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04/21/2007 10:10:54 AM · #76 |
Originally posted by stdavidson:
Originally posted by hihosilver:
...will we ever know the truth?
Probably not. |
The Truth is Out There! Where's Scully when you need her, she's HOT!? |
Not in my fair city, thats for sure... |
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04/21/2007 10:46:15 AM · #77 |
Originally posted by option:
Originally posted by stdavidson:
Originally posted by hihosilver:
...will we ever know the truth?
Probably not. |
The Truth is Out There! Where's Scully when you need her, she's HOT!? |
Not in my fair city, thats for sure... |
I'm so relieved you posted that...because I thought she quit to have Steve's love child....rofl!
::Wanders off to cause mischief and mayhem elsewhere:: |
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04/21/2007 10:49:43 AM · #78 |
Originally posted by trevytrev:
I already do not vote in challanges that I have a submission. I do look through the photos to see peoples photos but feel that it is a conflict of interest for me to vote. |
And I think you lose the biggest benefit of participating on this site. The more photos you critically rate, the better you will be able to make them.
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04/21/2007 10:54:54 AM · #79 |
Originally posted by coolblue:
You can rave on to me as much as you want, but this site, is IMO, loaded with the cheat vote. You might claim that I am not right and promise me that it isn’t soâ€Â¦ It is like getting a promise from a politician, it is just that. A politician’s promise. I make no apologies for my out burst to anyone. But if something is not done to make the system fairer, this site will go the way of the Dodo, and for most of us, that will be a sad thing. For me, I have no intentions of debating this with anyone, like I have said, I am just having my say. |
Hmmmm, Digital DoDo Challenge.
Message edited by author 2007-04-21 10:55:18.
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04/21/2007 11:06:24 AM · #80 |
Originally posted by hywind:
What has amazed me is that 371 views have been made, but only 190 votes, and don't tell me the same people keep going back ans looking at the photo all the time. |
Sorry, people do go back and look. I'm one of them. And...... many times when I do I will vote the ones I believe the best in the challenge even higher than my initial vote. This probably doesn't explain the view/vote disparity.
Originally posted by hywind:
And don't be funny and say better photo's, this may be true but a lot of photo's are really underrated throughout challenges, which IMHO is mainly brought about by the 20% VOTE MAYBE THIS SHOULD BE LIFTED TO 50% then more photos would be seen overall. |
I'm really not being funny when I tell you that better photos will result in better scores. It's a proven concept. Changing from 20% to 50% would not accomplish much IMO.
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04/21/2007 11:11:42 AM · #81 |
Originally posted by smurfguy:
[The voters seem incomprehensible at times. I |
The voters are all knowing and sublime. They are the beginning and the end. They are merciful and ruthless.
They are.
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04/21/2007 11:14:25 AM · #82 |
Originally posted by smurfguy:
Originally posted by shutterpuppy:
{/geeky, pointless parody} |
Syntax error... where is the "open geeky, pointless parody" tag?
I understand Jason's sentiment, though. The voters seem incomprehensible at times. I've become all too very familiar with the "holy crap, this entry which I love is a mid-5?!" feeling.
At least it's nice to know it happens to the superstars as well. =) |
I hope some of these "superstars" don't get swollen heads. At least Jason can prescribe an antihistamine. I haven't seen a "walking on water" challenge yet.
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04/21/2007 11:20:03 AM · #83 |
Originally posted by fir3bird:
Originally posted by hywind:
What has amazed me is that 371 views have been made, but only 190 votes, and don't tell me the same people keep going back ans looking at the photo all the time. |
Sorry, people do go back and look. I'm one of them. And...... many times when I do I will vote the ones I believe the best in the challenge even higher than my initial vote. This probably doesn't explain the view/vote disparity.
snip... |
Actually many do a first pass vote and then come back later to possibly comment... especially during the first hours that a challenge has rolled over.
They do this to avoid those people whole continually press the update button.
