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09/21/2007 05:48:11 PM · #26 |
I have one person, who has tested the D300, seen claiming that ISO3200 on the D300 felt like ISO640 on the D70.... If true it is pretty amazing.
To be on the safe side I say that ISO1600 like D70 ISO640 might be closer to reality.
Scott Kelby (from the Photoshop books) on the D3 noise performance...
D3 samples by Nikon
I can safely say that the D3 at ISO6400 looks like my D70 at ISO640 :)))
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09/21/2007 07:14:13 PM · #27 |
| But have you found any real hard evidence about the noise performance of the D300 or just of the D3? So far, the only test shots from the D300 I've seen have been of the dark motorcycle in jpeg, hardly good enough to analyze the quality. |
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09/21/2007 08:57:09 PM · #28 |
Originally posted by valkner:
I've been drooling over the upgrade to a D200 for a long time and now that the D300 has been announced my credit card is burning a hole in my wallet!
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I think you should save your money til next year. I think by at least the end of '08 Nikon will have a full frame that competes price wise with the 5D. You've already got lens for Nikon.
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09/21/2007 09:04:48 PM · #29 |
I'll be right back, there's someone I have to mug real quick... |
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09/21/2007 10:17:43 PM · #30 |
Watch the videos demonstrating live view on the D3 at dpreview, and note the noise level when he zooms in to review the image. |
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09/22/2007 12:28:01 AM · #31 |
| Damn. I know I should have expected it, and I know it's true. I really should wait until the D300 has come out and probably until next spring when the 5D replacement/upgrade has been announced/released but the D300 looks oh-so-good! Hell, fir3bird is probably right, I should probably wait until Nikon has released yet another round of cameras a year from now, but damn that's a long time to wait! |
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09/22/2007 12:47:20 AM · #32 |
I saw a comparison between the D3 and the 1D Mk III which was posted a while back. It used identical shots in stepped ISO increments and showed 100% crops.
Looks like significantly less chrominance noise, but there is also quite a lot less detail in the D3 shots... Still, I'd wait until the 5D replacement is out... probably going to be only about 6 more months. Considering how many months I would have to save to get into that league, I'd say 6 months is a short time. You might want to be shooting with the camera for the next 3-4 years too, seeing as technology is reaching a plateau (The D3 claims gapless microlenses, so we aren't going to see any greater increase in that area).
I think the D3 is amazing, and if I were going to spend in the neighborhood of 10 grand, I'd probably go that direction, however there is more to the issue than just a few JPGs.
The 5D on the other hand is already an established performer. It is easily capable of providing excellent quality and that's a bottom line that shouldn't be ignored.
If it were me (and it probably will be in a year or two), I'd be looking at a used 5D and probably an 85mm f/1.2. But that's just my feeling. |
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09/22/2007 12:52:46 AM · #33 |
valkner,
In my opinion, if you have to ask us which camera is right for you. (Nikon D300 vs Canon 5D) Then I would say, "It isn't time for you to upgrade!"
You have a D80, it's a good camera, use it until it dies! Or until you can say, "I need camera X to get the job done" and without question. |
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09/22/2007 01:19:20 AM · #34 |
| Thanks ben, that's kind of the realization I'm coming to. I'm just going to stretch and work with my D80 for a while longer. But damn the noise on the D80 gets the best of me! 5D RAW shots just look so unbelievable good. |
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09/22/2007 03:39:46 AM · #35 |
Originally posted by eschelar:
I saw a comparison between the D3 and the 1D Mk III which was posted a while back. It used identical shots in stepped ISO increments and showed 100% crops.
Looks like significantly less chrominance noise, but there is also quite a lot less detail in the D3 shots... |
Edward Betz describes image quality of Mk3 vs D3...
And that is just one. Joe McNally says the same as do many other PJ's.
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09/22/2007 10:59:53 AM · #36 |
| All this talk about the D3, is no one interested in or able to give us some test photos from the D300? |
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09/22/2007 11:54:42 AM · #37 |
Originally posted by valkner:
All this talk about the D3, is no one interested in or able to give us some test photos from the D300? |
There's some D300 samples here: PhotographyBay
The thing is, the D3 really differentiates itself from the pack. When people start calling the camera performance revolutionary, people ears perk up, even if it's just a little bit sensationalist.
