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08/02/2006 09:28:49 PM · #26 |
When I was beginning a three hour wait for a security alert at DeGaulle Airport a month or so ago, I noticed the line getting longer and longer. Figuring this was a good photo story for my journal, I went into my carryon, pulled out my DSLR and started shooting. Not a problem. Everyone else was using cell phone cameras. Later a decent picture would have been impossible, because the entire terminal was full.
So, for the first time on DPC, tra la, here is an interior shot of Terminal Three.
(Because I am not completely foolish, I have fuzzed out any recognizable faces) |
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08/02/2006 09:36:19 PM · #27 |
Funny, I just did a Google Images search, and among the hundreds of photos of JFK inside and out, you'll find shots from the architecture firms that did it as well. So why would a terrorist need to go risk getting caught and shooting photos. All they need to do is search the web?
Google Image Search for JFK Terminal Photos |
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08/02/2006 09:39:55 PM · #28 |
Originally posted by _eug:
Originally posted by MPRPRO:
Forgive me here everyone but [expletive self censored but it started with an “F”] that PANY security guard and the Port Authority as a whole... |
But damn, Mike I just love it when you get going. ;) I feel your pain, seriously. That speach had passion to it. I wish I had that kind of, "eff, you" fire and brimstone attitude. |
Have a rent a cop call a real cop who wants you to know he is a real cop and tells you by refusing to show ID until he explains his rational for detaining you that you are "Obstructing" him from doing his job, and you will have plenty of Fire as well.
On a second occasion have this "make believe cop" with grey pants with a black strip down the pants leg, that I could buy at the local uniform store for $20, tell the real police with guns and sticks that a "middle eastern looking man is taking pictures of the George Washington Bridge." After you were courteous enough to let them know and I am sure this too would give you a little fuel for your anger.
Let alone the most honorable man you ever knew gets killed at the world Trade Center on 9/11 and these assholes are using that to justify their own paranoia and I am sure you would be as angry as I am. Otherwise be like everyone else in this country and believe all the BS handed down by these power hungry, self important, narcissistic striped pants wearing minimum wage receiving scum of the earth. And on top of all that, you are paying through the nose for all this in your taxes.
Maybe I should move to New South Wales.
But don't get me going.
Mike
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08/02/2006 09:45:36 PM · #29 |
So Maybe MPRPRO answered my question for me, but I do believe a roommate back in college (who was taking law of some type) told me it is not illegal to walk around without ID. So do I carry ID, shoot pictures and then if I want to stop when I'm questioned, not show my ID in fear that I will wind up on some list and leave? It's a tough question without an obvious answer.
Interestingly, I am going to pick up my wife and kids at PDX in about 3 hours...I think I'll take the 300D, although without a tripod it may be too dark to do much damage.
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08/02/2006 09:49:16 PM · #30 |
Originally posted by DrAchoo:
So Maybe MPRPRO answered my question for me, but I do believe a roommate back in college (who was taking law of some type) told me it is not illegal to walk around without ID. So do I carry ID, shoot pictures and then if I want to stop when I'm questioned, not show my ID in fear that I will wind up on some list and leave? It's a tough question without an obvious answer.
Interestingly, I am going to pick up my wife and kids at PDX in about 3 hours...I think I'll take the 300D, although without a tripod it may be too dark to do much damage. |
Find some pictures of what you plan to shoot on the internet, print the pages and bring it with you. If they hassle you, show them the pictures tell them that real terrorists don't need to take pictures. |
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08/02/2006 09:49:30 PM · #31 |
| k, admitted, i havent read the whole tread, so i dunno if its been asked, but would this have happened if it was a cell phone cam or just a p+s? prolly not! |
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08/02/2006 09:54:14 PM · #32 |
Originally posted by MPRPRO:
Originally posted by _eug:
Originally posted by MPRPRO:
Forgive me here everyone but [expletive self censored but it started with an “F”] that PANY security guard and the Port Authority as a whole... |
But damn, Mike I just love it when you get going. ;) I feel your pain, seriously. That speach had passion to it. I wish I had that kind of, "eff, you" fire and brimstone attitude. |
Have a rent a cop call a real cop who wants you to know he is a real cop and tells you by refusing to show ID until he explains his rational for detaining you that you are "Obstructing" him from doing his job, and you will have plenty of Fire as well.
