Are you on the Geek Squad? - DPChallenge Forums

09/11/2007 10:23:58 PM · #1

My kid wanted to network his game platforms wireless style, so he could play online. Got a Linksys wireless router. Everything installed just fine. Now my DSL on the computer is quite a bit slower even when he isn't gamin'. Is this normal? Is it just because of the additional piece of electronics? Next question. Are there any virus type of things that I need to tell the kid about for his PS3, XBox360 or WII? Are these platforms secure? Just wonderin...

Sigma 70-200mm f/2.8 EX DG APO IF for Nikon

09/11/2007 10:29:55 PM · #2

A wireless router, especially if using a wireless card or cable from DSL will dramatically slow down the speed simply because the strength of the signal is being diluted into one or more devices. The more devices, the longer the length it must travel (wire or not) will begin to slow your speed down.

I work for Sprint and Sell that wireless router and the cards, we refrain from people buying them for gaming systems due to the slow speed being such a hassle. An ether cord from your cable outage is sometimes faster.

amathiasphoto

Nikon D300

09/11/2007 10:31:14 PM · #3

never heard of any antivirus for console systems like the wii, though I guess its entirely possible. Calamity is pretty accurate with the rest. And darn, he just beat me by a second!

Message edited by author 2007-09-11 22:31:38.

09/11/2007 10:32:05 PM · #4

She ;)

09/11/2007 10:35:30 PM · #5

So even though the router is cable connected to the desktop I can expect a performance dip? If that's the case, the kid owes me! :-P

09/11/2007 10:38:25 PM · #6

Yes, you figure cable outlet to PC, PC to router, Router to gaming system. The leap is about three steps and thus will drain. Now, even if you're not using the gaming system at the same time, the router is still sending out a signal in a 30 foot radius or so (supposing your house is of normal materials and not a brick fortress). With the secure firewall that comes with Links - Routers, your pc will still drag. :(

:( Great concept and as technology increases you will notice a major improvement. Or perhaps high speed cable to the router rather than DSL?

09/11/2007 10:42:51 PM · #7

Anything I can do to make it faster? Will I screw anything up if I physically bypass the router when it's not in use by the kid?

09/11/2007 10:45:15 PM · #8

Wireless signal does not degrade with more devices latched onto it anymore than music on the radio gets quieter the more people that tune in. The only performance dip as additional devices attach to the wireless network is the bottle neck imposed by the connection from the wireless box to the wired network or, in your case, to the dsl line.

Say your dsl is 1.5mb/s. 1 person on the wireless gets an 11mb/s connection to the network. 7x the speed of your internet connection. 6 people on the wireless all get an 11mb/s connection to the network, however the available bandwidth on the dsl line is still 1.5mb/s so best case and ignoring a lot of technicalities - each of the 6 will get about 256kb/s of bandwidth.

Anyway, while there is a matter of wireless channel congestion you are not likely to hit it at home.

With linksys gear, performance problems can often be solved by loading new firmware - and not always firmware updates, sometimes you just keep trying everything available new and old until you find the magic bullet. They are cheap devices and Cisco buying them out didn't make them all that much better.

Is your dsl coming straight into the linksys box or terminating in a dsl router first? If the latter, you may have a simple speed/duplex negotiation problem between the dsl router and the linksys box causing errors when the boxes try to talk to each other. This would manifest itself in the appearance of a network slowdown, even if your wired pc is the only one online.

Message edited by author 2007-09-11 22:46:23.

Fujifilm XC 16-50mm f/3.5-5.6 OIS

09/11/2007 10:50:09 PM · #9

HMMMM, interesting, I think I learned a bit but definately not what the Router people taught us at Sprint. Good info though, thanks Routerguy666.

