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 08/05/2007 10:26:13 AM · #51
Originally posted by jerowe:


i fail to see the logic in why someone would come to me rather than them, if mine was higher, or even the same price as they are charging


That's why you're not going to be rich and famous. There is no logic to why one photog gets chosen over another.

If you were a girl that was in a wedding or 3 in the past 2 or 3 years, and just got engaged what would you do? Tell your girlfriends! Ask them for help planning your wedding, right?

73% of the brides I see have been in a wedding. They did not hire the photog from that wedding, did they? No, or i'd not be talking to them! It would be logical for them to ask their friend 'so who was your photographer? did you like him? how much did he cost? I remember your album, it was beautiful!' (If you only deliver a CD you'll never get a referral on that last question BTW. People don't show their CD at lunch, at work, at their friend's houses.)

But it doesn't work that way.

Also consider that about 30% of my brides come home to get married, but live in other towns - Chicago, DC, Nashville - they are used to higher prices. Use the internet to find those brides!

If mom is paying I average $2500/wedding. If the bride/groom are paying I'm averaging $1700 a wedding. During your consultation ask whose paying! If it's mom, sell more!


08/05/2007 10:33:36 AM · #52
Originally posted by Prof_Fate:
If mom is paying I average $2500/wedding. If the bride/groom are paying I'm averaging $1700 a wedding. During your consultation ask whose paying! If it's mom, sell more!

In this case are you selling the bride more, the mother, or everyone?
 08/05/2007 12:50:18 PM · #53
Originally posted by _eug:
Originally posted by Prof_Fate:
If mom is paying I average $2500/wedding. If the bride/groom are paying I'm averaging $1700 a wedding. During your consultation ask whose paying! If it's mom, sell more!

In this case are you selling the bride more, the mother, or everyone?


If 'someone else is paying' then you always spend more and tip well! :D

During my consult the bride fills out a paper (survey type thing) and I ask questions and fill out a worksheet. Times, locations, number in teh wedding party, etc.
I then show them albums, folios, save the date cards, etc.
I use my worksheet to create a package - hours of coverage, album, 1 or 2 photogs, etc. I get a total and ask - for what we've discussed it's $2750. Is that what you had in mind?
They say yes, or no, or shut up and leave (really - one girl did that) I do ask if they have a budget and try to get what they want to fit their budget. 6 instead of 7 hours, 8x10 instead of 12x12, 10 or 20 sides instead of 30 or 40. I did have one bride, after I told her $2800, tell me she had $3500 budgeted for the photography.

I've asked (in surveys at bridal shows) 'what is your budget (wedding, photography). About 15% of the total is for the photography, but about 50% don't have a number at all. Either mom is paying (so there is no budget concern - to them) or they have no clue what photography costs.

I know who pays - i get a check with a name and sig on it. I know what the package total is, i sold it. Not too hard to conclude that if mom is paying they spend more. An extra hour, a book for her, more pages in their album, a second photographer - it adds up. My next consultation will be different now that i've identified a pattern - this info can pay me an extra $800, or keep me from losing a job on price, so you bet it's important to know, and use, this info.

Some other things every photographer should know about his market:

Around here dinner is $50/plate (some are less, some are more and that price usually includes the bar, but not the 20% gratuity). I know this cause I ask the reception sites. DJs are from $400 to $900. Videographers are $750-1500 (at least the ones I know) and fewer than 10% of the weddings have one (besides a friend with a home video cam)
I don't know on dresses, cakes or flowers. One couple spent $1000 the groom told me. He was paying -it was important to him to know this.
Most weddings are 150 to 200 guests - at $50/plate that's $7500-10000, plus 20% for the gratuity.
A limo runs $150/hour give or take, usually a 4 hour minimum. Hummers cost more.
Jamaica has been a popular honeymoon locale for my couples (again, I ask!) A week there is $1600+ from what the web tells me.
Most churches here charge for weddings - the pastor, teh church, a clean up fee. for what, perhaps 2 hours use? $500 is on the very low end, some get $1800. $800 is about average.

I don't think photographers should be the lowest earners on the wedding day.

Message edited by author 2007-08-05 12:56:26.
 08/05/2007 04:33:13 PM · #54
Chris - first, let me get something out of the way (please bear with me...)

1. I've seen your posts on several different sites, and you get called a smartass on each of them - BUT!!! it is typically by those whose pride is easily injured or those with thin skin. Though I can see how your words MIGHT be mis-construed at times, I've come to respect the fact that you are simply trying to share knowledge and help others.

2. Um, can I start using this quote from you in my business dealings -
"What does the bride have the day after the wedding? A man, a ring, and the photos. The food is gone, the honeymoon will soon be a memory, the flowers are in the trash..." ?

3. Don't stop sharing, as your advice IS very useful (besides that, it keeps everyone from thinking I'm the only smartass around!) ;)

Thx!

Billy
 08/05/2007 05:39:44 PM · #55
Originally posted by rossbilly:
Chris - first, let me get something out of the way (please bear with me...)

1. I've seen your posts on several different sites, and you get called a smartass on each of them - BUT!!! it is typically by those whose pride is easily injured or those with thin skin. Though I can see how your words MIGHT be mis-construed at times, I've come to respect the fact that you are simply trying to share knowledge and help others.

2. Um, can I start using this quote from you in my business dealings -
"What does the bride have the day after the wedding? A man, a ring, and the photos. The food is gone, the honeymoon will soon be a memory, the flowers are in the trash..." ?

3. Don't stop sharing, as your advice IS very useful (besides that, it keeps everyone from thinking I'm the only smartass around!) ;)

Thx!

Billy


Sure, use the quote. Here's one i've stolen - Good artists borrow. Great artists steal!

