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02/20/2008 01:16:01 PM · #1926 |
| Shall I post your last ten stats, Jeffrey? :) |
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02/20/2008 01:16:52 PM · #1927 |
Originally posted by Melethia:
You might want to post a request in a more general forum - ask what "second shooters" get paid, since essentially that's probably what you would be to start with. And take the ensuing advice with large grains of salt and thick skin in certain instances. :-) |
Well, in getting started with her "thick skin" I would venture to say that you should not expect to get paid a heck of a lot. Are you going to be helping with the post processing of the images as well? Or the meetings with the prospective bride/groom before and after the event?
Lots of folks are mesmorized by the "big bucks" that can be made but the truth is that it is not all that great when you take into account the total hours spent on the project. The shooting is actually the easy part. If you are just going to be a shooter then your take will be small. It will still be a great experience for you....however you might want to see if you can get in on the post processing as well. That would also really help for you to learn their requested style of shooting. They can show you what you shot, and then ask that you modify it next time or compliment you on a shot well done.
Just my 2 cents worth.... if 49 others give you their own you can get a coffee. ;)
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02/20/2008 01:20:47 PM · #1928 |
Originally posted by raish:
Boo hoo - it seems my convenient acdsee downloading has hoisted me on its petard as I shall now be dq'd from misunderstanding (of all things). |
Sorry to hear this. :( I take it you had it set to auto rotate images or something? If you have not shot a lot since, is there any chance you can use program to try and recover the original from the card, even if it has been erased?
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02/20/2008 01:35:00 PM · #1929 |
Originally posted by basssman7:
Originally posted by Melethia:
You might want to post a request in a more general forum - ask what "second shooters" get paid, since essentially that's probably what you would be to start with. And take the ensuing advice with large grains of salt and thick skin in certain instances. :-) |
Well, in getting started with her "thick skin" I would venture to say that you should not expect to get paid a heck of a lot. Are you going to be helping with the post processing of the images as well? Or the meetings with the prospective bride/groom before and after the event?
Lots of folks are mesmorized by the "big bucks" that can be made but the truth is that it is not all that great when you take into account the total hours spent on the project. The shooting is actually the easy part. If you are just going to be a shooter then your take will be small. It will still be a great experience for you....however you might want to see if you can get in on the post processing as well. That would also really help for you to learn their requested style of shooting. They can show you what you shot, and then ask that you modify it next time or compliment you on a shot well done.
Just my 2 cents worth.... if 49 others give you their own you can get a coffee. ;) |
They are looking to make whoever they hire into actual photographers for them, that would include processing, meeting with clients, etc. So I am assuming that the training would include these things: being present at client meetings, watching their pp techniques, etc. I guess basically I was looking to see what people thought would be a fair per/hr type wage while training. I would be an employee, not a contractor. I do know that their cheapest wedding package starts at 2k. I'm actually getting the impression, and this is only an impression, that they are looking to retire yet still own the business. He is 68 years old. I'm not sure of his wife's age. And again, this was all during one phone call. For all I know he might not even call back, though he did seem mighty interested, lol. I did answer an ad for this and who knows how many responses he's received. It's just that he left that one question hanging at the end and if/when he does call back I'd like to be able to give an answer that doesn't make me look like a complete idiot. |
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02/20/2008 02:02:04 PM · #1930 |
| Another couple of cents toward your coffee - if you can find somewhere to change Norwegian ører - you might want to talk about regular assessment. Couple of weeks on gopher money and then talk about jacking it up while at the same time discussing your future. After 2 weeks that would be your pretty immediate future, but if discussions of your terms of employment are regularly fixed on the agenda then it saves misunderstandings like you waiting for their initiative or them waiting for yours, etc, while little frustrations bubble away, looking for all the world like German dumplings. |
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02/20/2008 02:02:47 PM · #1931 |
Originally posted by Kelli:
They are looking to make whoever they hire into actual photographers for them, that would include processing, meeting with clients, etc. So I am assuming that the training would include these things: being present at client meetings, watching their pp techniques, etc. I guess basically I was looking to see what people thought would be a fair per/hr type wage while training. I would be an employee, not a contractor. I do know that their cheapest wedding package starts at 2k. I'm actually getting the impression, and this is only an impression, that they are looking to retire yet still own the business. He is 68 years old. I'm not sure of his wife's age. And again, this was all during one phone call. For all I know he might not even call back, though he did seem mighty interested, lol. I did answer an ad for this and who knows how many responses he's received. It's just that he left that one question hanging at the end and if/when he does call back I'd like to be able to give an answer that doesn't make me look like a complete idiot. |
Ok, that sheds a bit more light on the subject. :)
It is a tough one to answer, and I think if I were you I would try and hedge my bet a bit by saying that you would need to see the work that was expected of you before you can answer that question properly. Keep in mind that if they are serious they will want to pay you well enough that you do not simply learn what you can from them and then go off on your own where you do not have to give them a cut of the profit. Not to mention that they will want the best person for the job, if they are representing their business they built up over the years, and should then expect to pay more for the right person that will represent them well. :)
Let us know how it turns out. Good luck.