On a second occasion have this "make believe cop" with grey pants with a black strip down the pants leg, that I could buy at the local uniform store for $20, tell the real police with guns and sticks that a "middle eastern looking man is taking pictures of the George Washington Bridge." After you were courteous enough to let them know and I am sure this too would give you a little fuel for your anger.
Let alone the most honorable man you ever knew gets killed at the world Trade Center on 9/11 and these assholes are using that to justify their own paranoia and I am sure you would be as angry as I am. Otherwise be like everyone else in this country and believe all the BS handed down by these power hungry, self important, narcissistic striped pants wearing minimum wage receiving scum of the earth. And on top of all that, you are paying through the nose for all this in your taxes.
Maybe I should move to New South Wales.
But don't get me going.
Mike |
Man, you have it dead on. If only there were more like you who were willing to go toe to toe with these jerks and hold them accountable for their actions. I don't know what the hell makes them think they can disregard the law and act like little dictators, but it has GOT to stop.
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08/02/2006 09:57:32 PM · #33 |
| I guess I have a different view. In todays view (after 9-11). Just deal with it. Perhaps he did not go far enough, taking your images, and it really would not have stopped anything that may have been negitive to our security. I do not have a problem with the added security. Just imagine if you really was planning a attack? I can hear it in the press now! Terrorist explode bomb! Photo's found in car!. To me its no big deal. I want my rights! However I will give a little. Take my name, leave me my images! If my name is "Abdul" and I have a fake ID and my address is foney! Look Out! What I mean is it is ok to check me out. I am a American and I have nothing to hide! |
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08/02/2006 10:01:11 PM · #34 |
Originally posted by tapeworm_jimmy:
k, admitted, i havent read the whole tread, so i dunno if its been asked, but would this have happened if it was a cell phone cam or just a p+s? prolly not! |
You know what really pisses me off? This shouldn't even have to be asked. Jimmy I am not pissed at you for asking but last I heard I live in the United States of America and we are supposed to be free, as a man I met once at 30 Rock in NYC who was from Germany said to me "How free is a country where you have to keep telling people they are free?" I must admit I didn't get it when he said it but now I do.
There are so many freedoms people are so willing to give up "since 9/11" that in my mind the terrorists won. The WTC is gone and politicians and opportunists have not been able to agree on what should be there in 5 years. As long as that hole is there it is a statement that Osama won. It doesn’t matter if we eventually kill him, he won, the Islamic terrorists won. Sad isn’t it. Oh shit but don’t take a picture of a bridge, oh that is so bad.
F them.
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08/02/2006 10:02:46 PM · #35 |
| What we need is a lawyer or judge who is a photographer to go in, take some pictures, and see how far they stomp on their civil liberties. Then maybe we will get somewhere. |
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08/02/2006 10:03:26 PM · #36 |
Originally posted by bcoble:
I guess I have a different view. In todays view (after 9-11). Just deal with it. Perhaps he did not go far enough, taking your images, and it really would not have stopped anything that may have been negitive to our security. I do not have a problem with the added security. Just imagine if you really was planning a attack? I can hear it in the press now! Terrorist explode bomb! Photo's found in car!. To me its no big deal. I want my rights! However I will give a little. Take my name, leave me my images! If my name is "Abdul" and I have a fake ID and my address is foney! Look Out! What I mean is it is ok to check me out. I am a American and I have nothing to hide! |
Still, in this day and age, who knows what the gu'mint is doing with that info. Bush has regularly shown he will direct his agencies to do whatever the hell he wants. What if I wind up on some list and then get flagged for extra security every time I fly, or worse get banned from flying? You think that if Ted Kennedy had trouble getting off the list that little old me is going to have a snowball's chance in hell of getting myself off said list?
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08/02/2006 10:03:33 PM · #37 |
Originally posted by bcoble:
I guess I have a different view. In todays view (after 9-11). Just deal with it. Perhaps he did not go far enough, taking your images, and it really would not have stopped anything that may have been negitive to our security. I do not have a problem with the added security. Just imagine if you really was planning a attack? I can hear it in the press now! Terrorist explode bomb! Photo's found in car!. To me its no big deal. I want my rights! However I will give a little. Take my name, leave me my images! If my name is "Abdul" and I have a fake ID and my address is foney! Look Out! What I mean is it is ok to check me out. I am a American and I have nothing to hide! |
This type of thought is the problem. Tomorrow you will say it's ok for them to tell you what books to read.