Some here will try to associate a vote they get with a comment received at the same time, and if they don't like the vote will send the ol "Why'd you give me a...." PM and they will go one to explain that it is their Nephew Johnny who is so cute when he picks his butt and the vote should be higher. |
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04/21/2007 11:25:56 AM · #84 |
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04/21/2007 11:28:18 AM · #85 |
Originally posted by DrAchoo:
I'm just more asking why I tend to find people early in their voting career who have these greatly outlying vote averages. I mean, 2.69? Why do you bother voting if the pictures are so bad? |
Well, I like full use of the voting spectrum. I'm a member of a couple of other sites that claim 1-10 range but don't really have much more than a 5-10
range. One of these is Daily Awards Quite a few members here post over there too. The site itself enforces a policy where votes more than a certain range from the norm in the low direction are dropped. Additionally, if you consistently vote images much lower than that average you will be banned. Paid members may request critiques and some times they seem to be used to reinforce the statistical voting policy. I like the site. It's forum is nowhere as robust as DPC, but it is a growing concern, I believe. If you want higher scores, be sure to start an account at DA. Lot's of great talent over there. When I've voted a lot over at DA I have to remember to reset my voting range back to DPC values before voting here. I vote much higher there. (for those who think I'm a low voter here, feel free to check my profile)
So, on the day I get a 7.0 average on a challenge at DPC it's gonna mean a lot more than my highest rated image at DA with a 8.5. (if that day ever comes)
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04/21/2007 11:30:39 AM · #86 |
I want to say that I browse through the photos in challenges without voting frequently - sometimes from my office, sometimes when I have a few spare minutes. I am not always in a position to vote - Maybe I don't have the time to give the proper consideration to each photo. Maybe I'm not in the right state of mind - disappointed by my own score, feeling tired or irritable. But I always enjoy looking at the work you/we all have done. Sometimes I'm just curious about how the challenge was addressed. I try to find the time to vote thoughtfully, but if I cannot, I choose not to vote in haste. Voting is still a learning process for me. In fact, when I started with DPC, everything looked somuch better than I thought I could ever do, that my voting was way high, and it's taken months of consideration to vote more inline with DPC expectations and standards.
There is often no exterior motive to what we perceive as intentional action, i.e., withholding votes.
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04/21/2007 11:32:54 AM · #87 |
Originally posted by idnic:
I'm not sure who you're calling "notable photographers", but I notice most of the highest-ribboning photographers leave very few comments at all. Mostly, I suspect, because they are busy with the business of photography. Also I notice several of them don't enter very often, likely for the same reason. |
I notice they don't vote a lot either. Which is either good, or bad, depending on your motivation for being here.
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04/21/2007 11:34:02 AM · #88 |
Originally posted by levyj413:
Originally posted by stdavidson:
The Truth is Out There! Where's Scully when you need her, she's HOT!? |
I believe the whippersnappers spell that "HOTT" nowadays. |
Thank you sir, I stand corrected... and make that a double dose of HOTT!
 Option... Bummer about her Vancouver slam. It's a beautiful city with lots going for it as evidenced by your big blue victory in the Fitness challenge from Grouse Mountain. Stanley Park is as beautiful or moreso than any park in any major city in the world, The Lion's Gate Bridge and the planetarium are stunning and make great photo opps.
But she's still HOTT! :)
Message edited by author 2007-04-21 11:38:22.
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04/21/2007 11:39:01 AM · #89 |
| When I first started I voted low. The reason is I didnt' take the time to properly look at the photos. I thought mine were good. Once I started submitting my own and receiving some constructive critiques I changed my voting strategy. I realized I wasn't as good as I thought. I needed to start studying the ones who scored so high and the ones that score low to make my photos better. I also started commenting on photos more. Once I started doing that then I started looking at others photos more closely. In time the newbies will come to realize their photos aren't any better than anybody elses. I have come a long way since I first started and I still have a lot to learn. |
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04/21/2007 11:41:36 AM · #90 |
| If we didn't have low voters what would we talk about to pass the time between hitting the update button. |
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04/21/2007 11:53:33 AM · #91 |
Originally posted by stdavidson:
Option... Bummer about her Vancouver slam. It's a beautiful city with lots going for it as evidenced by your big blue victory in the Fitness challenge from Grouse Mountain. Stanley Park is as beautiful or moreso than any park in any major city in the world, The Lion's Gate Bridge and the planetarium are stunning and make great photo opps.
