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01/10/2008 06:20:16 PM · #26 |
Originally posted by drewbixcube:
Originally posted by Prof_Fate:
ezpenses right now. - We just bought a new house/new job/new car (come up wiht |
edit: i can't spell worth a crap |
I can spell, I can't type for carp, crap, though.
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01/10/2008 07:14:49 PM · #27 |
I wonder how many that think this photograrpher did nothing wrong or surprising the customer with a big jump in the final price (with out getting approval first) would think the same thing if they took their car in to get the oil changed and they gave them an additional big bill for doing a tune up. After all, the mechanic is only trying to do you a service and he knows you need it done anyway. And you did inital the paper when you dropped it off for the oil change. ;)
Oh sure, your time is worth money as is your artistic skill. But I feel that a photographer should not just do the work and bill with out checking with the customer first. I guess if you can get away with it, and many do, it will make you more money in the short term, but it's sure going to leave some un-happy customers. And un-happy customers is not what builds a photographic business. And it hurts the industry for the rest a lot more than the newbies that charge to little that we hear the high priced photographers gripping about all the time.
And people wonder why the bride and groom are willing to go to Uncle Bob, Aunt Sue and the twins to do the photography so they don't need a "Professional Wedding Photographer".
Anyway, just my opinion... just like everyone elses.
Mike
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01/10/2008 07:15:22 PM · #28 |
Originally posted by drewbixcube:
Originally posted by Prof_Fate:
"Hey, our deal was for 30 pages. Put those images into 30 pages and let us see it then".
"We agreed to 30 pages, and you're showing us 40. While we like the design and the price isn't unreasonable, we hadn't planned on any extra ezpenses right now. - We just bought a new house/new job/new car (come up wiht a plausible high ticket item here, to get understanding more than sympathy). Can you redesign that to fit the 30 pages as per the contract? If that's gonna be too much work, can we take it as is for only $200 and save you the redesign time?" |
GREAT ADVICE HERE As I was reading the thread I was thinking along the same lines...try to compromize, or get him to redesign album back down to 30 pages.
edit: i can't spell worth a crap |
I would agree with this. If you agreed on a 30 page album, get a 30 page album like you wanted. He should present the album you agreed upon, and if he has to go to the work of creating the album again, that is his fault. Just make sure he knows which images you want taken out (or if you just want all the pages with more pictures on them)
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01/10/2008 07:20:19 PM · #29 |
Originally posted by MikeJ:
I wonder how many that think this photograrpher did nothing wrong or surprising the customer with a big jump in the final price (with out getting approval first) would think the same thing if they took their car in to get the oil changed and they gave them an additional big bill for doing a tune up. After all, the mechanic is only trying to do you a service and he knows you need it done anyway. And you did inital the paper when you dropped it off for the oil change. ;) |
More like if the mechanic said the engine's running a little rough, you may want get a tune up and the customer says "I can't decide, I'll trust your judgement on that" and the mechanic's judgment was to do the tune up and bill the customer for it. |
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01/10/2008 07:28:49 PM · #30 |
Originally posted by Art Roflmao:
Originally posted by MikeJ:
I wonder how many that think this photograrpher did nothing wrong or surprising the customer with a big jump in the final price (with out getting approval first) would think the same thing if they took their car in to get the oil changed and they gave them an additional big bill for doing a tune up. After all, the mechanic is only trying to do you a service and he knows you need it done anyway. And you did inital the paper when you dropped it off for the oil change. ;) |
More like if the mechanic said the engine's running a little rough, you may want get a tune up and the customer says "I can't decide, I'll trust your judgement on that" and the mechanic's judgment was to do the tune up and bill the customer for it. |
Ken, they had a contract for a 30 page album...saying they trusted the photog's judgement should have stayed within the contract guidelines, not gone over. If you hired a contractor to add a new deck to your house and you told him to build the deck, but you trusted his judgement on how to do it and he added a poolhouse as well, would you expect to pay for the poolhouse? |
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01/10/2008 07:32:52 PM · #31 |
When I design an album I always go over the numbers over pages in the contract. I have no way of knowing which event of the day is more important to my couples and they consistently surprise me. For me to presume on their behalf would be wrong. They know up front the album they have contacted for is 40 pages. I will lay out more than that and will work with them to narrow it down to the 40 or if they would like to keep the layout as is they can pay for the additional pages. The cost of the additional pages is covered in the contract. When their album is ready for review I remind them of the number of pages they contracted for and the amount for additional pages so there are no surprises or confusion.