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02/20/2008 02:04:02 PM · #1932 |
Originally posted by basssman7:
Originally posted by raish:
Boo hoo - it seems my convenient acdsee downloading has hoisted me on its petard as I shall now be dq'd from misunderstanding (of all things). |
Sorry to hear this. :( I take it you had it set to auto rotate images or something? If you have not shot a lot since, is there any chance you can use program to try and recover the original from the card, even if it has been erased? |
Interesting tip. As the picture's running at 4.2 and I can't even remember which card the original was on, I doubt that I'll be bothered this time around, but I'll bear the thought in mind, thanks. |
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02/20/2008 02:11:25 PM · #1933 |
Originally posted by Melethia:
Shall I post your last ten stats, Jeffrey? :) |
My last 10 stats include a 1% and a 4%; maybe I should put the camera down.. |
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02/20/2008 02:12:42 PM · #1934 |
Originally posted by raish:
Another couple of cents toward your coffee - if you can find somewhere to change Norwegian ører - you might want to talk about regular assessment. Couple of weeks on gopher money and then talk about jacking it up while at the same time discussing your future. After 2 weeks that would be your pretty immediate future, but if discussions of your terms of employment are regularly fixed on the agenda then it saves misunderstandings like you waiting for their initiative or them waiting for yours, etc, while little frustrations bubble away, looking for all the world like German dumplings. |
ROFL! Do you also not appreciate a good german dumpling? I assure you, I don't believe I will stay at gopher status for long. Actually, I did some backwords detective work and located their website. While my scores may not reflect it, I may actually have a thing or two to teach them as well. |
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02/20/2008 02:17:46 PM · #1935 |
Originally posted by meyers:
Originally posted by Melethia:
Shall I post your last ten stats, Jeffrey? :) |
My last 10 stats include a 1% and a 4%; maybe I should put the camera down.. |
I can beat you there! |
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02/20/2008 02:24:51 PM · #1936 |
Hi all Suckers! I just posted this in a recent thread, but wanted to make sure you guys saw it, as it really is an awesome opportunity. I just got back from vacation out there, and was blown away:
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Rare Yellowstone Park / Cody, Wyoming / Rodeo Opportunity
Aug 1-3 2008
This is truly a âchance of a lifetimeâ opportunity to photograph wildlife, geysers, incredible scenery, waterfalls and flora. My uncle Bob Richards, who owns and operates Grub Steak Tours, was the last horse ranger in Yellowstone Park and knows the park and surrounding area inside and out â his knowledge of history, geology, folklore and photography are unbelievable. His father, Jack Richard, was one of the best-known photojournalists of the west and Yellowstone, and Bob has followed in his footsteps.
I recently toured Yellowstone and Cody with him as part of a family vacation, and was so impressed that I asked him about putting a package together for DPC. He is generously offering his tours at ½ price. His recommendation is a three-day tour including Yellowstone, the North Fork of the Shoshone River between Cody, WY and the park (which Teddy Roosevelt called âthe most scenic 50 miles in the US), and Grand Teton.
I haven't processed most of my photos from my recent trip, but here is a small sampling:
          
The itinerary is as follows:
July 31 â Thursday: Arrive in Cody, WY (there are direct flights from Denver, CO). As Bob has generously offered me the use of one of his vehicles, I can pick you up at the airport and take you to your hotel in downtown Cody. We can assist with hotel arrangements. Bob recommends The Americana Hotel, around $150 per night.