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08/02/2006 10:04:26 PM · #38 |
| We just have to remember to vote in the upcoming elections. Maybe we can change some of this crap. |
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08/02/2006 10:04:56 PM · #39 |
Dammit, I used that line already. :P |
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08/02/2006 10:05:08 PM · #40 |
Originally posted by DrAchoo:
What if I wind up on some list and then get flagged for extra security every time I fly, or worse get banned from flying? You think that if Ted Kennedy had trouble getting off the list that little old me is going to have a snowball's chance in hell of getting myself off said list? |
Well it's ok because you are a trouble maker I would support keeping an eye on you. LOL
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08/02/2006 10:06:52 PM · #41 |
| Read this. Look more towards the bottom. The main focus is on the MTA (subways) though. |
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08/02/2006 10:16:35 PM · #42 |
If you have nothing to hide, Whats the big deal if you are questioned. If someone blows up you local Library, and it is shown that it could be prevented by some added security, the left will be all over it! I want my rights!! but I can take alittle extra security in a effort to stop those low lifes from screwing up my life!
My whole point is things have changed. It is hard to trust anyone anymore.
I take alot of images and have never been stopped. Perhaps when that happens I will change my mind. I would rather give up alittle freedom to make a attemp to prevent another 9-11. |
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08/02/2006 10:22:31 PM · #43 |
| I don't think you will ever stop another 9/11. If someone wants to do it bad enough, they will. Then we'll have to instill even more security. Where will it stop. I think one of the problems is that some people like to be told what to do and think. I think it makes them feel more secure. |
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08/02/2006 10:27:14 PM · #44 |
As silly as this sounds, it is not that far fetched. I went to college in Brooklyn in the late '80s and our photography professor warned us about shooting in "public" places, especially in the subway system.
His advice was basically this:
- Look before shooting
- Be polite (say that you didn't know usually worked)
- Say you're a student
- Have your student ID ready
- and if all else failed, be prepared to surrender your film
Keeping this in mind - I shot in the subways, Penn Station, Grand Central Terminal and firehouses, along with cops doing their job-usually crowd control, and was never hassled. Got dirty looks and hightailed it out of the area a few times, but otherwise had no problems.
Cut to today and we have this:
//www.panynj.gov/AboutthePortAuthority/PressCenter/PressCenterGuide/
Videotaping/Photographing at Port Authority Facilities
...The Port Authority reserves the right to restrict videotaping and photography at its airports. Videotaping in runway and taxiway areas at all airports is prohibited at all times. Videotaping and photographing at security checkpoint areas operated by the U.S. Transportation Security Administration is prohibited without the consent of the TSA.
I don't know what type of equipment you were shooting with, but my guess it was not a "point-and-shoot". Your digital SLR marks you as a different breed when compared to your usual tourist and that is what most likely set the security guard off.
We have the same issues out here in the 'burbs. A tourist got hassled for taking pictures of a county courthouse. If you use Google Earth, look up White Plains NY and zoom in. You will find certain buildings and "sensitive" areas blurred.
The funny part is what is blurred and what is not. The County Courthouse-blurred, the Federal Courthouse-not blurred, and they are on the same block.
I can see blurring a Nuclear power plant (Indian Point), but the White Plains Metro North train station? Talk about priorities? |
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08/02/2006 10:27:27 PM · #45 |
Originally posted by bcoble:
If you have nothing to hide, Whats the big deal if you are questioned. If someone blows up you local Library, and it is shown that it could be prevented by some added security, the left will be all over it! I want my rights!! but I can take alittle extra security in a effort to stop those low lifes from screwing up my life!
My whole point is things have changed. It is hard to trust anyone anymore.
I take alot of images and have never been stopped. Perhaps when that happens I will change my mind. I would rather give up alittle freedom to make a attemp to prevent another 9-11. |
The problem is, the stuff they are doing, for the most part, IS NOT MAKING ANYONE SAFER! It's feel-good safety - it looks good on paper, it gives people willing to fall for it a warm fuzzy feeling to think that they are being protected. But you know what? Most of it is a facade. Do you really think that a rent a cop is going to save the day? If an actual terrorist pulled a gun, the rent a cop is going to piss down his leg. Same is true for most of the "security" people at airports/subways/etc.
