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DPChallenge Forums >> Challenge Results >> An open apology to Lisa Lent (lentil)
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 07/05/2007 09:01:47 PM · #1
OMG


With a Pink DQ Header.

I want to go on record here and state that this disqualification is partly based on my fault. Lisa had shown me this shot, before cropping, and I had suggested that she use this shot as a Negative Space entry after I showed her this wider-aspect crop, that cut out the person on the left. I also mentioned to remove the sensor dust, that I now found out after seeing the original, that it was water run-off. The version I saw had been edited already and looked like a little sensor dust. This is a case of when someone should contact the SC for an opinion, rather than listening to the suggestions of someone that is "supposed" to know, as was the case here.

I'll take the blame on this one and wish somehow the DQ could be overturned.
If the SC and/or Langdon can DQ mine in it's place, the planets would be back in alignment.

I am so sorry Lisa.

Message edited by author 2007-07-05 21:09:43.
 07/05/2007 09:15:10 PM · #2
You evil man. Alas, I forgive you. ;)
 07/05/2007 09:27:17 PM · #3
...


Message edited by author 2007-07-11 17:36:23.
 07/05/2007 09:30:55 PM · #4
It's real simple.
Lisa followed MY suggestion.
In the eyes of anyone seeing the DQ and the SC comments, it looks like she did wrong. She did, but it was listening to me, not in her editing.
 07/05/2007 09:32:32 PM · #5
she was in the top 10 position and got DQ'ed.
must have sucked.
 07/05/2007 09:45:10 PM · #6
Originally posted by Brad:
It's real simple.
Lisa followed MY suggestion.
In the eyes of anyone seeing the DQ and the SC comments, it looks like she did wrong. She did, but it was listening to me, not in her editing.


and as you mentioned in your OP it shows that the best source for info is the SC. You were hopeing to help others learn from your error instead of keeping it between you all. Good on you Brad.
 07/05/2007 09:47:40 PM · #7
Originally posted by Brad:
This is a case of when someone should contact the SC for an opinion, rather than listening to the suggestions of someone that is "supposed" to know, as was the case here.



I don't know about that. If you ask for SC opinion, that's just what it is, an opinion. The final opinion will be after the challenge if you're in the top spots. Even if the person had contacted them, it might still have gone DQ. So don't beat yourself up. If the spots would have been circular in appearance in the final size, if not cloned, I don't see how SC could have made the call. If they blew it up from the raw to be able to tell IMHO they did the author a disservice. But, don't get me wrong, SC, like voters, can do no wrong. I didn't believe that when I arrived here but have come to accept that over the past six months. I suspect my first DQ will probably coincide with my first top ten, or ribbon. ;)
 07/05/2007 09:49:14 PM · #8
Once again I am reminded of why you are on my favorites list. Not only are you an outstanding photographer, but you are an upstanding citizen of this community.
 07/05/2007 09:54:33 PM · #9
Originally posted by philup:
I don't understand why you have to make an open apology. Keep this between you and lisa and the SC. You made a mistake so leave it at that. Don't bring everbody else into this problem that YOU made! JUST IMO


good lord, i dont see how he is "bringing everyone into it" the guy just wants to get it off his chest....sounds like someone forgot their ritalin
 07/05/2007 09:54:50 PM · #10
Originally posted by fir3bird:
Originally posted by Brad:
This is a case of when someone should contact the SC for an opinion, rather than listening to the suggestions of someone that is "supposed" to know, as was the case here.



I don't know about that. If you ask for SC opinion, that's just what it is, an opinion. The final opinion will be after the challenge if you're in the top spots. Even if the person had contacted them, it might still have gone DQ. So don't beat yourself up. If the spots would have been circular in appearance in the final size, if not cloned, I don't see how SC could have made the call. If they blew it up from the raw to be able to tell IMHO they did the author a disservice. But, don't get me wrong, SC, like voters, can do no wrong. I didn't believe that when I arrived here but have come to accept that over the past six months. I suspect my first DQ will probably coincide with my first top ten, or ribbon. ;)

In this case, the Site Council did the right thing. I never saw the original. After seeing it, it was pretty obvious and would have never talked Lisa into cloning it out had I seen the original. Shame this happened. It's an awesome shot regardless and so wish I had taken a shot like that. She had a great eye for seeing that to begin with. She just listened to a nitwit after the fact.
 07/05/2007 09:58:03 PM · #11
Originally posted by Brad:
She just listened to a nitwit after the fact.

Ooooooo... Are you asking for a username change? ;)
 07/05/2007 10:28:11 PM · #12
Originally posted by smardaz:
Originally posted by philup:
I don't understand why you have to make an open apology. Keep this between you and lisa and the SC. You made a mistake so leave it at that. Don't bring everbody else into this problem that YOU made! JUST IMO


good lord, i dont see how he is "bringing everyone into it" the guy just wants to get it off his chest....sounds like someone forgot their ritalin


I so agree that this was a really nice thing to do! There's nothing more courageous or humbling than admitting one's mistake. Doing it in a public forum also allowed others to see how the person's photo got to be disqualified and, I for one, APPLAUD his bravery!!!! BRAVO!!!!
 07/05/2007 10:35:14 PM · #13
I'm sorry for Lisa's DQ and sorry about your error, Brad. While its a shame, it still a great photograph and the world is so much bigger than DPC.... I'm sure Lisa will find other uses for such a nice image. :D
 07/05/2007 11:10:01 PM · #14
Originally posted by fir3bird:
Originally posted by Brad:
This is a case of when someone should contact the SC for an opinion, rather than listening to the suggestions of someone that is "supposed" to know, as was the case here.