But she's still HOTT! :) |
^^Agreed!
You know, I live 4 blocks from the planetarium and still haven't been inside? Also, Stanley park has just been thrashed this winter...over 3000 trees blown down, and part of the seawall got washed out by landslides.
Damn, all this talk about my park getting destroyed is making me depressed. I think I'll go hand out some vengefully low votes to compensate... |
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04/21/2007 11:57:34 AM · #92 |
Originally posted by BeckyT:
When I first started I voted low. The reason is I didnt' take the time to properly look at the photos. I thought mine were good. Once I started submitting my own and receiving some constructive critiques I changed my voting strategy. I realized I wasn't as good as I thought. I needed to start studying the ones who scored so high and the ones that score low to make my photos better. I also started commenting on photos more. Once I started doing that then I started looking at others photos more closely. In time the newbies will come to realize their photos aren't any better than anybody elses. I have come a long way since I first started and I still have a lot to learn. |
Why BeckyT... A voice of thoughtful reason in a sea of bickering.
This summarizes my view:
1: Most DPC entries are good so should get good scores
2: Low voting is institutionalized at DPC so they don't
1 + 2 = Grumbling about low scores, imagined cheating and trolls. Its simple math.
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04/21/2007 12:15:56 PM · #93 |
Originally posted by hywind:
What has amazed me is that 371 views have been made, but only 190 votes, and don't tell me the same people keep going back ans looking at the photo all the time.
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This is quite common and normal for higher scoring images. Higher scoring images usually have many more views than votes.
Originally posted by hywind:
Of the 17 comments which I have really appreciated, not one is from one of the better known and higher level photographers.
Does this mean they look and say this might Knock mine and give a lesser vote than they would normally and not leave a good comment about the photo.
Let it be known that I am not calling anybody a cheat, .... |
I certainly hope the 17 friendly commenters that have bothered to take the time to comment on your image so far do not read this, and feel belittled at being told they're not "higher level photographers".
As for insinuating that "higher level photographers" are voting unfairly, that is, giving great photos such as yours low scores in order to up their own score, that is calling people cheaters. I am offended by that insinuation. It is precisely this kind of insinuation that does nothing for DPC morale. It is uncalled for.
Message edited by author 2007-04-21 12:43:49. |
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04/21/2007 12:27:58 PM · #94 |
Originally posted by ursula:
As for insinuating that "higher level photographers" are voting unfairly, that is, giving great photos such as yours low scores in order to up their own score, that is calling people cheaters. I am offended by that insinuation. It is precisely this kind of insinuation that does nothing for DPC morale. It is uncalled for. |
It bothers me, and I am not even involved. Just for grins and giggles though, since average vote cast is so important, I looked up the first four or five "big guns" that popped in my head. (Big guns being defined as someone who consistently scores well)
Scalvert, DrAchoo, ursula, librodo and judi --
Of those the losest average cast was 5.46 or so, right at average. The others were higher, even as high as 6.4 or so.
I'm not saying that there aren't people that low ball others in a futile effort to bolster their own position, but I don't think it comes from the population that frequently gets accused of it.
Message edited by author 2007-04-21 12:28:34. |
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04/21/2007 01:02:57 PM · #95 |
Originally posted by ursula:
Originally posted by hywind:
What has amazed me is that 371 views have been made, but only 190 votes, and don't tell me the same people keep going back ans looking at the photo all the time.
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This is quite common and normal for higher scoring images. Higher scoring images usually have many more views than votes.
Originally posted by hywind:
Of the 17 comments which I have really appreciated, not one is from one of the better known and higher level photographers.
Does this mean they look and say this might Knock mine and give a lesser vote than they would normally and not leave a good comment about the photo.