It's an excuse for the government to take liberties away. They have already shown us that they can do almost whatever they want in the name of "National Security". And people who roll over and take it play right into their hands. MPRPRO is right - we should not have to give up freedoms in return for protection. That is NOT what this country was founded on.
So you think it's okay to have a little give and take. Let me ask you this: when does it become wrong? Is it wrong when you get hassled taking pictures in public? Is it wrong when the government starts to put you on secret lists and tap your phone without a warrent? Is it wrong when they start telling you what you can and cannot say? Is it wrong when they start arresting you for being a dissident?
Different levels, maybe. But they all sound awful damn Stalin/Castro/Third World to me. I'm not in favor of any of them. I guess I'm just and old fashioned, "Government of the (common) people, for the (common) people" guy. Which must make me out of style.
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08/02/2006 10:33:45 PM · #46 |
Originally posted by bcoble:
My whole point is things have changed. It is hard to trust anyone anymore.
I take alot of images and have never been stopped. Perhaps when that happens I will change my mind. I would rather give up alittle freedom to make a attemp to prevent another 9-11. |
If you did nothing wrong you shouldn't have to prove it to some asshole because it makes him feel like he has a bigger dick then you and uses the death of your friend and almost three thousand other innocent people to justify it.
I am not mad at you, I am angry at the complete ignorance of some people as to what our constitution says and why it says it. They are not just pretty words. Read it. Trust me I am not some left wing anti war wack job, I am conservative that’s why I get so upset when people stretch the truth for their own gain. ("Jobs Americans won’t do." Right that is the most racist statement I have ever heard since George Wallace said he wasn’t going to let those kids go to that school.)
As I said before Osama won.
Remember not the 2nd or the 5th but the FIRST number 1 numoro uno Amendment says (there is a reason it was the first.):
Amendment I
Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances.
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08/02/2006 10:34:19 PM · #47 |
What next:
"Taking of pictures of sunrises and sunsets is strictly prohibited."
This way we won't have anyone trying to blow up the sun. |
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08/02/2006 10:38:15 PM · #48 |
Originally posted by MPRPRO:
Originally posted by bcoble:
My whole point is things have changed. It is hard to trust anyone anymore.
I take alot of images and have never been stopped. Perhaps when that happens I will change my mind. I would rather give up alittle freedom to make a attemp to prevent another 9-11. |
If you did nothing wrong you shouldn't have to prove it to some asshole because it makes him feel like he has a bigger dick then you and uses the death of your friend and almost three thousand other innocent people to justify it.
I am not mad at you, I am angry at the complete ignorance of some people as to what our constitution says and why it says it. They are not just pretty words. Read it. Trust me I am not some left wing anti war wack job, I am conservative that’s why I get so upset when people stretch the truth for their own gain. ("Jobs Americans won’t do." Right that is the most racist statement I have ever heard since George Wallace said he wasn’t going to let those kids go to that school.)
As I said before Osama won.
Remember not the 2nd or the 5th but the FIRST number 1 numoro uno Amendment says (there is a reason it was the first.):
Amendment I
Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances. |
You're right. Jobs that Americans won't do is a bunch of BS. Of course it is hard to get an American to do a job for a dollar a day. |
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08/02/2006 10:38:50 PM · #49 |
FYI:
The Constitution of the United States of America
We the people of the United States, in order to form a more perfect union, establish justice, insure domestic tranquility, provide for the common defense, promote the general welfare, and secure the blessings of liberty to ourselves and our posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.
US Bill of Rights (not suggestions)
"We the People" Mike one of the people.
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08/02/2006 10:40:23 PM · #50 |
Originally posted by MPRPRO:
FYI:
The Constitution of the United States of America
We the people of the United States, in order to form a more perfect union, establish justice, insure domestic tranquility, provide for the common defense, promote the general welfare, and secure the blessings of liberty to ourselves and our posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.
US Bill of Rights (not suggestions)
"We the People" Mike one of the people. |
Maybe we need to start mailing copies of both documents to key people. Police departments, Congressmen, oh, I don't know, say, the President himself?
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