So does bottlenecking users on a server and/or router signal seriously not slow the speed down? Its the DSL signal slowing now the amount of devices linked from your router? When we sell a wireless card to a customer that is going to be using it to plug in a card to a router and thus have 5 PCS or Laptops running, we're told to deter this because the speed will DRAMATICALLY slow down and all our customers that have tried it regardless have returned the card and agreed.....

buzzrock

Fujifilm X-M1

09/11/2007 10:51:47 PM · #10

Originally posted by TooCool:

You own a Ps3, 360, and a WII?

Im Jealous!

09/11/2007 10:52:04 PM · #11

Speak in extreme technical detail - what 'wireless card' are you selling? It is possible to setup wireless networks between pc's where there is no access point, they simply talk to each other's card directly. That is a different ball of wax.

09/11/2007 11:04:03 PM · #12

Oh, and another likely cause to your problem - did you change the default settings on the linksys box when you set it up? Lots of people take perverse pleasure in using their neighbor's internet connections to do nefarious things because all the settings were left at their well known defaults and the wireless is accessible to anyone within range.

09/11/2007 11:06:45 PM · #13

I sell every wireless card imaginable. A 595U Novatel, PX500, Sierra... you name it. We dont' mess with the routers, simple sell and direct ship to the customer's home and if they have any problems we have to direct them to our customer care since we only technically sell the service but I myself like to be educated but since I'm a retard when it comes to computers, I sometimes get left behind in the "techno - lingo". One problem we have is the router only takes cards and our USB device is faster so you buy a USB to use on your PC, get a router and can't plug it in, or get a card for the router and only have a USB port. lol.... still working on that one.

09/11/2007 11:13:49 PM · #14

The novatel card is for sprint wireless broadband. I think OP is dealing with a different setup than what you are selling.

OP: search google for 'linksys speed fix'

Canon EF 70-300mm f/4.5-5.6 DO IS USM

09/11/2007 11:16:18 PM · #15

OP... as in Overland Park?? We sell the Novatel card as well, but I'm not sure what OP stands for. I work out of the Campus center and NKC location.

cpanaioti

Canon EOS-40D

09/11/2007 11:19:16 PM · #16

Originally posted by CalamitysMaster00:

OP... as in Overland Park?? We sell the Novatel card as well, but I'm not sure what OP stands for. I work out of the Campus center and NKC location.

OP as in original poster. ;oP

awpollard

Canon EOS-5D Mark II

Canon EF 100-400mm f/4.5-5.6L IS

09/11/2007 11:19:31 PM · #17

I read your OP as your wired desktop computer became slower after installing a Router/Switch/Wireless AP and You are connected via DSL.

Normally, it should not be noticable at your desktop in a small network such as yours. How noticable is it? Is your computer hardwired into the switch that is wired to your DSL Modem?

Here is an alleged thought (I've seen this before). You are DSL and most likely using PPPoE to connect to your provider (requires username and password).

If before you purchased the Router/Switch/AP you were plugged directly into the DSL modem??? then your provider gave you some piece of software to install on your desktop to make the PPPoE connection... something like WinPoet or the likes...

Is that software still installed on your pewter? If you set the router up for that PPPoE connection to your ISP (entered your username and password during setup) then you don't need or want that stuff on your pewter, it will slow you down.

Also if you were connected directly to the DSL modem did the ISP have you make any Static IP address entries in your network properties (gateway, subnet mask, DNS)? You should be getting everything you need from the router/switch now so your network properties would all be dynamic (obtain automatically).

As to Gaming Devices over Wireless, they are only as safe as your Wireless network. You have changed your Admin password right? You are at least using 128bit WEP?

Message edited by author 2007-09-11 23:33:54.

09/11/2007 11:33:14 PM · #18

Originally posted by buzzrock:

You own a Ps3, 360, and a WII?

Im Jealous!

No, my kid does. and so am I...

Rooster

Sigma 28-105mm f/2.8-4.0 Aspherical for Canon

09/11/2007 11:43:08 PM · #19

Originally posted by TooCool:

So even though the router is cable connected to the desktop I can expect a performance dip? If that's the case, the kid owes me! :-P

For sure but not just for the performance sacrifice. How about for owning 3 top gaming consoles out there. That's one lucky kid!

geoffb

09/11/2007 11:47:19 PM · #20

I know that with my router, I can configure it so that only "g" connections can be made, which allows all throughput to be much faster. If I need even one connection to be a "b" connection (slower), then I must configure the router to allow it, and it makes ALL the connections the speed of a "b" connection.