Let it be known that I am not calling anybody a cheat, .... |
I certainly hope the 17 friendly commenters that have bothered to take the time to comment on your image so far do not read this, and feel belittled at being told they're not "higher level photographers".
As for insinuating that "higher level photographers" are voting unfairly, that is, giving great photos such as yours low scores in order to up their own score, that is calling people cheaters. I am offended by that insinuation. It is precisely this kind of insinuation that does nothing for DPC morale. It is uncalled for. |
Why do people get so defensive and take it personal, and not able to see what someone is trying to say as a positive.
To receive a vote from a better known photographer and multi ribbon winner, would make that person feel that there photo's are worthy of a mention from such a recognized photographer.This would be good for the moral of DPC.
Human nature works in strange ways, just that some do not like to see it in writting, I am not insinuating or offending any person or degrading the moral of DPC in any way, it would help the morality of DPC for the higher recognized photographers that I am sure are admired by many for thier talent and ability, to give some good positive feedback on lesser known work.
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04/21/2007 01:19:11 PM · #96 |
Originally posted by karmat:
Scalvert, DrAchoo, ursula, librodo and judi --
Of those the losest average cast was 5.46 or so, right at average. The others were higher, even as high as 6.4 or so. |
Haha, crap, now I'm the troll! :) |
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04/21/2007 01:36:01 PM · #97 |
Originally posted by hywind:
Why do people get so defensive and take it personal, and not able to see what someone is trying to say as a positive.
To receive a vote from a better known photographer and multi ribbon winner, would make that person feel that there photo's are worthy of a mention from such a recognized photographer.This would be good for the moral of DPC.
Human nature works in strange ways, just that some do not like to see it in writting, I am not insinuating or offending any person or degrading the moral of DPC in any way, it would help the morality of DPC for the higher recognized photographers that I am sure are admired by many for thier talent and ability, to give some good positive feedback on lesser known work. |
To me, what you're saying really makes no sense.
Earlier on in the thread you claim that there are many undervalued images in each challenge ("... a lot of photo's are really underrated throughout challenges..."), and wonder "what is required to achieve a high standard on DPC".
You opine that they might have risen to the top by cherry-picking votes, that is, voting selectively on only some images, not all (the 20% thing).
You also say, "Does this mean they look and say this might Knock mine and give a lesser vote than they would normally and not leave a good comment about the photo." This is an insinuation that they are voting in a less than ethical way.
But you also say that the vote/comment from one of those whose image/s have risen to the top (in a possibly less than ethical way) would mean more to you than the vote/comment of the rest? Wow!
Plus you seem to expect people to recognize your entry while it is still in the voting stages?
This is the kind of crap that just doesn't do any good for the DPC morale. |
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04/21/2007 02:29:08 PM · #98 |
Originally posted by DrAchoo:
Originally posted by karmat:
Scalvert, DrAchoo, ursula, librodo and judi --
Of those the losest average cast was 5.46 or so, right at average. The others were higher, even as high as 6.4 or so. |
Haha, crap, now I'm the troll! :) |
;) |
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04/21/2007 03:17:34 PM · #99 |
Originally posted by DrAchoo:
Haha, crap, now I'm the troll! :) |
And an average troll too!
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04/21/2007 03:32:43 PM · #100 |
This is the way I'm trying to vote since I came back to DPC
Any picture not related to the challenge <3 (even the most wonderful picture) I think we should carry out the challenge.
Any picture that meets the challenge >4
I'm leaving my votes in this way:
4 for pictures that meet the challenge but low quality, (out of focus, too dark, etc.)
5 for Regular photos that meet the challenge but " X " photos,
6-7-8 Photos well done, but nothing innovated.
9-10 for those where they took an extra step and creativity.
Now, I have to admit in my first age in DPC (in 2004) I was voting low, I fact my first photo didn't meet the challenge requirements because I didn't understand perfectly DPC.
P.S. I'm trying to vote all the picture in the challenge
Message edited by author 2007-04-21 15:34:56. |
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