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DPChallenge Forums >> Hardware and Software >> DVD/backup recommendations
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 12/27/2006 09:48:49 PM · #1
Hi all,

This is probably been brought up many times before, but hey what’s another thread (& yes, I have done some searching, which has confirmed my thoughts below).

Anyhow, being relatively new to decent digital (I.E., non Point & shoot) photography, I have been giving a lot of thought to the best method in archiving my valuable images.

External HDD - No - to me, this method is as susceptible to failure as any mechanical storage device. In my past experience failures are generally sudden & irretrievable.

Digital Tape backups (such as DAT’s, DLT’s, LTO’s, etc) – No – Expensive & the technology seems to be rather volatile in relation to upgrading (Where I work we have so much old hardware idle, just in case we need to make a restore of data that is 5 years old).

This leaves optical (CD’s, DVD’s) as the only real alternative. My biggest fear is that in 5 years time, a DVD may be un-readable due to degradation of the inks, etc.

Now, as we all know, DVD quality varies greatly. Its also been said before, that brand names are better then the generics (I tend to disagree a little on thisâ€Â¦.I feel nervous about EVERY DVD that I burn).

But one thing that I haven’t tried is the so called Archive quality “Gold” DVD’s. Has anyone had any success with these, or conversely any issues? What are the preferred backup solutions? Should I get all my photo’s converted to slides (if I am that paranoid?)

Cheers
12/27/2006 10:12:32 PM · #2
How much data do you plan on backing up? single layer DVDs are the cheapest way, on a cost-per-gigabyte basis. A few ways to ensure the DVDs don't degrade are:

1- Handle them very carefully when burning, and afterwards store them safely in climate controlled location that doesn't have any sunlight (storing the media safely before storage is also important)
2- Don't use these DVDs to periodically get access to the data. Only access them for disaster recovery, at which time you should immediately duplicate them. If you need access to the data periodically for other reasons, use a separate backup
3- If you are really serious about maintaining data integrity, I would burn two copies of each archival DVD onto quality media from different manufacturers. This is what I do for critical backups.
4- Keep a set of backups off-site... that way a fire or other disaster doesn't get your primary storage and the backup.

I would skip the conversion to slide method... it would probably be cheaper to pay for online storage from a service that ensures data integrity and redundancy.

i could go on... PM me if you have specific questions.
 12/28/2006 06:02:02 AM · #3
Originally posted by asimchoudhri:
How much data do you plan on backing up? single layer DVDs are the cheapest way, on a cost-per-gigabyte basis. A few ways to ensure the DVDs don't degrade are:

1- Handle them very carefully when burning, and afterwards store them safely in climate controlled location that doesn't have any sunlight (storing the media safely before storage is also important)
2- Don't use these DVDs to periodically get access to the data. Only access them for disaster recovery, at which time you should immediately duplicate them. If you need access to the data periodically for other reasons, use a separate backup
3- If you are really serious about maintaining data integrity, I would burn two copies of each archival DVD onto quality media from different manufacturers. This is what I do for critical backups.
4- Keep a set of backups off-site... that way a fire or other disaster doesn't get your primary storage and the backup.

I would skip the conversion to slide method... it would probably be cheaper to pay for online storage from a service that ensures data integrity and redundancy.

i could go on... PM me if you have specific questions.


Thanks for your reply. For the cost of another DVD, I think it is worth while to make 2 archive copies & a third "General use copy" (Hmmm, less then $3...even my accountant wife will approve ;-) )

Is there any specific brands that you are thinking? I have tended to use the likes of Verbatim/TDK etc in the past. Also, does it matter if they are + or - R's?

Cheers
 12/28/2006 01:04:49 PM · #4
Originally posted by hoffy:

Thanks for your reply. For the cost of another DVD, I think it is worth while to make 2 archive copies & a third "General use copy" (Hmmm, less then $3...even my accountant wife will approve ;-) )

Is there any specific brands that you are thinking? I have tended to use the likes of Verbatim/TDK etc in the past. Also, does it matter if they are + or - R's?