Aug 1 â Friday: 1st Day Tour of Yellowstone Park. Lunch is provided.
Aug 2 â Saturday: 2nd Day Tour of Yellowstone Park. Lunch is provided. Attend Cody Night Rodeo, the longest running rodeo in the United States, having operated for over 60 years. Many of the nation's greatest cowboys started their rodeo careers in Cody. Tickets are $17.00 each for adults. The rodeo begins at 8:00 PM.
Aug 3 â Sunday: Tour Grand Teton. Lunch is provided. Those needing to return home can do so.
Aug 4 â Monday: Return home.
Bob knows the places we are most likely to encounter mammals living in Yellowstone, big and small. When I toured with him this winter I saw wolves, bighorn sheep, bison (American buffalo), coyotes, snowshoe hares, trumpeter swans, eagles (both bald and golden), elk and a variety of other smaller mammals and birds. Moreover, Bob knew how to safely get me close enough to photograph them!
The price of this package is $225 per person or couple per day (there is a small surcharge for meals for couples). Bobâs usual rate is $450 per day.
Bob would like to limit this opportunity to six photographers, so it is first come, first serve. Further information on the company: //www.grubsteaktours.com. Please PM me for further info or post here.
Message edited by author 2008-02-20 14:27:14. |
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02/20/2008 02:47:06 PM · #1937 |
Originally posted by Melethia:
Shall I post your last ten stats, Jeffrey? :) |
To what end? I'm refuting your claim that you should stop entering challenges. :P :P and again :P
Kelli: I wouldn't worry too much about your pay at this point. That is, I'd suggest thinking about what would make it worth your time and effort. But I'd focus more on their expectations for the future and yours, and how long they expect it to be before that future arrives. So not so much "what will you pay me while I'm training" but "what will you pay me after I'm trained."
Even more important, perhaps, will be "will you allow me to shoot for clients who you can't take because of workload, and will I be required to charge your rates?"
Ernie: have you seen the prices of coffee lately? Can't remember the last time I bought a cup for $1. :) Then again, I rarely buy coffee, so maybe deflation has hit?
Catherine: Fantastic! Congrats again! :)
Message edited by author 2008-02-20 14:47:42.
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02/20/2008 03:22:03 PM · #1938 |
OMG ... OMG ... Just STOP!
I cannot believe I am seeing this animosity on the Team Suck Oasis forum. Please stop.
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02/20/2008 03:26:02 PM · #1939 |
Originally posted by noraneko:
Hi all Suckers! I just posted this in a recent thread, but wanted to make sure you guys saw it, as it really is an awesome opportunity. I just got back from vacation out there, and was blown away: |
Catherine this sounds so cool and I cannot wait to go thru your photos! I wish I could do this but it just cannot happen this year. Please post tho if you are going to organize something like this again some day. I'd love to save up and go.
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02/20/2008 03:58:41 PM · #1940 |
Originally posted by Greetmir:
OMG ... OMG ... Just STOP!
I cannot believe I am seeing this animosity on the Team Suck Oasis forum. Please stop. |
I don't see any animosity. Jeffrey is giving me a hard time in a good natured way because I'm depressed and discouraged and a bunch of other "d" words. But there's no animosity, I assure you. |
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02/20/2008 03:59:08 PM · #1941 |
Originally posted by Melethia:
Shall I post your last ten stats, Jeffrey? :) |
Go ahead and post my last ten, Deb! :-) |
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02/20/2008 04:03:02 PM · #1942 |
Originally posted by levyj413:
Originally posted by Melethia:
Shall I post your last ten stats, Jeffrey? :) |
To what end? I'm refuting your claim that you should stop entering challenges. :P :P and again :P
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Hmmm. I think we all go through regular cycles of "why bother?" here on DPC. Some of us just bash the voters (hehehe) while others take it more personally. For me, everyone here in the Oasis does their part of making this a great place to be, even if I do not always agree with them. It would be a boring thing if we all agreed all the time.
Jeffrey is correct that Melethia has had some great success in the near past, as he himself has, and Jeb, and lots of others. Success is a relative thing, and despite the TS credo of "scores don't matter", the simple fact is that we would not be entering challenges if they didn't. It is simple enough to post images in your portfolio somewhere and post a link asking for opinions. The trick is to keep in mind that despite the score, it is what the image means to you that is it's true test of worthiness.