I don't know about that. If you ask for SC opinion, that's just what it is, an opinion. The final opinion will be after the challenge if you're in the top spots. Even if the person had contacted them, it might still have gone DQ. So don't beat yourself up. If the spots would have been circular in appearance in the final size, if not cloned, I don't see how SC could have made the call. If they blew it up from the raw to be able to tell IMHO they did the author a disservice. But, don't get me wrong, SC, like voters, can do no wrong. I didn't believe that when I arrived here but have come to accept that over the past six months. I suspect my first DQ will probably coincide with my first top ten, or ribbon. ;)


I'd say the SC would be the first to tell you that thy're not perfect but this was an easy call. It sucks that it got dq'd as it is a good shot and certainly wasn't intentionally done but you can't clone out anything other than sensor dust and hot pixels in basic(we were lucky to get that rule changed so I'm sure they watch that pretty heavily). If they did blow up the RAW file to see it how does that do a disservice to anybody? To me, this shows that they are on their toes and not much might get by them when someone does deliberately cheat.

An unintentional breaking of the editing rules does make it tougher to swallow but so does paying a speeding ticket when you didn't realize you were 10 mph over the limit.

07/05/2007 11:24:36 PM · #15
Kudos to you, Brad, for stepping up and telling us what happened. I feel for both of you...you, because you're an idiot (you know I LUV you, lol), KIDDING...and for Lisa because this shot is gorgeous and unfortunately got DQ'd. You're a great guy for explaining and coming to Lisa's defense.
 07/05/2007 11:30:09 PM · #16
It's an easy mistake to make - especially in an edited, resized shot.

I was going to submit a shot for sea-scape that had a few messy splotchy things in it (enough to be a major distraction) - I initially thought that all were dust artifacts and cloned them out.

Unfortunately, on closer inspection it became apparent that a couple of them were not dust but rather blurred out boats in the distance. In the end they annoyed me enough that I decided not to submit.
 07/05/2007 11:39:22 PM · #17
Brad.....tsk tsk tsk ....... the badge of honor is due:



Wear it with humility. ;-)
 07/06/2007 01:23:52 AM · #18
This is a prime example where a public posting of the original would be of interest.
 07/11/2007 05:04:17 PM · #19
I really respect honest people. Way to go Brad. I now will never trust anyone telling me to remove sensor dust.

You did the right thing by creating this forum. Many would not had had the courage or be humble enough to do so.
 07/11/2007 05:17:22 PM · #20
Brad, you have shattered my illusions! I thought you knew what you were doing, especially after the recent Skip millionaire thingie! But, it seems you are human, after all, just like the rest of us.

The mistake was made, the lesson is learnt. Don't beat yourself up over it. Just tread carefully for a couple of weeks :))

It takes a good person to admit they cocked up big time, you cocked up big time:) Make your peace with lentil and don't do it again!
 07/11/2007 05:26:33 PM · #21
Originally posted by Brad:
OMG


With a Pink DQ Header.

I want to go on record here and state that this disqualification is partly based on my fault. Lisa had shown me this shot, before cropping, and I had suggested that she use this shot as a Negative Space entry after I showed her this wider-aspect crop, that cut out the person on the left. I also mentioned to remove the sensor dust, that I now found out after seeing the original, that it was water run-off. The version I saw had been edited already and looked like a little sensor dust. This is a case of when someone should contact the SC for an opinion, rather than listening to the suggestions of someone that is "supposed" to know, as was the case here.

I'll take the blame on this one and wish somehow the DQ could be overturned.
If the SC and/or Langdon can DQ mine in it's place, the planets would be back in alignment.

I am so sorry Lisa.


It's fantastic that you have the courage to step up and say what happened. We (at SC) talked about this image a lot, wondering if the water-drops were confused for sensor dust. It came down to being fair to all, it isn't fair to all to make an exception for one.

There is no way we can DQ your image in place of Lisa's, no matter how much anyone of us might like to do so :) Ultimately, the responsibility for the image is with the photographer.

On the other hand, DQs happen all the time, things happen, like for example people travel and forget to reset their camera's time/date to the new place; it's not that big of a deal, life goes on.

It's great that you're a good friend, and that you stand up for what's true, but in this case the DQ will have to stand. And it is just as beautiful an image DQed or not.

07/11/2007 05:35:16 PM · #22
Good for you Brad. Now go out and fave her image.

edit: can't spell

Message edited by author 2007-07-11 17:35:32.
 07/11/2007 05:43:48 PM · #23
I guess I had better respond :)

I will be the first to say I am completely bummed that I got DQ'd but thats life. A mistake was made and I have hopefully learnt from it. I still like the image and at the end of the day that is the main thing.

Now Brad, you silly man. I didnt have to listen to you. Dont feel even the tiniest bit at fault. It is all bygones my friend.

Brad even felt so bad that he bought me a membership (naughty) so I could advance edit. LOL. I guess I had better at least come where I did on the DQ to pay him back huh.

Thanks to everyone for the lovely comments
Lisa
 07/15/2007 06:55:32 AM · #24
Both of you - Brad and Lisa - show a lot of integrity on this, ultimately much more important than a DPC challenge. Lisa I'm sure you'll be up there again soon and Brad you don't have to prove anything, you've already sone so many times.

Jack
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