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09/22/2007 12:02:15 PM · #38 |
Originally posted by valkner:
All this talk about the D3, is no one interested in or able to give us some test photos from the D300? |
I don't think it's so much that no one is intrested in the D300, it's just that it's not a innovation for Nikon like the D3 is. It's just an upgraded D200 and (specs wise) it's a good one.
But as for noise performance on the D300, I bet it will be basically the same as the D200. If it was significantly better than the D200 and somewhat close to the D3's performance, Nikon would have posted test shots above ISO 200. The main reason the D3 does so well, is the Full Frame sensor. The D300 is still the same size (yet different format) 1.5x Crop APS-C sensor the D200 has just with more megapixels crammed on it. I could be wrong, but once independent test shots come out, I bet I'll be right.
That is why I am waiting to get a D3. I like my D200 and feel it does ok with noise, but I want get a second body and I want it to be an upgrade in noise performance. Tests for both will be out before I can get my hands on either camera and if the D300 is an upgrade in that area, I'll get it and use the extra on glass. But if it's not near the D3's perofrmance, I'm getting a D3. |
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09/22/2007 12:34:04 PM · #39 |
| Owning Canon first, switching to Nikon and now finally coming home to Canon once again I own the 5D and I'm also the proud owner of a Mark III. I find myself reaching for my 5D more than the Mark III. The 5D is simply an amazing peice of equipment. It seems to be my #1 and the Mark III is a nice back up. I never would have thought when making my purchases it would turn out this way. I intended for the 5D to be the back up but, that's like using Gahndi as a babysitter. I don't knock Nikon I still own a D70 (for a few hours more until the new owner shows up) It's just that Canon has made a superior camera in this case. Use your head and enjoy your new Canon. |
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09/22/2007 12:55:12 PM · #40 |
Originally posted by breadfan35:
[quote=valkner]
But as for noise performance on the D300, I bet it will be basically the same as the D200. If it was significantly better than the D200 and somewhat close to the D3's performance, Nikon would have posted test shots above ISO 200. The main reason the D3 does so well, is the Full Frame sensor. The D300 is still the same size (yet different format) 1.5x Crop APS-C sensor the D200 has just with more megapixels crammed on it. I could be wrong, but once independent test shots come out, I bet I'll be right.
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We've seen some damn impressive high ISO samples from the sony A700, which I believe uses the same sensor as the D300. I think you can expect noise levels to fall somewhere between the 30D and 5D... and I would put my money on it being closer to the 5D end. |
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09/22/2007 01:56:39 PM · #41 |
Originally posted by option:
Originally posted by breadfan35:
[quote=valkner]
But as for noise performance on the D300, I bet it will be basically the same as the D200. If it was significantly better than the D200 and somewhat close to the D3's performance, Nikon would have posted test shots above ISO 200. The main reason the D3 does so well, is the Full Frame sensor. The D300 is still the same size (yet different format) 1.5x Crop APS-C sensor the D200 has just with more megapixels crammed on it. I could be wrong, but once independent test shots come out, I bet I'll be right.
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We've seen some damn impressive high ISO samples from the sony A700, which I believe uses the same sensor as the D300. I think you can expect noise levels to fall somewhere between the 30D and 5D... and I would put my money on it being closer to the 5D end. |
I hope you're right because then I will get a D300 and have alot of extra money to throw at glass, but I need to see it to believe it. If the high ISO was as good as you say, why would Nikon not release 1600 or 3200 shots on their site to show them off as they did with the D3?
Message edited by author 2007-09-22 13:58:36. |
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09/22/2007 02:26:20 PM · #42 |
Originally posted by breadfan35:
I hope you're right because then I will get a D300 and have alot of extra money to throw at glass, but I need to see it to believe it. If the high ISO was as good as you say, why would Nikon not release 1600 or 3200 shots on their site to show them off as they did with the D3? |
By the time you can get one in your hands, you can probably save up for the D3 anyway heheh. |
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09/24/2007 12:11:11 AM · #43 |
The D200 uses a CCD. The D300 uses a CMOS.
there will be better noise performance.