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02/20/2008 04:03:35 PM · #1943 |
Originally posted by Melethia:
Originally posted by Greetmir:
OMG ... OMG ... Just STOP!
I cannot believe I am seeing this animosity on the Team Suck Oasis forum. Please stop. |
I don't see any animosity. Jeffrey is giving me a hard time in a good natured way because I'm depressed and discouraged and a bunch of other "d" words. But there's no animosity, I assure you. |
Right. We're just messing with each other Greetmir. Very friendly, I promise. :) Just trying to help her (and Jeb) see that they're doing fine and don't need to stop entering challenges.
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02/20/2008 04:06:16 PM · #1944 |
Originally posted by basssman7:
Success is a relative thing, and despite the TS credo of "scores don't matter", the simple fact is that we would not be entering challenges if they didn't. It is simple enough to post images in your portfolio somewhere and post a link asking for opinions. The trick is to keep in mind that despite the score, it is what the image means to you that is it's true test of worthiness. |
Scores do matter to me. But I wouldn't argue they *should* argue to anyone. It's up to each of to decide how much they matter. Your last sentence is really the point to me, though, and sums up the TS credo.
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02/20/2008 04:19:29 PM · #1945 |
Originally posted by levyj413:
Originally posted by basssman7:
Success is a relative thing, and despite the TS credo of "scores don't matter", the simple fact is that we would not be entering challenges if they didn't. It is simple enough to post images in your portfolio somewhere and post a link asking for opinions. The trick is to keep in mind that despite the score, it is what the image means to you that is it's true test of worthiness. |
Scores do matter to me. But I wouldn't argue they *should* argue to anyone. It's up to each of to decide how much they matter. Your last sentence is really the point to me, though, and sums up the TS credo. |
Which is why I'm rethinking entering any challenges any more. The scores make me doubt my own judgement, my own meaning of the shot. So in a way, scores matter too much sometimes.
And just to rib Jeffrey back a little - his last ten have one ribbon, one fourth, four top 20s, 25 favorites, and average a full half point above his average score to date. Not bad for a Sucker.
Message edited by author 2008-02-20 16:22:05. |
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02/20/2008 04:28:52 PM · #1946 |
Originally posted by Melethia:
Scores do matter to me. But I wouldn't argue they *should* argue to anyone. It's up to each of to decide how much they matter. Your last sentence is really the point to me, though, and sums up the TS credo.
Which is why I'm rethinking entering any challenges any more. The scores make me doubt my own judgement, my own meaning of the shot. So in a way, scores matter too much sometimes. |
Deb, we all like good scores. Mine have hit rock bottom the last few challenges and I, too, thought about not bothering to enter anymore challenges for a while. I think there are a lot of new users, recently arrived, and the scores are being reflected all over the site. Also, some of the challenges have been poorly defined, so no-one is quite sure what they are voting on.
I am still shooting more for myself and trying to find the odd shot to enter in challenges, tho not very successfully at the moment. Also, once the weather improves and the light evenings arrive, we should get out shooting more. Hang in there and who knows, that Blue Ribbon shot could be just round the corner:))
Message edited by author 2008-02-20 16:29:31. |
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02/20/2008 08:20:57 PM · #1947 |
| So wanted to take a shot of the moon tonight, but no deal it is cloudy will go out and check but I think I'm screwed. |
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02/20/2008 09:32:27 PM · #1948 |
Originally posted by cosprenks:
So wanted to take a shot of the moon tonight, but no deal it is cloudy will go out and check but I think I'm screwed. |
I'm able to see it, but it's -13F out right now and even my camera shivers at that low temperature. |
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02/20/2008 10:18:24 PM · #1949 |
[thumb]649347[/thumb]
Darn cold out there - and I'm very tired, but there's one of my photos from tonight.
Not the greatest photo - but it was really quite interesting to watch the progression from 'regular' moon, through partial eclipse into the total eclipse. Then I came in to warm up - it's -13C out there!
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02/20/2008 10:39:44 PM · #1950 |
| I'm warning you... if I see any animosity in this thread I'm going to beat the crap out of it. |
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