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04/18/2007 04:31:50 PM · #176 |
Originally posted by Jmnuggy:
How about forced education for owning a firearm w/ renewal of that "education" every 6months or you can't buy ammunition. Obviously guns are here to stay. Education seems like the next logical answer. People should have to attend extensive training before they can own a firearm and should also be required to shoot on a consistant basis. All of this should be recorded and monitored. The people who can monitor it would be the ones selling ammunition.
This shouldn't be a problem for the gun advocates because they like to shoot and are usually the most trained anyway. |
To have a carry permit in my state you have to go through extensive paperwork. Includes handgun training at a local police station
This training has to be redone everytime you renew. Now if im not mistaken in Maryland you have to be 21 or older to purchase Ammunition. Not to mention to hunt requires firearm and hunters saftey.
Now maybe im biased because I have alot of training in defense and firearms everything up to assault weapons and reloading rounds. Im also trained in archery, although archers would consider a combound bow a machine. One skilled with it can make a kill from 30 to 50 yards. Another weapon people often forget about because you will not see someone just carrying it around with them. Dont forget about small crossbows.
I dunno i chose to leave all my rifles and handguns behind plus not having permits myself for the assault weapons I can't really have them in my own home just my fathers and can only operate them on a range.
The area i live in we have constant crackheads knocking on our door. People hijack buses and rob the local stores. I think ocasionally about getting a .40 caliber hand gun but i doubt that I will seriously need.
Message edited by author 2007-04-18 16:32:40. |
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04/18/2007 04:35:04 PM · #177 |
Originally posted by karmat:
Originally posted by Gatorguy:
I don't in any way want to diminish the tragedy of April 16, but to put it in perspective with other world events, today's headline on Google News:
Middle East News
148 killed, dozens wounded in Iraq blasts |
One little, itty-bitty, teeny-tiny difference.
There is a freakin' war in Iraq. This was a college campus where young people go to learn, assumedly in safety. |
true.
three months to the day before the VT killings, 60 students and faculty died in a bombing at a college campus in baghdad.
yes, it's a war zone. and i'm not trying to diminish the VT massacre in any way. but innocent college students are dying both at home and abroad and it's all very disheartening. |
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04/18/2007 04:35:05 PM · #178 |
Originally posted by cheekymunky:
Maybe Cowboy films are to blame? |
They are not the culprit.
It is simply the difference between how you view your responsibilities and how do you view other's rights. Is society trustworthy as a whole or untrustworthy as a whole? These are the defining positions of many "choice" decisions.
In every state that has enacted "shall issue" permits, the naysayers (read anti-gunners) predicted wild west mayhem if the population at large were entrusted with acting responsibly while armed. In every state, they were wrong, and the armed population has proven themselves responsible. Based on this evidence (empicical or otherwise), it is my drawn conclusion that society on whole, is kind, generous, and trustworthy. Although I believe that about my neighbor(s), I also understand the reality that not everyone (however few) are of the same respectful mindset as I, and thus may require the restraint of their illegal actions against me or mine.
Simply a difference of view.
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04/18/2007 04:37:14 PM · #179 |
Originally posted by muckpond:
Originally posted by karmat:
Originally posted by Gatorguy:
I don't in any way want to diminish the tragedy of April 16, but to put it in perspective with other world events, today's headline on Google News:
Middle East News
148 killed, dozens wounded in Iraq blasts |
One little, itty-bitty, teeny-tiny difference.
There is a freakin' war in Iraq. This was a college campus where young people go to learn, assumedly in safety. |
true.
three months to the day before the VT killings, 60 students and faculty died in a bombing at a college campus in baghdad.
yes, it's a war zone. and i'm not trying to diminish the VT massacre in any way. but innocent college students are dying both at home and abroad and it's all very disheartening. |
Yes, no argument there. (the part in bold) |
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04/18/2007 04:38:01 PM · #180 |
Originally posted by Gatorguy:
I don't in any way want to diminish the tragedy of April 16, but to put it in perspective with other world events, today's headline on Google News:
Middle East News
148 killed, dozens wounded in Iraq blasts |
I've been meaning to mention that it seems as though there are thirty or so civilians shot in Baghdad every day .. : (
Not to mention the 68 or so people killed every day in the US in auto accidents -- typically half of those are due to alcohol consumption, and thus could be considered criminal homicide.
Somehow people get so much more excited when a bunch of people happen to be in the same location when they die -- if it's within US borders. |
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04/18/2007 04:51:57 PM · #181 |
Iraq is a warzone whether you are in a college or a tank. iraq is dangerous and people are dying everyday. VT is a quiet college campus in which the assumption is its a safe place.
I personally don't think its as newsworthy as the press makes it. I think the facts should have been stated and thats all. The news now isn't about the facts its about entertainment value and people love tragedy. Don't get me wrong, it was a horrible accurance and people should know about it, but thats about it. There is no need to have 24 hr coverage of the campus and non stop photos of the candle vigils. It gets a bit upsurd, the news just feeds the masses drama and if the drama isn't there, they create it. I think all the witness accounts and tear inducing pieces are nothing more than the news turning a grave situation into their moment in the spotlight.
