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08/05/2007 07:19:46 PM · #126 |
For the ones who want to split hairs...here is the first Upside Down I challenge. And if you look through there you will see entries from upside down cameras AND upside down subjects.
Take your pick and put your entry in.
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08/05/2007 07:20:31 PM · #127 |
Originally posted by Judi:
Would everyone stop whinging? The description was simplified. Get over it and get out there and get a photo if you haven't already done so. Sheez!! |
Oh... the whining by the OP seems to have worked! (I'm not whining! I'll submit my image, as is.) |
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08/05/2007 07:25:17 PM · #128 |
First of all, challenge descriptions aren't rules, they are guidelines. The rules are here and they haven't changed.
Now then, the description of the challenge was modified because most people, including us, couldn't figure out what the heck it meant. We got numerous requests to clarify and we couldn't so we modified it for better understanding. However, it wasn't narrowed in scope, nor were any possible interpretations that you derived from the original description taken away so if you've already shot your entry, it really shouldn't affect you at all. In fact, we intentionally made the description as broad as possible so as NOT to unfairly affect anyone who had already shot their entry, regardless of whatever interpretation of the wonky description they'd used. It's really nothing to get all upset over.
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08/05/2007 07:27:29 PM · #129 |
| I See this is going bad. photos should be fun ,and fun taking them . Put your photo in from the first cluster ....,and see what happens, i did . ithink it will be a interesting voting . ps just enjoy your photos |
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08/05/2007 07:56:06 PM · #130 |
Originally posted by mk:
...it wasn't narrowed in scope, nor were any possible interpretations that you derived from the original description taken away... |
Simply.... The first challenge description clearly implied capturing an image with the camera in an upside down orientation. What do you mean? Can you clarify further, please, based on your statement regarding..."... nor were any possible interpretations that you derived from the original description taken away..."
Since my current image submission may attract dnmc votes based on the new challenge description, shouldn't the images taken with camera in upright orientation be the images marked dnmc? Yes, I know the enforcement of the original wording was not enforceable. Yet, out of fairness... should you not somehow protect those who shot this challenge in good faith .... based on the original challenge description?
Hey! It's okay! My image will work in any environment. But, I'm not sure there should be a lot of kow-towing to the OP whiner. (My image will be submitted "as is", in compliance with the original announcement.) And, when I vote on this challenge, I'll give everyone the benefit of the doubt. (I'm pretty sure I won't be granted the same courtesy by the majority of voters. And, that's the rub!) |
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08/05/2007 08:09:13 PM · #131 |
Hellooo Children's Toy challenge, I am not coming anywhere near this challenge. gonna watch the scores thread for this one though... k-o
And can I get whoot whoot for all us procrastinators out there who haven't even started shooting for Tuesday yet! :) |
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08/05/2007 08:19:14 PM · #132 |
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08/05/2007 08:29:37 PM · #133 |
The original challenge description was fascinating in its ambiguity. The revised challenge description is comparatively banal. I join in the chorus of BOOS for the change. I consider it one of the low points in the dumbing-down of DPC.
R.
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08/05/2007 08:30:53 PM · #134 |
Originally posted by mk:
First of all, challenge descriptions aren't rules, they are guidelines. The rules are here and they haven't changed.
However, it wasn't narrowed in scope, nor were any possible interpretations that you derived from the original description taken away so if you've already shot your entry, it really shouldn't affect you at all. In fact, we intentionally made the description as broad as possible so as NOT to unfairly affect anyone who had already shot their entry, regardless of whatever interpretation of the wonky description they'd used. It's really nothing to get all upset over. |
I think you are totally missing the point. Yes my photo would still meet the new "guidelines". The problem is that mine was created in a way that is way more difficult than the "guidelines" now in place. Essentially like climbing a large, difficult hill to get to the top, only to find out after you are done that someone decided to open an elevator to the top for everyone else to use. It is totally not fair to those that shot the original meaning of the challenge.