Some of my best teachers were one's that didn't pull punches. They told it like it was, whether I wanted to hear it or not. Sometimes it took a while for me to appreciate what they told me, but those that just fed me ego didn't do me any favors.

Besides, I hear that all the time from my wife. :D
 08/06/2007 12:52:03 PM · #56
Prof,

Thanks for the advice and story of how you started. I should clarify that I don't charge $600 just to be nice or becuase thats what I think Im worth. All of my 2008 prices start at $1200. I jumped in feet first w/ NO experience shooting weddings. I charged less and got a bunch of experience while upgrading my gear. I have a regular job for now so it was essentially all profit, outside of my time. I shoot w/ L glass, I have the flashes I want. I upgraded my computer and software. I now have ACDSee Pro and CS3. I did this all while gearing up for my "real" wedding business. I think I did OK, I used the $600 gigs for what I could.

Now that Im equipped and have experience Im ready to take on the real thing. I completely agree that the more expensive wedding photographer package, the nicer the venue, cars, and bridal party. If I hear the line, "lets do these photos quick so we can hit the bar" Im going to go nuts. I would love an hour w/ the bridal party in a nice environment where I actually felt like a valued photog.
 08/06/2007 01:55:32 PM · #57
I saw a couple advertising for a wedding photographer on Craig's List. I sent them a link to my dotphoto portfolio. They e-mailed me asking for prices. I quoted them some prices. I'm hoping they'll get back in touch. They wouldn't have e-mailed if they didn't like what they saw in my portfolio, right?
 08/06/2007 03:35:09 PM · #58
Originally posted by ragamuffingirl:
I saw a couple advertising for a wedding photographer on Craig's List. I sent them a link to my dotphoto portfolio. They e-mailed me asking for prices. I quoted them some prices. I'm hoping they'll get back in touch. They wouldn't have e-mailed if they didn't like what they saw in my portfolio, right?

I think that sounds reasonable. ;)
 08/06/2007 04:39:26 PM · #59
oh craigslist. that is the place to find people looking for something for nothing. thats where I found most of my cheap gigs.

I did one wedding from craigslist for $300 and 3 cases of beer. The groom was a brewer so it was pretty good beer and I do like good beer. I did this wedding because they hired me on a Wed for their Sat wedding. They had a friend who was going to do it for free but got injured. This was one of the most fun weddings Ive ever done. the bride and groom were so much fun. The venue sucked, it was at a restaurant, but fun none the less. Right after the ceremoney, the couple insisted on tequila shots w/ me and the bridal party. This was at noon. The posed shots were a riot, included the best man hanging his tongue out and "humping" the brides maid in front of him. Great pic by the way. One of the bride's maids got kind of close so to say and invited me back to the after party. Had to stay professional so I said no. Actually i think I said no because if I went I wouldn't be able to drive home especially after the post ceremoney drinks. Anyway, I had to share this because it was a great day. I also pulled two other paying gigs from the other people there.

When I left, it was like I was part of the family, everyone in the party walked me to my car and saw me off. great people and made me glad I could help out on such short notice.

Would have preferred $1200 on short notice but hey what can I do?
 08/06/2007 05:06:54 PM · #60
You're not talking about the wedding at Jamming Java, are you?

I haven't heard back from them since I quoted them my price. :-( ::::regards Prof Fate suspiciously:::::

I told them that for $700, I'd do a leather bound album with the photos printed onto the page. The album holds approximately 100 pictures. Unless otherwise requested, the album will be white. They also get two free 8x10's of their choosing because often the parents want something they can frame put on display. If they want additional albums for the parents, they're $150 each.

For $1000, I would do a DVD (don't shoot me) which would hold between 300-500 pictures, and they could do with them as they pleased.

Message edited by author 2007-08-06 17:11:33.
 08/06/2007 05:44:37 PM · #61
My daughter just got married Saturday.

Here's how we chose a photographer.

I had a very limited budget, but wanted to make sure we had good photos. Worse case scenerio, I would have sacrificed elsewhere to make sure we got a photographer I was comfortable with.

Put out a few feelers here and got some response. Ended up interviewing two local photographers. One was the photographer from a wedding my daughter was in last summer. Very decent shots (we saw the album), but nothing spectacular. The other was a photographer I found an ad for in a local bridal publication and had a website I checked out initially. We then set up the interview.

The first studio was definitely into the sales end. They had example wedding albums for us to view and specific pricing packages. Not much in the way of flexibility. I was pretty confident in their ability to do the job (several different photographers in the studio), but the packages just really weren't what worked best for us.

The second guy we went to see had a small office in the rear of another company's building. He had an area for studio shoots, and then just a smallish office where he did his editing work, etc. That office is where we met. He had an entire bookshelf of CD's from weddings he had done and said we were welcome to pull any of them down and view them. These were the complete wedding shots, not just selected ones. We actually knew the bride of the very first cd we pulled down.

We viewed at least a dozen of them and he just worked on some of his photos while we ran through the cds. He answered any questions we had, but we didn't feel rushed at all. I was very pleased with his work, and so was my daughter so we talked about price.

His set up is pretty basic. He has different elements that can be used to "build" a customized package. We worked out a very nice package that suited our needs perfectly and included a second shooter at the wedding. Our total, not including any albums, for 6 hours of work (and it certainly was work!) was around $1600. For that amount we get proofs, but no other prints. We do get the edited print files on CD to reproduce as we wish. It included an engagement sitting and an 11x14 print from that sitting, 2 photographers for 6 hours, & the CD.

He struck me as more of a photographer than a salesman. I appreciated that. He had a ton of experience and was willing to be flexible with my needs. That, in a nutshell, is why we picked him.

I was impressed with both photographers during the day, so I am looking forward to seeing how the photos turned out. It's always such a hard time waiting!

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