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04/30/2007 09:18:16 PM · #51 |
Originally posted by TechnoShroom:
Originally posted by inshaala:
Originally posted by TechnoShroom:
Originally posted by inshaala:
This isnt a go at you, but i think this is part of the problem... ... My experience when i have been over there is that if you want to go anywhere - shops, cinema, gym, work... you have to get in a car, there are no two ways about it. |
Very true, it is a huge problem. It won't be solved as some suggested by raising fuel prices. You just can't wipe away 50+ years of nation-wide poor city planning like that. |
But it could be if the money went back into subsidised public transport systems and public awareness programs... but then where is the american dream in that? |
I don't believe that you could add enough taxes to fuel sales to redesign or in many places create from scratch a public transportation infrastructure that is useful, efficient, and self funding. Definitely not without crippling the economy in the process. The problem goes beyond just adding the infrastructure and telling people to use it. You'd have to get developers and planners to rezone and redesign what's already in place and change the entire way they plan for new developments. |
and you think that public transport is efficient and profit making elsewhere? hehe - nice one... it is a merit good - in economics that means a free market economy would underprovide it based on the fact that it is a non-profitable exercise, yet it is a very desireable good (read "service"). Subsidy is always going to play a role in public goods such as transportation, complaining about the non-profitability of such things is like complaining about how squares arent round...
And yes - i did account for re-design... what is knocking a few things down and placing bus/train stations in their place or changing street layouts in the grand scheme of things anyway?
I was told in my economics class that even the taxes we pay in the uk do not cover the external costs of the consumption of that fuel... we arent even paying enough taxes to cover the total costs of using it! Staggering really.
And i just found this - it shows how much fuel costs in each country and the tax component of it for the year 2006:
Table of petrol prices |
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04/30/2007 09:18:27 PM · #52 |
$2.95/gallon here.
A month ago it was $1.89/gallon.
I know we are blessed with the cheapest gas in the world, but that just makes me angry. |
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04/30/2007 09:29:02 PM · #53 |
Regardless of the price, the oil companies are still screwing us. They blab on about production, plants on/off line and then announce $300 billion dollar profits. But it wasn't the $4.00 gas that helped.
They are in bed with the politicians and they all suck.
JM |
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04/30/2007 11:35:34 PM · #54 |
$3.29 a gallon Portland Oregon!!!!
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04/30/2007 11:40:15 PM · #55 |
Originally posted by DrAchoo:
I think you are in a cheap state... it's $3.25 here. |
yeah doc...i feel your pain...I live in Federal Way...Here in WA everyone is in an uproar as we seem to have the highest in the country |
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04/30/2007 11:46:26 PM · #56 |
Originally posted by DrAchoo:
[quote=Cam] [quote=_eug]
I thought the poor all took the bus... |
Actually no... you see the buses don't come out to the country... they only provide services to the urban poor.
Ray |
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04/30/2007 11:53:42 PM · #57 |
Originally posted by ClubJuggle:
Originally posted by swhiddon:
Originally posted by ClubJuggle:
Just curiosity -- what do you drive? |
2004 Jetta |
Good choice... if more people drove cars like that it would do a lot to slow the price increases.
~Terry |
So would everyone quiting their jobs and sitting at home :-)
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05/01/2007 12:26:51 AM · #58 |
I recently read that it takes 2.5 bushels of corn to make a gallon of ethanol, so how much fuel and man power does it take to grow, transport, refine, and deliver a gallon of ethanol, and what are the byproducts?
Solar, wind, and ocean current look the most promising to me. Solar, and a bit of propane for cooking, is all you need for conservative sail boat living, and it should be the same on land, except that transportation takes a lot of energy.
I drive a Ford Bronco II, 24 mpg, and my wife a Geo Tracker, 27 mpg.
Let's all take pictures of the local fuel prices, so that this thread will be a photo thread LOL.
Message edited by author 2007-05-01 00:29:23.
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05/01/2007 12:29:51 AM · #59 |
| $3.69 here in Los Angeles. California has the worst gas prices in the US. You can find the cheapest deals (sometimes) on gas in your area at //www.gasbuddy.com/. |
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05/01/2007 12:49:23 AM · #60 |
| $2.89 a gallon here in Dallas, TX. It Costs almost $65 to fill my truck. Usually go through 2-tanks a week. Last year when it was this hi it was on the news every night. It went down to $2.29 and right back up but you don't hear people talking about it like they did before. |
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05/01/2007 12:55:14 AM · #61 |
I tried to get an image of the gas price here, but numbers are changing so fast that the shutter speed on my camera don't go high enough to keep the numbers from blurring.
Ok so I am stretching it a little, but it is going up rapidly.
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05/01/2007 01:14:30 AM · #62 |
30 minutes ago:
Was within minutes of posting this that DPC died for nearly 12 hours.
Thought I broke it.
:(
Message edited by author 2007-05-01 13:44:11. |
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05/01/2007 01:02:08 PM · #63 |
gas prices always go up this time of year because now is when people start taking their vacations (so typically drive longer distances).