As for saying that "the description of the challenge was modified because most people, including us, couldn't figure out what the heck it meant.", I find that impossible to believe. Is there not a process that occurs before something is approved as a subject of a challenge? Is it not discussed beforehand? It is just ridiculous for you to try and tell people that you created a challenge, released it to the members, and did not know what the "guidelines" were before doing so. |
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08/05/2007 08:34:10 PM · #135 |
Originally posted by basssman7:
As for saying that "the description of the challenge was modified because most people, including us, couldn't figure out what the heck it meant.", I find that impossible to believe. Is there not a process that occurs before something is approved as a subject of a challenge? Is it not discussed beforehand? It is just ridiculous for you to try and tell people that you created a challenge, released it to the members, and did not know what the "guidelines" were before doing so. |
I believe SC has no say in what challenges are chosen and how the description is worded. It is up to Langdon or Drew, I am pretty sure. |
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08/05/2007 08:35:59 PM · #136 |
Originally posted by mk:
First of all, challenge descriptions aren't rules, they are guidelines. The rules are here and they haven't changed.
However, it wasn't narrowed in scope, nor were any possible interpretations that you derived from the original description taken away so if you've already shot your entry, it really shouldn't affect you at all. |
hahan 23 has the correct point in regards to this. If the original clearly stated (and it did) that the camera needs to be in an upside down position when the picture is taken, how was that NOT taken away?? I do not see that provision there now. |
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08/05/2007 08:37:49 PM · #137 |
Originally posted by Bear_Music:
The original challenge description was fascinating in its ambiguity. |
DPC voters hate "ambiguity" and are always on the lookout for an excuse for a DNMC downgrade. I wish it were not so, but so it seems ... |
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08/05/2007 08:40:24 PM · #138 |
Originally posted by jdannels:
I believe SC has no say in what challenges are chosen and how the description is worded. It is up to Langdon or Drew, I am pretty sure. |
We can have input to the pool of challenges (as can all of you), but we have no idea which challenge is scheduled at any given time; there is no "last-minute review" before a challenge is posted by anyone but the admins.
To paraphrase Scoop Nisker (legendary Bay Area FM radio reporter), if you don't like the challenge descriptions, write some of your own.
Message edited by author 2007-08-05 20:42:14. |
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08/05/2007 08:41:48 PM · #139 |
Originally posted by jdannels:
Originally posted by basssman7:
As for saying that "the description of the challenge was modified because most people, including us, couldn't figure out what the heck it meant.", I find that impossible to believe. Is there not a process that occurs before something is approved as a subject of a challenge? Is it not discussed beforehand? It is just ridiculous for you to try and tell people that you created a challenge, released it to the members, and did not know what the "guidelines" were before doing so. |
I believe SC has no say in what challenges are chosen and how the description is worded. It is up to Langdon or Drew, I am pretty sure. |
Ok, fair enough. however when MK says "even us" did not know what the heck the wording meant..it clearly implies that they had something to do with changing it, which is what this is all about. Why not do the proper thing and CLARIFY the original, for example telling folks that "upside right" is the same thing as "rightside up" which is what most of the posters were complaining about??
As well as the fact that SC should know better than to completely change a challenge when it is almost 3/4 of the way over.
As for those that say "get over it", I challenge them to spend 14 hours of their weekend shooting a dslr upside down (no lcd to use for framing), and then go to submit, only to find out that everyone else will be allowed to simply shoot like it was a free study, then flip the stupid image in photoshop and be treated the same way! |
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08/05/2007 08:45:24 PM · #140 |
Originally posted by Judi:
For the ones who want to split hairs...here is the first Upside Down I challenge. And if you look through there you will see entries from upside down cameras AND upside down subjects.
Take your pick and put your entry in. |
Judi, check out the description that went with that challenge. If this challenge was given the same description it would not have caused all the problems because I would not have spend my entire weekend with an upside down camera. This old challenge has nothing whatsover to do with this.
"Description
It's a camera angle. It's a subject position. It's whatever your creativity limits you to. Your photo must be taken this week (05/6-05/12). Good luck!"
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08/05/2007 08:46:16 PM · #141 |
Originally posted by basssman7:
... flip the stupid image in photoshop and be treated the same way! |
"Upside down" does not really say "180° Rotation" to me ... if you have a great picture of which you're proud, enter it and see how it does. Otherwise, sit on it for about ten days or so (until the voting is over) and then post it in its own thread so it can garner all the attention you think it deserves.
Message edited by author 2007-08-05 20:46:37. |
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08/05/2007 08:47:15 PM · #142 |
Originally posted by basssman7:
As for those that say "get over it", I challenge them to spend 14 hours of their weekend shooting a dslr upside down (no lcd to use for framing), and then go to submit, only to find out that everyone else will be allowed to simply shoot like it was a free study, then flip the stupid image in photoshop and be treated the same way! |
I did....and I was 4 meters up in the air at the time. But I still stand by my entry in the fact of self satisfaction that I have done it the hard way. My entry stays.
