| Author | Thread |
|
|
06/10/2007 02:04:08 PM · #1076 |
Originally posted by purpleflutterby13:
...(see what hanging out with philosophers does to you? I can't even take a photo without then writing a 10 page essay discussing the underlying concepts of doing so. Bloody philosophers, honestly.) |
Keeps 'em busy, otherwise they'd fall into a pit of despair and spend 30 pages writing about *that*. |
|
|
|
06/10/2007 02:06:09 PM · #1077 |
Originally posted by krnodil:
Originally posted by purpleflutterby13:
...(see what hanging out with philosophers does to you? I can't even take a photo without then writing a 10 page essay discussing the underlying concepts of doing so. Bloody philosophers, honestly.) |
Keeps 'em busy, otherwise they'd fall into a pit of despair and spend 30 pages writing about *that*. |
:) it's funny cause it's true... |
|
|
|
06/10/2007 02:32:17 PM · #1078 |
Originally posted by purpleflutterby13:
And it's true that people seem to really excel at photography when they are photographing things they love. |
I hadn't thought about this. Nice observation. I'd say that many of the great photographers are in love with light (or darkness).
Originally posted by flutter:
The model of photography as simple representation seems obviously false to anyone who ever spent any length of time doing it. Photography as creation, well... With painting or writing, while arguably people put in bits of the world and themselves into their creations, this isn't a necessary thing - it could be entirely abstract, and coming entirely from your head. |
It could be argued that nothing comes entirely from your head (that's philosophy, not a putdown :) ). In painting, you learn a whole bunch of techniques to represent reality. Like photography, only slower. Even abstract painters are in some way addressing those techniques when they paint. Just like photographers can be completely abstract, can make it impossible to recognize what they are photographing.
Originally posted by flutter:
Photography, on the other hand, is by its very nature tied to the world. |
so are humans, I would argue.
Originally posted by fultter:
photographers look for certain aesthetics |
or they see a certain aesthetic everywhere they look, and try to capture it, which would modify your array somewhat.
Originally posted by flutter:
And people then tap into things they like and things that drive them (which could be anything. Could be a feeling of connection to nature. Could be women wearing PVC.) |
or it could be something more general, like light as I've mentioned, or mass, or humanity, or inhumanity, or nature as you mentioned.
Originally posted by flutterpie:
and look for ways of capturing their essence. |
photography and art is not always so profound. there are entire schools of art that say essence is an illusion. and art can reveal that illusion. art can preserve a momentary, fleeting joy.
Originally posted by panfluter:
And you look for that meaning in the world, but in the process you also take control of the world and create the meaning you went out to find in it. |
or to continue what I said above, you give up control, and you demonstrate how control is impossible. you dwell in mystery and a blissful sort of helplessness.
Originally posted by flutterby:
Well, that, or you could just snap away :) |
Snapping away is my M.O. One of these days, I am going to start a thread about Max Ernst and his experiments with randomness.
oh, and thank you so much for letting your philosophy show. It seems to be mostly taboo at DPC.
Message edited by author 2007-06-10 14:33:06. |
|
|
|
06/10/2007 03:56:37 PM · #1079 |
Originally posted by posthumous:
It could be argued that nothing comes entirely from your head (that's philosophy, not a putdown :) ). In painting, you learn a whole bunch of techniques to represent reality. Like photography, only slower. Even abstract painters are in some way addressing those techniques when they paint. Just like photographers can be completely abstract, can make it impossible to recognize what they are photographing. |
Oh, agreed actually. While I was writing it, I couldn't decide if it made any sense to declare any branch of art as capable of being entirely abstract and dissociated from the world. But I kinda figured that with something like painting, it's at least theoretically possible (though maybe unattainable in practise), whereas the medium of photography ties it to the world a priori - light signals hit (or fail to hit) a sensor, that's what photography is. Probably not actually an important distinction to make though, really.
Originally posted by posthumous:
Originally posted by flutter:
Photography, on the other hand, is by its very nature tied to the world. |
so are humans, I would argue. |
Cartesian doubts aside :p
Originally posted by posthumous:
Originally posted by flutter:
photographers look for certain aesthetics |
or they see a certain aesthetic everywhere they look, and try to capture it, which would modify your array somewhat. |
Are they really entirely passive? Or does, say, a particular play of shadows or lines really strike a chord with someone, and that's why they see it everywhere?