I think most of the news stations should be ashamed of themselves. there is a huge difference in reporting the news and making blood money. |
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04/18/2007 04:52:01 PM · #182 |
Originally posted by GeneralE:
Originally posted by Gatorguy:
I don't in any way want to diminish the tragedy of April 16, but to put it in perspective with other world events, today's headline on Google News:
Middle East News
148 killed, dozens wounded in Iraq blasts |
I've been meaning to mention that it seems as though there are thirty or so civilians shot in Baghdad every day .. : (
Not to mention the 68 or so people killed every day in the US in auto accidents -- typically half of those are due to alcohol consumption, and thus could be considered criminal homicide.
Somehow people get so much more excited when a bunch of people happen to be in the same location when they die -- if it's within US borders. |
What bothers me the most about comparisons like these that they are often in an effort to "put everything in perspective."
Sadly, for the students and their families, there is no "perspective." Did anyone even stop the gun/no gun debate to read the email I posted? That is not an urban legend. That is not some fabricated hypothetical. It is a real life email from a real life friend of mine whose son was on the campus of VT.
To me, personally, it seems to trivialize what happened on the campus of VT to say, "there are typically 34 criminal homicides in the US each day due to drinking and driving"
While I understand that your point (I hope) is to point out that there are tragedies going on everyday and we need to be more aware of them, there are better ways to do it than to "play down" what happened at VT. Unfortunately, what it comes across as, is "This is no big deal. Look at what is happening in Baghdad everyday. Get over it. Be concerned with the bigger issues."
Or, we can use it as fodder for gun/anti-gun rhetoric.
I guess I can take my pick.
edited to add: after reading jmnuggy's post, I wasn't even considering the media circus/frenzy that is probably going on -- which seems to make things skew anyway. That in itself is sad enough, as well.
Message edited by author 2007-04-18 16:54:10. |
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04/18/2007 04:57:37 PM · #183 |
Originally posted by Jmnuggy:
Iraq is a warzone whether you are in a college or a tank. iraq is dangerous and people are dying everyday. VT is a quiet college campus in which the assumption is its a safe place.
I personally don't think its as newsworthy as the press makes it. I think the facts should have been stated and thats all. The news now isn't about the facts its about entertainment value and people love tragedy. Don't get me wrong, it was a horrible accurance and people should know about it, but thats about it. There is no need to have 24 hr coverage of the campus and non stop photos of the candle vigils. It gets a bit upsurd, the news just feeds the masses drama and if the drama isn't there, they create it. I think all the witness accounts and tear inducing pieces are nothing more than the news turning a grave situation into their moment in the spotlight.
I think most of the news stations should be ashamed of themselves. there is a huge difference in reporting the news and making blood money. |
We may not see eye to eye on everything but I just have to say....
AMEN!!!!
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04/18/2007 06:06:11 PM · #184 |
In case ya dont have the news on--
Guman mailed package to nbc news day of the shooting.
NBC nightly news to air contents tonight.
msnbc
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04/18/2007 06:11:57 PM · #185 |
Originally posted by buzzrock:
In case ya dont have the news on--
Guman mailed package to nbc news day of the shooting.
NBC nightly news to air contents tonight.
msnbc |
The oddest thing about it is that he mailed it in between shootings. He shot some people, stopped to mail a package, and then continued on. It's almost comical if it weren't so unbelievably tragic.
The first thing that comes to mind is the scene in The Blues Brothers where all the screaming police and guardsmen run into the government building, everyone stops screaming and running long enough to stop at the info desk for directions, and then immediately resume their screaming and running.
Message edited by author 2007-04-18 18:13:25.
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04/18/2007 06:37:56 PM · #186 |
Wow they are showing his videos now on MSNBC. What a mess.
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04/18/2007 06:42:20 PM · #187 |
Originally posted by Rebecca:
Originally posted by buzzrock:
In case ya dont have the news on--
Guman mailed package to nbc news day of the shooting.
NBC nightly news to air contents tonight.
msnbc |
The oddest thing about it is that he mailed it in between shootings. He shot some people, stopped to mail a package, and then continued on. It's almost comical if it weren't so unbelievably tragic.
The first thing that comes to mind is the scene in The Blues Brothers where all the screaming police and guardsmen run into the government building, everyone stops screaming and running long enough to stop at the info desk for directions, and then immediately resume their screaming and running. |
Hollywood will probably get involved sooner or later. That's the sad part and all for entertainment. |
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04/18/2007 06:55:08 PM · #188 |
...moved
Message edited by author 2007-04-18 19:16:19. |
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04/18/2007 07:10:07 PM · #189 |
| Let's move the gun debate to a new thread. This one is about the shooting, not the politics. |
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04/18/2007 07:13:08 PM · #190 |
Originally posted by Vapor63:
Let's move the gun debate to a new thread. This one is about the shooting, not the politics. |
Done go here |
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04/18/2007 07:35:20 PM · #191 |
Originally posted by karmat:
What bothers me the most about comparisons like these that they are often in an effort to "put everything in perspective."