Perhaps the game console is forcing all connections to slow down to its rate, in a manner similar to my setup. Just a thought.

awpollard

Canon EOS-5D Mark II

Canon EF 100-400mm f/4.5-5.6L IS

09/11/2007 11:52:22 PM · #21

Originally posted by routerguy666:

I'm with you on this one...

I run have running right now:

Wireless N router/switch (mainly for the MIMO (range)) connected to DSL modem
Vista Ultimate Desktop - Wired - the one I am sitting at.
Xbox 360 > 54G Wireless Gaming Bridge (living room as Media center Extender)
Window XP MCE 2005 (media center pc with an HDTVWonder) - Wired
Wife's Vista Ultimate Laptop - 54G Wireless
Second Xbox 360 - Wired - in pewter room as another media extender
Vista Business Laptop - 54G wireless - Work laptop next to me here.

These things are some hogs but I still don't feel a thing at my desktop. Streaming media to the Wireless 360 can get choppy when watching a vid but that is to be expected (MS still recommends Wireless-A for streaming) using wireless-g

Message edited by author 2007-09-11 23:54:17.

hankk

Canon EOS-5D

Sigma 24-70mm f/2.8 EX Aspherical DF for Canon

09/12/2007 12:47:40 PM · #22

Try disconnecting (turning off) the wireless part of the router and see if that solves the problem.

If that dosen't work, my guess is that you have QOS enabled. Try turning it off in the router and at your PC's NIC card and see if that solves the problem. Turning QOS off may adversely affect gameplay, so you'll have to make a decision as to which is more important.

And don't go by even your own perception, measure your line speed.

Use //www.dslreports.com/speedtest?java=1

try tweaking your PC by this tool: //www.dslreports.com/tweaks

There are other tools at //www.dslreports.com/tools

Some technical details you probably don't need to know:

Each copper line coming into the router will be serviced by some central device in the router (a CPU or perhaps some DMA controller or data switch of some sort). You will be limited on a copper line by:
1. the speed of the line (e.g. 100Mbs)
2. the speed of the central device within the router -- can it handle the number of lines times their speed? Note that bandwidth usage is generally bursty, so not all devices can handle full speed on all lines at the same time.
3. The size of each ethernet packet. VoIP and gaming may use lots of small packets to reduce latency (ie you want a quick response, but there 's not much data to send) while file transfers generally use maximum sized packets to reduce overhead. Sometimes the limit is on number of packets, regardless of how large or small they are (e.g. the CPU just deals with the IP headers and the data is handled by a DMA controller.)

Wireless uses a shared spectrum. Depending on the router and its technology, all devices on it may use the same channel and contend for bandwidth (many consumer WiFi routers do this), or each device may use its own channel to the router (data connections via cellphone providers do this). In any case, the wireless devices will affect the devices they are sharing a channel with. And cordless phones sometimes use the same bandwidth as WiFi: 802.11b and 802.11g use various frequency bands within 2.4GHz and 802.11a uses various frequency bands within 5.8GHz

Wireless devices should not affect the speed of the wired connections, except as they contend for the central resource and as they contend for internet bandwidth.

Canon EF 17-40mm f/4.0L USM

09/12/2007 05:37:42 PM · #23

Originally posted by Rooster:

That's one lucky kid!

LOL... He's a smart kid. Goes to grandmas and does a lot of odd jobs. Saves all the money he gets. Sold his older platforms and games he doesn't play anymore. He earned all of them!

soup

Canon EOS-30D

09/12/2007 05:54:07 PM · #24

get cable internet. you won't notice any lag ;}

at least not here - boat loads faster and more reliable than the DSL i used to have.

Rooster