Originally posted by posthumous:
Originally posted by flutter:
And people then tap into things they like and things that drive them (which could be anything. Could be a feeling of connection to nature. Could be women wearing PVC.) |
or it could be something more general, like light as I've mentioned, or mass, or humanity, or inhumanity, or nature as you mentioned. |
Yeah, anything really - from abstract ideals (freedom, justice) to straightforward personal preferences (roses are pretty).
Originally posted by posthumous:
Originally posted by flutterpie:
and look for ways of capturing their essence. |
photography and art is not always so profound. there are entire schools of art that say essence is an illusion. and art can reveal that illusion. art can preserve a momentary, fleeting joy. |
:) Maybe I made it sound too profound really. People find something appealing (and capturing an essence of something can be appealing, so I guess it's a subcategory). The thing they find appealing appears in their photos. Other similarly-minded people can then pick of on that appeal, and if it goes well, they go: 'Ooh, they really captured something there.' Or the lack of something. Heh, I'll have to think about that...
Originally posted by posthumous:
Originally posted by panfluter:
And you look for that meaning in the world, but in the process you also take control of the world and create the meaning you went out to find in it. |
or to continue what I said above, you give up control, and you demonstrate how control is impossible. you dwell in mystery and a blissful sort of helplessness. |
:) I can see it, but not identify with it. Though it does sound like a nice state of mind to be in. All my previous attempts to accept that certainty is an illusion and control is impossible ended in, um, looking for certainty and trying to gain more control.
Originally posted by posthumous:
oh, and thank you so much for letting your philosophy show. It seems to be mostly taboo at DPC. |
Thanks for taking me up on it :) It's no fun if noone argues back. |
|
|
|
06/10/2007 04:10:01 PM · #1080 |
Originally posted by purpleflutterby13:
Probably not actually an important distinction to make though, really. |
oh no, it's an important distinction, just one that should be questioned. :)
Originally posted by panfluter:
:) I can see it, but not identify with it. Though it does sound like a nice state of mind to be in. All my previous attempts to accept that certainty is an illusion and control is impossible ended in, um, looking for certainty and trying to gain more control. |
I would say these are two schools of thought, with plenty of artists in both camps. In poetry I call it the "builders" vs. the "listeners." I am a listener. I listen to voices. Other people build poems. Yeats was said to write his ideas out in prose and then build that into a poem. Not for me!
Originally posted by purple:
Thanks for taking me up on it :) It's no fun if noone argues back. |
I guess I'm Hegelian. Every time an idea is proposed, I see the opposite idea and I think the two opposites can help each other. |
|
|
|
06/10/2007 04:46:19 PM · #1081 |
I have no idea who or what Hegel is/was or one can become an ian of same, but Jelena said Or does, say, a particular play of shadows or lines really strike a chord with someone, and that's why they see it everywhere? to which I say YES!
|
|
|
|
06/10/2007 04:54:18 PM · #1082 |
Originally posted by posthumous:
I guess I'm Hegelian. Every time an idea is proposed, I see the opposite idea and I think the two opposites can help each other. |
Otherwise known as "a pain in the ass" - I can say this, with affection, because I am afflicted with the same impulse. :D Also known, with a shade of a better rep, as "devil's advocate".
I'd also argue for a third camp of artistic expression, the "listening builder" (or "building listener", if you prefer) - someone who synthesizes both strategies and creates a tricky balance between the intentional and the serendipitous. I'm blanking on examples right now, or I'd serve up some.
Would you say, though, Posthumous, that even a "listener" must impose some structure on the output resulting from those voices? That there is some building, however sketchy, involved? |
|
|
|
06/10/2007 05:56:59 PM · #1083 |
Originally posted by Melethia:
I have no idea who or what Hegel is/was or one can become an ian of same, but Jelena said Or does, say, a particular play of shadows or lines really strike a chord with someone, and that's why they see it everywhere? to which I say YES! |
I hadn't heard of him either so I googled it Link
And yes I agree with Jelena's statement as well.
Message edited by author 2007-06-10 17:59:16.
|
|
|
|
06/10/2007 06:19:24 PM · #1084 |
don, you show off.
