Low Key II "Quiet Observer": Help Me Understand...

Sigma 10-20mm f/3.5 EX-DC HSM

03/07/2007 12:15:31 AM · #1

I'm not trying to say people voted wrong, or that they should have voted higher for this photo, but I just don't understand why it got such a low placing. Since there were only a few comments, I thought I would ask you guys what is so flawed about this picture. Maybe I'm just not seeing something.

"Quiet Observer"

Message edited by author 2007-03-07 00:17:03.

Shadowi6

Nikon D200

03/07/2007 12:16:42 AM · #2

I quite like it but the rule of thirds makes me want his eye lower in the frame & the bg just looks too fake for me. Great sharpness & colour in the eye. 5.41 isnt Bad, its above the average 5.2511 :)

Message edited by author 2007-03-07 00:23:26.

Canon EF 17-40mm f/4.0L USM

03/07/2007 12:17:36 AM · #3

Hey thanks!!
I don't know what happened...

JeffDay

Canon EOS-5D Mark III

03/07/2007 12:25:40 AM · #4

The top is too light, but hey the image that won low key isn't low key so go figure.....I should of entered that blue image in the "red II" I could of won!

lentil

Canon EOS-5D

Canon EF 135mm f/2.0L USM

03/07/2007 12:27:06 AM · #5

Originally posted by JeffDay:

The top is too light, but hey the image that won low key isn't low key so go figure.....I should of entered that blue image in the "red II" I could of won!

the photo that won is low key

Message edited by author 2007-03-07 00:31:58.

AdiGri

Canon EOS-30D

03/07/2007 12:30:54 AM · #6

I didn't vote on this challenge and my entry placed lower, anyway (4.9167)

.

However, here are my observations:
- unless the challenge is specific about pets, people consider them a cliche (hence lack of imagination, creativity, etc...)
- I don't like the fact that I only see a small part of the dog's head (and only one eye) - it looks very strange - this is my main problem with this pic. I guess a landscape orientation would've been better.
- the dark green background is not really working with the dog's color, at least not for me. But then, if it was any brighter, it would've been low key.
- another voting criteria for me is "Would you have this picture printed, framed and hanged on your wall?" Well, not really.
- what I like: it is sharp, it meets the challenge - my vote would've been 5 or 6

I hope you can appreciate the honest comments.

03/07/2007 12:37:31 AM · #7

I think that sometimes people get caught up in thinking that "low key" means a black and white shot with a black background and a still life or human profile as the subject. I noticed it when I flipped through the Low Key I challenge results as well. The second and third place pictures for this challenge (although they were very nice shots as well, and they deserve their places) were a perfect example of the stereotypical low key photo.

"Quiet Observer" is a slightly different type of Low Key shot that strays from the expected norm. It's still a "mostly dark image, with few highlights" as the challenge description reads.

I will however agree with you Shadow that the rule of thirds could have been applied to make a stronger composition.

Melethia

Canon EOS-80D

03/07/2007 02:38:27 AM · #8

I like it as is - rule of thirds would probably be fine, too, but to me it has a nice balance as presented. And to me, it's low key. But I failed miserably with my own shot, so my opinion on what is and isn't low key should be taken with a large grain of salt. :-)

Artifacts

Canon EOS-5D Mark II

Canon EF-S 18-55mm f/3.5-5.6

03/07/2007 04:09:29 AM · #9

Originally posted by JBHale:

In order of their negative impact on this image, there are three things that hurt this picture in voting:

1-Composition
The bottom totally black third of the frame and right third of the frame adds almost nothing to the composition. It acts more as a distraction than as negative space. Cropping that out nicely places the dog's eye on the lower left rule of thirds intersection point as an added bonus.

2-Look and feel
Though this image technically is low-key it lacks the look and feel of a typical low-key image because it contains more than one color. If seen anywhere but in this challenge it is doubtful that low-key would be the first thought that comes to mind when describing it. Your image has to many colors. That hurt it in voting. That is why, in my rework of your image it is B&W.

3-Improper exposure
Low-key images are just like any other photograph and should be properly exposed. Yours is slightly on the 'flat' side because you have no pure white. (yes, even low-key images need to have a decent white point set) This becomes obvious if you apply "auto contrast" to yours and see it immediately brightens with more punch yet still remains a low-key image.