Cheers


The differences between +R/RW and -R/RW are very technical and useless for the average user. Most new drives and burners support both formats, so they are basically very compatible. I've burned generic and brand CDs and DVDs over 3 years back, and they still work today. Make sure you use an acid free pen to write on them if you have to, and store them properly.
 12/28/2006 01:15:35 PM · #5
Differences between +R and -R are minimal. Name brand versus generic doesn't matter to burn a disc for a friend or to transfer data, but I'd be hesitant to use generics for archival (>5 years). I think all of the name brands are good... would have to do more research to see if TDK is better than Verbatim vs Maxell vs Imation vs...

There's a (slightly outdated) article at apple.com that briefly discusses how the smithsonian institution's image archivist is dealing with the transition to digital. Well... how he was dealing with it... this article may be ready for an update.
 12/28/2006 01:41:32 PM · #6
I'm curious to hear from anyone who has actually had a CD/DVD "grow old" and unusable on them. I've never encountered anyone who has had this happen, personally -- aside from people who scratched them up or something.

I can still remember burning my first CD at work back around 1996. I remember thinking how amazing it was that I could actually make my own CD! I remember thinking that flying cars couldn't be far behind! I still have CDs from back then, and they all work just fine.

Message edited by author 2006-12-28 13:42:05.
 12/28/2006 02:01:33 PM · #7
If you ever plan on taking long trip where you end up with 20 GB of image (i.e. 16 days in Kenya) you'll be hard pressed to find an easy way to back up to DVD. Especially if you seperate them into folders based on shooting location. Some days I shot 100, some days 600. Not an easy burn to DVD without wasting space.

My opinion, HDs are cheap. They'll only fail if you use that all the time or you decide to abuse them physically. Back up once a week and leave it unplugged and safely stored between uses. You wanna get fancy you can use RAID NAS(Buffalo Tech TeraStation Pro NAS 1.0 TB) and back that up to HDs once a week.
 12/28/2006 05:05:19 PM · #8
Originally posted by alanfreed:
I'm curious to hear from anyone who has actually had a CD/DVD "grow old" and unusable on them. I've never encountered anyone who has had this happen, personally -- aside from people who scratched them up or something.

I can still remember burning my first CD at work back around 1996. I remember thinking how amazing it was that I could actually make my own CD! I remember thinking that flying cars couldn't be far behind! I still have CDs from back then, and they all work just fine.


Yes, it happens. At my work (I work for an Independant processing company, that deals with financial institutions), we have a backup routine for statements which in includes tape backups (for long term archival & disaster recovery) & CD backups for quick retrievals (it can take upto 2 or 3 days for a retrieval of a file which is 60 days or older from tape, where's we store the CD's locally, which means it takes 30 minutes to get a file that is anything upto 5 years old)

Anyhow, we have had issues with the CD's (especially older ones), even though they have been stored correctly. Granted, the CD technology may be older & there are other factors to be considered (such as the burning technology used & the burn rate used). This is the reason of the original questions in this thread. Nobody at work could give me a definative answer to why & how to avoid it (I.E., they thought that we were doing everything right)

Oh, & the External HDD for a long trip, I would have said that was a given & when I find myself this situation again (Yeah right....mortgage, Kids....lucky I did my travels 10 years ago!!!)this will definately be the solution.

Message edited by author 2006-12-28 17:06:44.
 12/28/2006 06:00:07 PM · #9
for long trips, the best solution... ipod. after the october 8, 2005 earthquake in northern pakistan i was a part of a medical relief mission and got to spend a week or so there... i took hundreds of pictures at a time, and backed them all up to my ipod. easiest way to carry a 60gb hard drive with you, right? that allowed me to take pictures without having to worry about filling up my storage space, and i got pictures that i love which i may have otherwise passed on. granted, i don't need the pictures since i'll never forget what i saw...

for day-to-day backups, an external harddrive is great. however, for archival, you can't match the cost-per-gigabyte of dvd-r. for critical work, i recommend having both an online backup and an offline archival copy.

edit: removed flame-bait

Message edited by author 2006-12-28 18:02:40.
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