Immanuel Kant was a real pissant
Who was very rarely stable
Heidegger, Heidegger was a boozy beggar
Who could think you under the table
David Hume could out-consume
Wilhelm Friedrich Hegel
And Wittgenstein was a beery swine
Who was just as schloshed as Schlegel
this was one of our favourite songs in universtiy philosophy - amost all of which i've forgotten bar the names.
that's why i love team suck. such great discussions.
i just discovered a new and funky processing trick so i thought i'd share it with everyone.
i wanted to break up the photo filter i used in this image:  and tried a new technique. i used the clone stamp, set on pattern. then, at a pretty low opacity, randomly brushed about three diferent patterns over it - so it's layer masking with a pattern. it's subtle, but makes a good random mask.
|
|
|
|
06/10/2007 06:30:43 PM · #1085 |
Originally posted by krnodil:
Originally posted by posthumous:
I guess I'm Hegelian. Every time an idea is proposed, I see the opposite idea and I think the two opposites can help each other. |
Otherwise known as "a pain in the ass" |
yup that pretty much covers it!
and yes, listeners have to build and builders have to listen. the distinction might be self-perception more than anything else. (in fact, it could be argued that incorporating only one approach creates crappy poetry)
and the only thing I know about Hegel is that he came up with this notion that every idea (thesis) fosters an opposite (antithesis), and together they create a synthesis. I differ in that I think synthesis is not always possible or desirable.
He is probably best known for being adopted by Karl Marx, who said the same thing happens to economic systems, which would eventually result in an ideal state called Communism. So much for theories. |
|
|
|
06/10/2007 07:04:27 PM · #1086 |
Originally posted by xianart:
don, you show off.
Immanuel Kant was a real pissant
Who was very rarely stable
Heidegger, Heidegger was a boozy beggar
Who could think you under the table
David Hume could out-consume
Wilhelm Friedrich Hegel
And Wittgenstein was a beery swine
Who was just as schloshed as Schlegel
this was one of our favourite songs in universtiy philosophy - amost all of which i've forgotten bar the names.
that's why i love team suck. such great discussions.
i just discovered a new and funky processing trick so i thought i'd share it with everyone.
i wanted to break up the photo filter i used in this image: and tried a new technique. i used the clone stamp, set on pattern. then, at a pretty low opacity, randomly brushed about three diferent patterns over it - so it's layer masking with a pattern. it's subtle, but makes a good random mask. |
John Stuart Mill of his own Free Will
On half a pint of shandy was particularly ill,
Plato, they say, could stick it away,
half a pint of whiskey every day.
Aristotle, Aristotle, was a bugger for the bottle,
Hobbes was fond of his dram,
and Rene Descartes was a drunken fart,
"I drink, therefore I am".
Yes, Socrates himself is particularly missed -
A lovely little thinker but a bugger when he's pissed!
Absolutely impossible to avoid that song in certain university departments. :)
Great technique, so glad you decided to share! |
|
|
|
06/10/2007 08:25:31 PM · #1087 |
 flowers for everyone. |
|
|
|
06/10/2007 11:19:25 PM · #1088 |
Originally posted by quiet_observation:
flowers for everyone. |
Heh, heh! Great shot, Mary!
Ours in Harrisburg will be July 28th......last year's was where I took my Best of 2006 shot.....
I'm a Silent Witness, details here: //www.silentwitnesspa.org/ and will be there this year again to serve and be a photographer for the Silent Witness program, the Central Voice-our local alternative newspaper, and my church.
The GLBT community has been tremendously encouraging and supportive of my photography and it's humorous and engaging to this 51 year old straight family man how much they've accepted me as their friend. I've made many friends and have a deep appreciation for how much I've overlooked of the equality struggles my friends have endured over the years simply by my own acceptance of people for who they are as I grew up. So I am a staunch supporter of equal rights as it affects my friends. I'm looking forward to this year's PrideFest!
|
|
|
|
06/10/2007 11:29:16 PM · #1089 |
Originally posted by purpleflutterby13:
And it's true that people seem to really excel at photography when they are photographing things they love. |
Originally posted by posthumous:
I hadn't thought about this. Nice observation. I'd say that many of the great photographers are in love with light (or darkness). |
I question this only from my own personal experiences. I am finding that I'm learning to love different things because of what my photography is showing me. I would never have imagined that I have a real thing for old windows had I not been engaging in the Ordinary Things project. Through just taking shots of some of my favorite places and concentrating on the window theme, I have discovered that I'm pretty good at it, AND......have developed the love for windows taken in various manners BECAUSE of how they turn out from my camera.