Most low-key images are B&W or have only one color for a reason. Low-key (and high-key) images are primarily studies in lighting and tonality. That is also why they are most commonly B&W, moody or unusually lighted compositions, flesh toned nudes or still life. That is also why multi-colored images make poor selections for low-key imagery. And that is why that of the top 10 finishers seven are B&W, one is monotone and the other two are flesh toned nudes.

Message edited by author 2007-03-07 04:16:03.

jonfrommk

Canon EOS-400D Rebel XTi

03/07/2007 04:35:25 AM · #10

Wow, can I just say that stdavidson 'reworking' of this picture does show that editing (even basic editing) is an art form. A good shot has been made infinitely better by what they have done.

Makes me realise that I have much to learn!

Jon

Canon EF 17-40mm f/4.0L USM

03/07/2007 07:48:17 AM · #11

Stdavidson,

Although I do like your reworked picture, and I can see how that would appeal to the Low Key challenge a bit more, let me play devil's advocate just a little more.

1. This may be more of a personal preference, but I happen to love that the bottom half is empty. I think that the fact that there isn't something there draws the eye back up to the focusâ��the dog's eye. I think that it was a strong choice that ended up making this picture unique and strong.

2. What makes this so well done and different from the other entries is that it still conveys the typical mood of a low key shot without resorting to stereotypical Low Key techniques. The mood and imagry is still conveyed SO well, but it did so in color, and it did so without flowers or people.

I will agree that it looks a little flat, but I don't think that's any reason for it to be voted so low. Remember, my big issue is not that it should have been number one (although it's my top choice) but that it should have been rated much higher than 144th.

Elvis_L

Canon EOS-5D Mark II

03/07/2007 07:54:32 AM · #12

you are blinded by your personal love of the photo. steve's edit would have scored much higher. you say you like that your doesn't use cliche low key style but that is what the voters want. you asked why it didn't score better and there si your answer. if you like your shot as is then that is what matters. if you want a higher score sometimes you have to pander. I hate some of the shots i have made pandering to the voters that scored over 6. i love some of the shots i did my way for me that scored under 5. that is the way the site works.

SaraR

Sony Alpha a7R III

Sony FE 24-70mm f/2.8 GM

03/07/2007 08:20:10 AM · #13

Originally posted by Elvis_L:

you are blinded by your personal love of the photo.... if you like your shot as is then that is what matters. if you want a higher score sometimes you have to pander.

It isn't actually JBHale's photo! It belongs to

BMartin

03/07/2007 11:22:36 AM · #14

Yeah, sorry for any confusion about that...

Artifacts

Canon EOS-5D Mark II

Nikon AF-S DX Zoom-Nikkor 17-55mm f/2.8G IF-ED

03/07/2007 12:26:38 PM · #15

Originally posted by JBHale:

Please, I encourage you to walk your own path. The majority have been wrong in the past and will be wrong in the future. My comments only reflect things that today's majority would agree with. In the future, who knows?

Whereas you feel that the current image crop better highlights the dog's eye you would find that in photography class you would be taught that placement of significant compositional elements at the rule of thirds intersection point is both visually appealing and desirable. For competative photography where you want a high score then what you are taught in class MIGHT(not always) work better and probably would in this case. That is not to say it IS better. 'Better' is what the majority thinks and that can change with time. This, of course, has nothing to do with low-key imagery.

It is laudable that people don't want to create images using "stereotypical Low Key techniques". However, this is a competition to create a low-key image. You are encouraged to push the limits, but the further afield you drift from that concept then the less likely your image will score well. That is what happened in this case. Nothing more, nothing less.

As I said before, low-key is fundamentally a study of lighting and tonality... NOT color. If you study low-key images that is the common theme, time and time again. I'm not saying you CANNOT do this, but multiple colors typically muddles studies of lighting and tonality. That is why low key images generally do not have multiple colors like this one does.

So... getting back to the original issue of why this image got a 'low score'... it is likely but not limited to the combined effects of these primary issues; 1-Unusual composition. 2-Use of color in low-key making it non-standard; and, 3-technical exposure defects.

This is NOT to suggest that people should do everything like everyone else. That is both boring and stiffles progress.

Today's creativity defines the norm of tomorrow.

Edison once said that he tried 2,000 different methods before he successfully created the light bulb. This image is a trial, not an unmitigated success.

Message edited by author 2007-03-07 12:35:26.

MonicaJames

Nikon D200

03/07/2007 12:43:17 PM · #16

This is from me: there is a lot of light present in the photo for it to be called low key. IMHO. But stdavidson has tons of great points.

There are more challenges to come. Live and learn.