The problem I see with higher gas prices in general is that the majority of American goods are hauled by truck. Gas prices go up, the trucks have to pay more which means the companies who make the goods have to pay more which means the price of everything goes up. |
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05/01/2007 01:43:18 PM · #64 |
Originally posted by Megatherian:
The problem I see with higher gas prices in general is that the majority of American goods are hauled by truck. Gas prices go up, the trucks have to pay more which means the companies who make the goods have to pay more which means the price of everything goes up. |
Can someone explain to me why it's cheaper to ship by truck than by rail? I'd figure that rail would be cheaper for longer distances, say >3 hours. |
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05/01/2007 01:51:32 PM · #65 |
Originally posted by _eug:
Originally posted by Megatherian:
The problem I see with higher gas prices in general is that the majority of American goods are hauled by truck. Gas prices go up, the trucks have to pay more which means the companies who make the goods have to pay more which means the price of everything goes up. |
Can someone explain to me why it's cheaper to ship by truck than by rail? I'd figure that rail would be cheaper for longer distances, say >3 hours. |
I didn't think that it was. However, even if you ship by rail, for the vast majority of products there are going to be at least two truck trips if not more before it reaches the point of sale. |
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05/01/2007 01:52:51 PM · #66 |
Well, as of midnight tonight, here in South Africa we'll be paying R7.01/l, the highest ever. (about $1/l I suppose, maybe a bit less).
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05/01/2007 01:56:30 PM · #67 |
| Italy (Naples) 1.3555 Euros/l (1 Euro = 1.3 $) :((((((( |
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05/01/2007 02:30:45 PM · #68 |
In Holland at the moment RON 95 unleaded costs 1.40 euro per litre.
That is 7.21 US dollar per US Gallon.
My car does 51 miles per gallon (Citroën C1) and therefore costs USD 0,14 per mile in gas.
A simple appartment of 645 square feet, with neighbours above you, underneath you and one next to you, without a garage for your car costs at the moment more than 165,000 US Dollar to buy.... And that is actually under the marketprice, with a bit of government sponsorship.
It means about 660 USD per month to the bank, plus app 90 USD service costs, excluding insurance, electricity, heat and water.
That's Holland, interesting to read here what all the other countries cost.
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05/01/2007 02:42:13 PM · #69 |
| we are right around $3 US per gal here. give or take depending on location. Main road places are about 10 cents more per gallon. |
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05/01/2007 02:49:03 PM · #70 |
Originally posted by Azrifel:
In Holland at the moment RON 95 unleaded costs 1.40 euro per litre.
That is 7.21 US dollar per US Gallon.
My car does 51 miles per gallon (Citroën C1) and therefore costs USD 0,14 per mile in gas.
A simple appartment of 645 square feet, with neighbours above you, underneath you and one next to you, without a garage for your car costs at the moment more than 165,000 US Dollar to buy.... And that is actually under the marketprice, with a bit of government sponsorship.
It means about 660 USD per month to the bank, plus app 90 USD service costs, excluding insurance, electricity, heat and water.
That's Holland, interesting to read here what all the other countries cost. |
Italy Pozzuoli near Naples apartment 90 square meters 330.000 Euro with car parking (under the sky) this means today 808 Euro every mounth to my bank for next 10 years.... :(. A new car 20.000 Euro (Fiat bravo). With 1000 Euro my Nissan primera 2000 i.e. will be as new :) what are government sponsorship? here there aren't government helps :(
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05/01/2007 02:55:58 PM · #71 |
UK Diesel prices at the moment in the midlands is about 93.9p/l ($1.90 US) £4.27/gallon(4.5l) ($8.54 US)
I travel about 16 mile to work & from work each day then with personal miles i clock up about 600 mile a month so not a great amount but it still costs me about £90 ($175 US) slightly over £1050 ($2107 US) a year on fuel this equates to about 5%of my earnings.
It is now said that there is not village, town or city with a house under £100,000 ($199,954 US) with the average price of £180,000 ($359,900) and when you only earn enough to get a mortgage for about £85,000 ($170,000 US) I am still living at home. Rent in my area is anything from £500 to £1500 ($1000 to $3000 US) per month depending on the area sometimes less if you want to live with the danger of being shot.
SoI keep it cheap formyself and pay just £150 ($300 US) per month to mum and dad and do my own washing etc. and help with dad's business for free.
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05/01/2007 02:58:00 PM · #72 |
| $3.45 here in the Bay Area. |
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05/01/2007 02:58:06 PM · #73 |
Originally posted by Rino63:
what are government sponsorship? here there aren't government helps :( |
In this case they keep the price of the land down, and sponsored a part of the very costly energy system. This system uses energy from the sun and from the ground. The water is heated on the roofs. Waste energy from the appartments is collected from the floor energy system (water heating and cooling) and pumped into the ground. When the energy is needed again they pump it up and warm the appartment via the floor. A kind of heatpump is also used to warm the water for the showers. Pretty energy efficient, the goal is to become less dependable on gas.
I believe there are also sponsorships for loans, but I earn too much money to get it.
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05/01/2007 03:06:33 PM · #74 |
the goal is to become less dependable on gas.
here we have too problems because often the houses haven't a good thermic isolation. very few energy from wind, few houses with solar energy. In southern Italy the problem is the air conditioning in summer, in winter the weather is always good never ice or snow. |
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05/01/2007 03:45:30 PM · #75 |
A recent article from MSNBC is Annual pump price rise is fast furious this year. I always say if you buy a large vehicle you should expect to pay for the luxury of owning one.
There are about 20 videos on youtube.com about "Hydrogen". Everything from small-time inventors, big-business prototypes, to how-2-build-DIY plans. BMW, Mercedes Benz, Chrysler, and Honda, all have created cars running on Hydrogen Fuel-Cells and even a Liquid Hydrogen BMW race car.
They have Zero-Emissions (only water) and Do-Not use gasoline.
The only thing that may slow down this Revolution, is Governments and the Big oil companies.
So that may be a reason for rising gasoline prices, now and in the next few years. |
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