I would wager that it will be closer to the 30D or 40D's level of performance though. There's no reason to believe that it would come anywhere near the 5D. The pixel pitch is drastically different.
Probably still best to wait for Phil Askey to get his hands on the different models mentioned. there's a big difference between tuned noise reduction and actual low noise.
The D300 has more pixels than the 30D with a similar sensor size. It has a bit newer tech, but it's doubtful that end results will differ that much. Put a capable workflow on the end of it and you will likely end up with similar results with in-camera NR turned off. |
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09/24/2007 12:32:32 PM · #44 |
It seems that most of the argumentation in this topic is mainly concerned with the noise performance. This is way too overrated for what it really is. Be honest, what would be the percentage of pictures that you will take at ISO > 1600? Less than 5% at most? Maybe even less...
And, yeah, maybe it is damn useful for sport action...and blablablabla...
I think the level of argumentation between the D300 and the 5D should not be based on the noise performance. Both cameras should be more than fine for what one really needs. |
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09/24/2007 12:40:06 PM · #45 |
Originally posted by msieglerfr:
It seems that most of the argumentation in this topic is mainly concerned with the noise performance. This is way too overrated for what it really is. Be honest, what would be the percentage of pictures that you will take at ISO > 1600? Less than 5% at most? Maybe even less...
And, yeah, maybe it is damn useful for sport action...and blablablabla...
I think the level of argumentation between the D300 and the 5D should not be based on the noise performance. Both cameras should be more than fine for what one really needs. |
I have to cover events/parties/weddings sometimes and I shoot at ISO 800. I consider it highest acceptable on my camera. I would LOVE to have clean ISO 1600 or even more. So high ISO requierment is a personal choise and you right, not everybody needs it.
Message edited by author 2007-09-24 12:40:34. |
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09/24/2007 10:46:43 PM · #46 |
Agreed, I also use my camera to do things that most other people cannot. I often find myself shooting ISO 800+ with my 50mm f/1.4 due to poor lighting. I feel that this is one reason that I can safely say that I am not just another guy with a P&S. I can shoot in much more difficult situations and pull decent results even if flash is not permitted. ISO is a big deal. Noise is a bigger deal.
Plenty of other concerns to look at with buying a camera, but at the level of the 5D and the D300, both cameras have covered most of the other bases pretty darned well, so there isn't much to say. |
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09/25/2007 06:43:29 AM · #47 |
Originally posted by eschelar:
The D200 uses a CCD. The D300 uses a CMOS.
there will be better noise performance.
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The D2x(s) has a CMOS sensor also and the D200 and D80 have better noise performance than it does. Just becasue it's a CMOS doesn't mean noise will be better. |
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09/25/2007 06:45:49 AM · #48 |
Originally posted by Nikolai1024:
Originally posted by msieglerfr:
It seems that most of the argumentation in this topic is mainly concerned with the noise performance. This is way too overrated for what it really is. Be honest, what would be the percentage of pictures that you will take at ISO > 1600? Less than 5% at most? Maybe even less...
And, yeah, maybe it is damn useful for sport action...and blablablabla...
I think the level of argumentation between the D300 and the 5D should not be based on the noise performance. Both cameras should be more than fine for what one really needs. |
I have to cover events/parties/weddings sometimes and I shoot at ISO 800. I consider it highest acceptable on my camera. I would LOVE to have clean ISO 1600 or even more. So high ISO requierment is a personal choise and you right, not everybody needs it. |
Same for me. I do a ton of shooting at ISO 800+. I want even cleaner images out of camera. The less I have to do in post to correct noise, the more I can focus on more creative editing. I feel my D200 does acceptable with noise up to ISO 1250, but if I can get better I want it. That's why I was considering switching to a 5D, but now that the D3 has come out, I have great hope for the future of Nikon products and will stay. A D3 will be in my future if the D300 doesn't excel over my D200.
Message edited by author 2007-09-25 06:48:59. |
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09/26/2007 12:58:34 PM · #49 |
D300 ISO3200
If that is indeed ISO 3200 out of a D300, I think my estimate of close to 5D noise levels is spot-on. |
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09/26/2007 02:01:57 PM · #50 |
Maybe my next camera will be a D300.
I've always felt bad about switching to Canon after so many years of shooting Nikon film cameras. |
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