Why do people vote high on DNMC shots?

Tamron SP AF 17-50mm f/2.8 Di II LD Aspherical (IF) for Nikon

01/23/2007 08:13:54 PM · #1

I'm sure this has been discussed before, so if someone could point to a relevant thread, I'll just go read that.

I'm baffled by people who leave comments like "this is completely outside the challenge, but it's great! 9."

Why participate in a site that gives out assignments if you're going to vote highly regardless of whether the assignment is met? What sets our normal challenges apart from free studies with that voting approach?

I'm not trying to start another argument about out of the box thinking. I'm asking only about people who, despite deciding that a shot doesn't meet the challenge, still vote highly.

I'm truly asking, not trying to convince anyone to change their minds.

Thanks.

TechnoShroom

Canon EOS-30D

Canon EF 100mm f/2.8 USM Macro

01/23/2007 08:16:07 PM · #2

Baffling ain't it.

jjstager2

Nikon D700

Nikon AF-S NIKKOR 24-70mm f/2.8G ED

01/23/2007 08:19:45 PM · #3

I think it has something to do with the same reason people forward GLURGE emails.

Nikon AF-S Nikkor 50mm f/1.4G

01/23/2007 08:22:59 PM · #4

this question has baffled professionals and psychologists since DNMC came to light

Tim

Nikon D300

01/23/2007 08:28:05 PM · #5

Possibly because they have different voting criteria than you do

Art Roflmao

Canon EOS-6D Mark II

Canon EF 24-105mm f/4.0L IS

01/23/2007 08:28:09 PM · #6

They are the "anti-trolls" prophecied to bring balance to the force.

Seriously - some people don't consider the challenge topic very relevant, which is their right, but what irks me is when they make statements to the effect that the voters who do put a lot of weight in the challenge topic are "narrow minded" and "can't think outside the box" - I place high regard on the topic (as I am told to do in the voting rules). I also shrug at the "who am I to say that this is not related to the topic?" I am the friggin VOTER - the one you are supposed to persuade, convince, demostrate the connection to. I think voters who leave comments like "DNMC, but I give it a 10 cuz it's soooooo good!" should be suspended from voting for violating the rules. ...I'm half joking.

Man, am I having a volatile day or what. :/

Tamron SP AF 17-50mm f/2.8 Di II LD Aspherical (IF) for Nikon

01/23/2007 08:40:30 PM · #7

Originally posted by dr_timbo:

Possibly because they have different voting criteria than you do

Of course they do. I'm asking why they vote that way.

Tamron SP AF 17-50mm f/2.8 Di II LD Aspherical (IF) for Nikon

01/23/2007 08:40:41 PM · #8

Originally posted by jjstager2:

I think it has something to do with the same reason people forward GLURGE emails.

GLURGE?

cpanaioti

Canon EOS-40D

Canon EF 70-300mm f/4.5-5.6 DO IS USM

01/23/2007 08:43:25 PM · #9

Originally posted by Art Roflmao:

They are the "anti-trolls" prophecied to bring balance to the force.

That works for me.

kirbic

Canon EOS R5

Canon RF 24-70mm f/2.8 L IS

01/23/2007 08:47:49 PM · #10

I subtract no more than 1 or 2 points for DNMC. One if it's a clear shoehorn, and two if, ater careful consideration, I can see no bleeping connection whatever with the challenge topic!
So I could still score a photo a 7 or higher, even if I feel if it's off-topic. In general, though, I find that the true DNMC images are almost never the creme de la creme of the challenge.

Canon EF 24-70mm f/2.8L II

01/23/2007 08:52:05 PM · #11

Originally posted by Art Roflmao:

They are the "anti-trolls" prophecied to bring balance to the force.

so create 2 parties, the "hordes" and the "alliance", and divide EVERYONE on the site into 2 parties, and then have a logo displayed on their profiles so we know which group they belonged to. I wanna be on master Yoda's side ;)

but seriously, those who conciously agree that the photo is clearly DNMC should really do something about it rather than voting a full score (no deduction whatsoever) - i mean, Langdon created the site's challenges with a challenge topic for a purpose, didnt he?

crayon

fotomann_forever

01/23/2007 08:52:26 PM · #12

Originally posted by kirbic:

I find that the true DNMC images are almost never the creme de la creme of the challenge.

I agree.

chimericvisions

Canon EOS-60D

01/23/2007 10:15:45 PM · #13

Let's just make voting a point-based system. 2 for Challenge, 2 for Composition, 2 for...

;)

ellamay

Canon EOS-1D Mark II

Canon EF 100-400mm f/4.5-5.6L IS

01/23/2007 10:19:48 PM · #14

I want to see good photos, I could not care less if they meet the challenge. Not too mention sometimes it may be a creative interpetation of the challenge, that I just don't get. I like to see outside the box images.
I think a great photo, deserves a great score. The challenge meeting to me, is worth very little.
I want people to take good photos.

01/23/2007 10:22:04 PM · #15

Originally posted by ellamay:

if the majority thinks similarly as you, then we'd have 6 free study challenges on the DPC homepage now.

Tamron SP AF 17-50mm f/2.8 Di II LD Aspherical (IF) for Nikon

01/23/2007 10:30:10 PM · #16

Originally posted by ellamay:

Well, would you be so kind as to answer a followup question or two?