The only time we've had a problem was with one very immature young lady who thought if she stamped her feet and threw a temper tantrum we'd give her the additional pages. After pulling out her contact and reminding her of the details she backed down.
What you're seeing is pretty standard, you weren't being scammed. Your photographer is trying to give you an album that represents your day -- at a very reasonable price I might add. Be up front with him about what you can afford, don't lie about new houses or cars, be honest. We all understand budgets and the current economy. The company we work with charges us in increments of 10 pages so there isn't anything I can do by taking an album down to 5 additional pages since I'm charged the same price regardless. There is a good chance he is in the same position. Prof Fate is correct that you can most likely get the same 40 page album in an 8x10 for the 30 page 11x14 price. Never hurts to ask! |
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01/10/2008 07:45:27 PM · #32 |
Originally posted by cryingdragon:
Originally posted by Art Roflmao:
Originally posted by MikeJ:
I wonder how many that think this photograrpher did nothing wrong or surprising the customer with a big jump in the final price (with out getting approval first) would think the same thing if they took their car in to get the oil changed and they gave them an additional big bill for doing a tune up. After all, the mechanic is only trying to do you a service and he knows you need it done anyway. And you did inital the paper when you dropped it off for the oil change. ;) |
More like if the mechanic said the engine's running a little rough, you may want get a tune up and the customer says "I can't decide, I'll trust your judgement on that" and the mechanic's judgment was to do the tune up and bill the customer for it. |
Ken, they had a contract for a 30 page album...saying they trusted the photog's judgement should have stayed within the contract guidelines, not gone over. If you hired a contractor to add a new deck to your house and you told him to build the deck, but you trusted his judgement on how to do it and he added a poolhouse as well, would you expect to pay for the poolhouse? |
I can't think of a fitting modification to your deck analogy, but the way I see it, the photog's process is to have the couple decide on the arrangement/choice of photos for the 30 pages. The $3k includes the customer spending the time to make the decisions. Leaving it to the photographer adds to his time. I think it was incumbent on both or one or the other party to clarify sticking to the original budget. I don't agree that the photog should have presented the bill - but he did give the option for the client to scale it back to it's originally proposed scope.
So, back to the deck analogy - to be equivalent, the contractor would build the poolhouse, bill me, but then give me the option to have him remove it and void the additional cost. For the photographer or the deck guy, it may have been a calculated gamble, but the customer is still given the choice - and in the case of the deck contractor, he probably made a bad gamble and I would probably have a free poolhouse. :D |
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01/10/2008 07:48:43 PM · #33 |
I attended a Professional Photographers Association (PPA) seminar last year in which one of the speakers specifically advocated this line of hard sell. Putting together an album that has more pages than what they had purchased. Telling them that he'll throw in two extra pages for free, but only if they buy X number more pages than the original contract. Then let the couple try to figure out which ones they didn't want. With the pressure to purchase the extra ones just so they can get the two free pages. (something like that) He laughed as he joked about how the bride would look weepy-eyed at the husband who knew they were financially strapped and insist that they keep all of the pages rather than throw some away.
Anyway, it's a strong sales tactic that I don't think I could ever pull off. It was interesting hearing other photographer's reactions to the idea...
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01/10/2008 07:54:26 PM · #34 |
| It may well be a hard sell tactic, but consumers need to take responsibility for their decisions. It's not the same as bait and switch. Besides, as I mentioned, the service provider is taking a gamble and may not close the deal. He/She is also gambling with referral status. |
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