amish, there's always sneakernet! |
My flashdrive has the volume name of "Sneakernet". Since I have to shuttle files between my main computer on the domain at work, and a number of others, some on an isolated network, it was the perfect name. |
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02/23/2008 07:54:34 AM · #23 |
Printers -> Add Printer -> Network Printer -> then use whatever the path is, like: \\smithers\EpsonShareName
It will suck the drivers from the other PC, assuming it's the same OS, otherwise, have the CD handy. Then the printer is mapped and you just select it from the Printer Drop-Down in Photoshop or Word or whatever you're printing from. It sounds to me as if you're browsing to your network printers everytime, ouch! Just map the darn thing and be done with it, no need for a Master Browser, type the flipping path in, map it, and be done with it.
If I lived nearby I'd come & do it for you for a beer.
Message edited by author 2008-02-23 07:56:42.
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02/23/2008 10:58:07 AM · #24 |
Originally posted by Strikeslip:
Printers -> Add Printer -> Network Printer -> then use whatever the path is, like: \\smithers\EpsonShareName |
Well, actually, I had gotten that far yesterday afternoon. The interesting thing is that it found the printer, added the printer, and it's set as my default printer. But when I print to it, nothing happens! The computer acts as though it's printing and never pops up an error to say that it didn't print, but the printer just sits there, quietly giggling at me. (And in the form of a disclaimer... YES, the printer is on. YES, the computer it's attached to is on. I'm bad at networking, but not THAT bad. :)
Originally posted by yospiff:
It looks like a registry edit is needed to set a computer as the preferred master borwser, and if you are not comfortable with it and know what you are doing, then don't mess with the registry. |
I have no fear of tinkering with the registry. I'll think about giving that a try. My thought is that maybe I'll set my daughter's computer to be the master browser since it is the only one I have hardwired to the router, and it's always on (and it's not a laptop). That way, every time I use the microwave, the network isn't scrambling to figure out who the master browser is, if that's what has been happening :)
Oh, and Slippy... you're only 4 1/2 hours away... c'mon down! :)
Message edited by author 2008-02-23 10:59:10. |
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02/23/2008 11:35:21 AM · #25 |
Originally posted by alanfreed:
Oh, and Slippy... you're only 4 1/2 hours away... c'mon down! :) |
There's always Remote Desktop Connection... |
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