And all of a sudden I know where there are many that I want to shoot that apparently have been of latent interest without my realizing it.
I was never any good at portraits for years, either, and never had much interest because of it. Now, it seems like I have a pretty good knack for candids, and have gotten some outstanding pieces of late.
This whole thing has been an adventure over the last year and I have no idea where it'll take me, but I sure am enjoying the ride!
|
|
|
|
06/10/2007 11:29:22 PM · #1090 |
Got a candid shot in, though I don't expect it'll be a personal best for me. Switching to 8bit color always seems to make my images look very washed out.
|
|
|
|
06/11/2007 12:02:46 AM · #1091 |
Double Take results are up in the Challenge Results Thread.
|
|
|
|
06/11/2007 12:12:46 AM · #1092 |
Jeb, the Silent Witness program sounds terrific! Like you, I'm a straight family guy, but I'm completely comfortable with people of various sexualities. One of my gay friends seems to delight in bringing me along, actually. I've certainly seen some interesting things as a result. :)
In fact, we were going to bike down to the Gay Pride festival today, but I had an active day outside yesterday with my family at the 95th Girl Scout birthday singalong on the National Mall: 150,000 people! And tomorrow, he and I and another friend are going to the amusement park (yep, we're taking a day of vacation!). So I took it easy today.
|
|
|
|
06/11/2007 01:02:59 AM · #1093 |
Originally posted by posthumous:
I guess I'm Hegelian. Every time an idea is proposed, I see the opposite idea and I think the two opposites can help each other. |
Originally posted by peter richards on sonnet central 1/16/04 (!):
With regard to ideology per se, Adrian Mitchell had one of my faves in a poem in which he had a transport café with a) an Irish labourer 'his words as soft and sweet as (his) tea' - representing the working class or 'left' and b) a sergeant: 'words as short and clipped as his moustache', no doubt standing for the conservative faction. In addition he has:
In the corner of the café sits a liberal
seeing both sides of every question,
one with the left eye
one with the right;
the cross-eyed, doomed hermaphrodite. |
|
|
|
|
06/11/2007 04:14:18 AM · #1094 |
Portrait edit:
Original:
Thank you  levyj413 for Photoshop advice :) |
|
|
|
06/11/2007 05:07:13 AM · #1095 |
Thanks for the DPI help!!
I now finally have a print available  and I'm just SO happy that it worked out!! :-D |
|
|
|
06/11/2007 06:46:01 AM · #1096 |
Jeb - that Silent Witness program sounds wonderful.
|
|
|
|
06/11/2007 09:01:14 AM · #1097 |
Originally posted by posthumous:
the cross-eyed, doomed hermaphrodite. |
yup, that's me! :D |
|
|
|
06/11/2007 09:25:31 AM · #1098 |
Joining the ranks of  Melethia and others, I've turned off my update button so I won't get so worked up over low votes during the week, saving that drama for the end of the voting period.
|
|
|
|
06/11/2007 09:31:10 AM · #1099 |
Originally posted by NikonJeb:
I'm a Silent Witness, details here: //www.silentwitnesspa.org/ and will be there this year again to serve and be a photographer for the Silent Witness program, the Central Voice-our local alternative newspaper, and my church.
|
Good for you, Jeb! It makes me so glad to see tolerance and understanding instead of hatred and righteousness. You are a good man. |
|
|
|
06/11/2007 10:07:35 AM · #1100 |
*sigh*..how do I turn off update button?...
PWL
Votes: 135
Views: 208
Avg Vote: 5.9481
Comments: 7
Favorites: 1
Candid IV
Votes: 21
Views: 34
Avg Vote: 4.3333
Comments: 0
And just entered Pure... Must take a look at criteria for Backsides now, that sounds like fun!
Ye gads just read last couple pages of post, now getting all self-doubting and angst-y.. good thing I'm not wearing my four-inch heels...lovely flower shot Mary! And Jeb good work with WP, sounds interesting, how'd you get into it?
Edit *for being too lazy to read past posts before posting*
Message edited by author 2007-06-11 10:15:28. |
|