Message edited by author 2007-08-05 20:48:01.
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08/05/2007 08:49:42 PM · #143 |
Originally posted by Judi:
Would everyone stop whinging? The description was simplified. Get over it and get out there and get a photo if you haven't already done so. Sheez!! |
Judi, that is a complete insult! I have spend 14 hours this weekend taking pictures with my upside down camera. Your lack of thought before posting that comment is stunning. |
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08/05/2007 08:54:38 PM · #144 |
Originally posted by GeneralE:
Originally posted by basssman7:
... flip the stupid image in photoshop and be treated the same way! |
"Upside down" does not really say "180° Rotation" to me ... if you have a great picture of which you're proud, enter it and see how it does. Otherwise, sit on it for about ten days or so (until the voting is over) and then post it in its own thread so it can garner all the attention you think it deserves. |
From Webster:
Main Entry: up·side down
Pronunciation: '&p-"sId-'daun
Function: adverb
Etymology: alteration of Middle English up so doun, from up + so + doun down
1 : in such a way that the upper and the lower parts are reversed in position
Is that not describing a 180 degree rotation?
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08/05/2007 08:57:33 PM · #145 |
Originally posted by basssman7:
Originally posted by Judi:
Would everyone stop whinging? The description was simplified. Get over it and get out there and get a photo if you haven't already done so. Sheez!! |
Judi, that is a complete insult! I have spend 14 hours this weekend taking pictures with my upside down camera. Your lack of thought before posting that comment is stunning. |
I know you spent 14 hours taking the image...you said so before. And in no way did I direct this at any one person. I was being very generalized as everytime I entered this thread there was so much whinging....hence my statement.
As I said before...I took my shot upside down on a DSLR whilst being up in the air...don't you think I know what went into such a shot? And I entered it...and I stand by my entry as I am proud of it. If you are proud of your accomplishment...then stand by it and keep it in the challenge.
There will be others that will probably just flip their image...so what? Let them. But at least you can feel proud that you entered it with all the hard work behind it.
Now where is the insult in that? I am not insulted at the change of description...in fact I am relieved. As there will be too many confused DNMC police out there if they only had the original description to go on. At least now (for the ones that have read the new challenge anyway) there will be a few LESS DNMC police on this challenge.
If it really worries you...do as  GeneralE suggested and hold off until after the voting and show everyone then. But whatever the case...be proud of what YOU have accomplished.
I am.
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08/05/2007 08:59:37 PM · #146 |
| Okay, my image has been submitted. Camera in upside down orientation. Subject in "right-side-up" orientation. I think it's great. Will be interesting to see how many dnmc comments and votes I get on this. Anything is okay with me. Just an academic exercise to see how unconscious the voters may be.... |
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08/05/2007 09:00:37 PM · #147 |
Originally posted by Judi:
At least now (for the ones that have read the new challenge anyway) there will be a few LESS DNMC police on this challenge.
If it really worries you...do as GeneralE suggested and hold off until after the voting and show everyone then. But whatever the case...be proud of what YOU have accomplished.
I am. |
then you would be happier if every challenge was a free study? What is the point of a "challenge" if there is no challenge for people to attempt? This place would then be called "DP Show us your best image". |
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08/05/2007 09:06:01 PM · #148 |
Originally posted by hahn23:
Okay, my image has been submitted. Camera in upside down orientation. Subject in "right-side-up" orientation. I think it's great. Will be interesting to see how many dnmc comments and votes I get on this. Anything is okay with me. Just an academic exercise to see how unconscious the voters may be.... |
I wish you well. :)
I will not be entering until the challenge is described as it was originally. If "they" can change it once, they can change it back to the way it should be! If "they" don't, then they really have as Bear suggested, made the entire membership out to be stupid.
I wonder how in a community of thousands.... a thread involving 15 or so people causes a major change to the description of a challenge? (after the challenge was almost over..) Is it because of who did the complaining? Or is it simply that the squeeky wheel gets the grease? I think not, because I have seen several threads with hundreds of people asking for all submissions to be 720 pixels, but that has not happened yet. hmmm. |
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08/05/2007 09:19:17 PM · #149 |
Originally posted by basssman7:
...hmmm. |
hmmm...Indeed! |
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08/05/2007 09:22:50 PM · #150 |
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