Sadly, for the students and their families, there is no "perspective." ...
To me, personally, it seems to trivialize what happened on the campus of VT to say, "there are typically 34 criminal homicides in the US each day due to drinking and driving" |
What bothers me is that this huge national brouhaha trivializes the very real pain caused to the families of the dead accident victims -- the same number of dead each day -- but because they are "spread out" those families receive little attention or sympathy.
Why do the VT families deserve more sympathy than the family of any other victim of a senseless and untimely death, just because they all happened to die in one place?
I think when something like this happens, we also need to think of the many unpublicized victims and feel for their families as well -- that doesn't diminish the magnitude of this tragedy to me at all. |
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04/18/2007 07:41:10 PM · #192 |
| I don't think they *deserve* more sympathy. What I do think is that it is (southern word warning) a bit tacky to post such things in a thread dedicated to that particular one, because, as I've pointed out before, the end result isn't that we go, "Oh man, he's right, we need to have sympathy for them, too" it just sounds more like it's a "tough, people die everyday, get over it" sentiment. |
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04/18/2007 08:47:24 PM · #193 |
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04/18/2007 08:50:02 PM · #194 |
Originally posted by karmat:
I don't think they *deserve* more sympathy. What I do think is that it is (southern word warning) a bit tacky to post such things in a thread dedicated to that particular one, because, as I've pointed out before, the end result isn't that we go, "Oh man, he's right, we need to have sympathy for them, too" it just sounds more like it's a "tough, people die everyday, get over it" sentiment. |
Wow, you sure read a lot into that one sentence.
Yes, it's a damn shame what happened to those students at VT. It's also a damn shame when (now it's over 180 today) Iraqi's are blown to pieces while shopping for their families. It's also a damn shame that millions of innocents are dying in Africa.
My point is we are looking awfully USAcentric when we get all up in arms when it happens here, but don't say a word (relatively speaking) when it happens elsewhere to a much greater degree.
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04/18/2007 09:05:15 PM · #195 |
Good lord gatorguy. The US is over there fighting to end this madness and all we get from the liberals and many foreign countries is how bad we are.
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04/18/2007 09:29:43 PM · #196 |
Originally posted by David Ey:
Good lord gatorguy. The US is over there fighting to end this madness and all we get from the liberals and many foreign countries is how bad we are. |
Not sure what your point is relative to what I posted...
I will say that people who know me would crap their pants if they knew someone call ME a liberal. Too funny! |
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04/18/2007 09:39:07 PM · #197 |
Originally posted by Gatorguy:
Originally posted by karmat:
I don't think they *deserve* more sympathy. What I do think is that it is (southern word warning) a bit tacky to post such things in a thread dedicated to that particular one, because, as I've pointed out before, the end result isn't that we go, "Oh man, he's right, we need to have sympathy for them, too" it just sounds more like it's a "tough, people die everyday, get over it" sentiment. |
Wow, you sure read a lot into that one sentence.
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If you think I was responding to the "one" sentence, then I am assuming our (GeneralE and me) previous exchange was either a) irrelevant or b) ignored |
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04/18/2007 10:15:26 PM · #198 |
Most, if not all of us, have been shocked at what happened at Virginia Tech on Monday. And it makes us all feel so helpless. But the day after the shootings, a beautiful rainbow appeared here in Oregon, the product of an otherwise marvelous planet that produces so much astounding beauty. And the rainbow is the sign of a promise. And a sign of hope. Things we need so desperately. And to somehow do something during this feeling of helplessness in the face of such a tragedy, and as a photographer with little more to give, I photographed this rainbow, and hereby dedicate it to the memory of the lives lost so needlessly, and to the families left behind.
-Randy
Rainbow
Message edited by author 2007-04-18 22:21:18. |
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04/18/2007 10:20:08 PM · #199 |
Originally posted by Gatorguy:
Originally posted by David Ey:
Good lord gatorguy. The US is over there fighting to end this madness and all we get from the liberals and many foreign countries is how bad we are. |
Not sure what your point is relative to what I posted...
I will say that people who know me would crap their pants if they knew someone call ME a liberal. Too funny! |
Oh man, I mis-read your post. sorry
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04/18/2007 10:59:59 PM · #200 |
Originally posted by Gatorguy:
Yes, it's a damn shame what happened to those students at VT. It's also a damn shame when (now it's over 180 today) Iraqi's are blown to pieces while shopping for their families. It's also a damn shame that millions of innocents are dying in Africa.
My point is we are looking awfully USAcentric when we get all up in arms when it happens here, but don't say a word (relatively speaking) when it happens elsewhere to a much greater degree. |
my feeling exactly. I am forced to see CNN (because BBC is not available on my cable). And one thing that irritates me is the coverage very small things get sometimes. I remember CNN shouting day and night about a girl went missing in some island. (now no news about it).
BUT when there was earth quake in pakistan, it only got sporadic mentions. And slowly that too died out.
Yes CNN is US based chanel but even then there should be some importance to magnitude of news.
(one person missing case 2-3 months daily coverage, one whole nation in trouble, just 2-3 weeks on mentions, not fare).
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