What makes DPC unique if not the challenges? I mean, I participate on other sites where it's all free study, all the time. That's fine in that context. But do you see the challenges as having no merit?

Even if you set aside the value of challenge themes in terms of personal growth, do you think it's fair to have one group of people struggle to meet the challenge and have another group not, and then reward the second group equally if they produce good but unconnected images? I realize I sound like I'm trying to convince you to change, but I promise I'm not. I'm trying to explore your thinking, because I find meeting the challenge to be the hardest thing quite often.

Thanks. :)

_eug

Nikon D50

Nikon AF Nikkor 50mm f/1.8D

01/23/2007 10:36:05 PM · #17

Originally posted by crayon:

i mean, Langdon created the site's challenges with a challenge topic for a purpose, didnt he?

How soon we forget the other half of D&L. Oh Drew, we hardly new ye.

The Drew is dead. Long live the Drew.

_eug

Nikon D50

Nikon AF Nikkor 50mm f/1.8D

01/23/2007 10:38:02 PM · #18

Originally posted by ellamay:

Damn canuck rabble-rouser! ;)

Nikon AF-S NIKKOR 24-70mm f/2.8G ED

01/23/2007 10:41:33 PM · #19

Originally posted by _eug:

Originally posted by crayon:
i mean, Langdon created the site's challenges with a challenge topic for a purpose, didnt he?

How soon we forget the other half of D&L. Oh Drew, we hardly new ye.

The Drew is dead. Long live the Drew.

I think Langdon's the only one running the site now, albeit Drew helped out in the past.

jjstager2

Nikon D700

01/23/2007 10:43:51 PM · #20

Originally posted by levyj413:

Originally posted by jjstager2:
I think it has something to do with the same reason people forward GLURGE emails.

GLURGE?

Here is Wikipedia's definition of Glurge:

Glurge is a neologism describing a certain kind of melodramatic, saccharine story. The defining characteristic of glurge is that, while its purpose is to make the reader happy (and possibly teach a moral lesson), the feel-good aspect is so overdone that some readers are likely to be nauseated rather than inspired. It often has a religious theme and is most commonly circulated via e-mail in the form of a chain letter.

zeuszen

Canon EOS-1Ds Mark II

Canon EF 24-105mm f/4.0L IS

01/23/2007 10:51:26 PM · #21

Originally posted by levyj413:

...Why participate in a site that gives out assignments if you're going to vote highly regardless of whether the assignment is met? What sets our normal challenges apart from free studies with that voting approach?...

I can't, fairly, say whether or not an entry meets a challenge topic. I may have missed or misunderstood something. I may lack a particular sense or mode of a thing, and the strength of the entry I'm voting on may well be its ambiguity.

Who am I to judge what I cannot understand? I don't even and ever try to understand images. I explore, appreciate, compare, measure and, sometimes, feel a photograph. I can, with some confidence, evaluate an entry by comparing it to other photographic images I've seen, studied or am other wise exposed to. If I consider it a fine work, it will have met definite criteria beyond a purely personal appeal, which is time-consuming and may take nearly as much effort as it may take a photographer to present a decent picture.

My critical approach to voting, commenting and comparing is serious business (it is to me). It is a method, really, which would be entirely incompatible with the kind of mind-set that requires to ignore or, worse, to condemn the very qualities I strive so hard to discover, appreciate and celebrate.

Topical restrictions, after all, benefit the entrants. It is a proven means to stimulate creativity for those who do not easily know how to take or make pictures without such stimuli. If a photographer has attempted to meet the topical requirements, he will know it. If he has not, well, it's his loss isn't it?

I, for one, refuse to superimpose any pre-conceived ideas of what may and what may not meet a challenge. It's hard enough to shed pre-conceptions. I need not reinforce something I consider an obstruction to the creative process and to the critical process, do I?

When I vote (comment/measure), I vote and comment with mind and heart, as an independent, appreciative participant. As such, my obligation is to my own conscience and diligence, and as I am in no one's employ, I will "hold in highest consideration" what I deem to be the most precious. And this, my friends, has more to do with an appreciation of a few photographs than with condemning these for appearing when and where they do.

ellamay

Canon EOS-1D Mark II

Canon EF 100-400mm f/4.5-5.6L IS

01/23/2007 10:51:57 PM · #22

such a commotion while I was gone ( no comments from you eug : )

I think the challenges should just help to inspire us to create good photos, I think they can be a good goal and makes it a 'chaallenge' for i.e. shooting stock or getting a job to get a shot that matches. But hey this is for fun. There is no money or 'real' prizes. It is to learn and have fun. If someone goes out to shoot for a challenge and gets a great shot but it is a little off the topic (or a lot) so what.

Or here for another problem with slamming people who don't meet the challenge....this shot....

no one thought it met challenge and probably still don't but it conjoured up lots of people to laugh, to me that is more valuable, making people 'feel' than meeting a challenge. I thought this shot did meet the challenge, tho not conventionally I will give you.

Cam

Sony DSC-F717

01/23/2007 10:56:57 PM · #23

Show me some photos that DNMC and scored high...overall.

I dont think there are many, if any.

_eug

Nikon D50

Nikon AF Nikkor 50mm f/1.8D

01/23/2007 10:58:53 PM · #24

Originally posted by ellamay:

such a commotion while I was gone ( no comments from you eug : )

hehehe