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08/01/2006 09:55:30 AM · #651 |
Well, I've been wanting to ignore this thread for around 15 pages or so...
But... I... just... can't... get... the strength.... to look...... away....
I guess that makes me want the thread locked because I can't make the decision myself...
Oh no wait a second. Here we go....
*ignore*
On a different note. It's certainly something that can help us all to examine why we come here.. Do we just come here for the score or for the rest?
Know thy enemy? Know thyself first. Right? |
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08/01/2006 09:56:49 AM · #652 |
Originally posted by keegbow:
Originally posted by Judi:
Originally posted by capturedinprint:
I agree with the previous post (by skiprow).. we need this thread to stay for awhile..
but what IS interesting to me (without bringing the bible into it) is that his "friends" on here who were SO chatty with him in the forums, haven't said BOO on this thread (well one fotoman-person said one teeny comment) but they have all crawled back into the cracks it seems... typical |
Everyone????...I can name quite a few that have spoken! |
A lot of Rikki's friends have commented here, I consider myself a friend of Rikki but I do not condone what he has done nor can I forgive him just yet but I will in time. Rikki certainly gave a lot of vibe to this place that is going to be hard to replace.
I also agree that this thread needs to be kept open it is part of the healing process some prefer to be more open and vocal and some prefer to be quite.
Another victim in this are all the young photographers on this site the children who looked up to Rikki, my son came home from school today and when I told him he was almost crying and that alone has had a big effect on me. |
I also told my son because I was so bummed. He knew of Rikki's work because of the effort I went through in the DejaVu challenge. It became a parental moment that's for sure.
Message edited by author 2006-08-01 16:44:39. |
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08/01/2006 09:57:04 AM · #653 |
Originally posted by capturedinprint:
snip...
but what IS interesting to me (without bringing the bible into it) is that his "friends" on here who were SO chatty with him in the forums, haven't said BOO on this thread (well one fotoman-person said one teeny comment) but they have all crawled back into the cracks it seems... typical |
Yup the "Rakes" are in other hands now... |
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08/01/2006 09:58:16 AM · #654 |
Originally posted by yakatme:
I was the one who said it, but I didn't leave it at that. A lot of DPC'ers may not have been on this site recently and are still discovering what happened. They probably would like the chance to spend their 2 cents and vent a little. |
Venting on a public forum is not necessarily a good thing all the time. Particularly when the majority of the venting is speculation or accusations.
And spending 2 cents often buys more than a pound of grief.
Attacking any person in a public forum, even when they goofed as severely as rikki, often leads to his friends feeling like they have to support him. Those friends then often become the target of the anger. The people who don't support rikki and want to start comparing his actions to something more severe than a serious internet addiction....let's call them the lynch mob...create their own disharmony in the thread.
Anyways, as we are all about giving two cents here..this is my take on it.
Rikki got over competetive, like a lot of people on this site, and used whatever tools at his disposal to improve his odds. He got caught.
I see an example of this behaviour in every challenge, I have even got over-zealous with the burn and dodge tool and paid the price.
If you try to slip a few extra clone strokes by the rules, if you share your photos with others before the challenges, if you have you wife and kids voting in blocks or photo teams....it's all the same in different measures. You want an edge.
Maybe the popularity of this thread is all about people thinking a little about how they could be judged too...
2 cents spent.
Message edited by author 2006-08-01 09:59:17. |
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08/01/2006 09:59:32 AM · #655 |
Originally posted by awpollard:
but what IS interesting to me (without bringing the bible into it) is that his "friends" on here who were SO chatty with him in the forums, haven't said BOO on this thread (well one fotoman-person said one teeny comment) but they have all crawled back into the cracks it seems... typical |
ctrl+f drachoo, idnic, bear_music...all of whom have posted several times. |
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08/01/2006 10:05:19 AM · #656 |
Originally posted by hokie:
Originally posted by yakatme:
I was the one who said it, but I didn't leave it at that. A lot of DPC'ers may not have been on this site recently and are still discovering what happened. They probably would like the chance to spend their 2 cents and vent a little. |
Venting on a public forum is not necessarily a good thing all the time. Particularly when the majority of the venting is speculation or accusations.
And spending 2 cents often buys more than a pound of grief.
Attacking any person in a public forum, even when they goofed as severely as rikki, often leads to his friends feeling like they have to support him. Those friends then often become the target of the anger. The people who don't support rikki and want to start comparing his actions to something more severe than a serious internet addiction....let's call them the lynch mob...create their own disharmony in the thread.
Anyways, as we are all about giving two cents here..this is my take on it.
Rikki got over competetive, like a lot of people on this site, and used whatever tools at his disposal to improve his odds. He got caught.
I see an example of this behaviour in every challenge, I have even got over-zealous with the burn and dodge tool and paid the price.
If you try to slip a few extra clone strokes by the rules, if you share your photos with others before the challenges, if you have you wife and kids voting in blocks or photo teams....it's all the same in different measures. You want an edge.
Maybe the popularity of this thread is all about people thinking a little about how they could be judged too...
2 cents spent. |
I don't see anyone attacking Rikki, otherwise SC would have stepped in and done something...are you saying they're not doing their job here? People are critical of the behaviour, which inevitably reflects on Rikki. What Lynch mob????
As for your 'everyone' cheats to some extent - I haven't, not once, not a stroke, not a dodge nothing. If everyone is cheating we might as well all leave now.
Message edited by author 2006-08-01 10:06:33. |
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08/01/2006 10:10:25 AM · #657 |
Originally posted by amber:
I don't see anyone attacking Rikki, otherwise SC would have stepped in and done something...are you saying they're not doing their job here? People are critical of the behaviour, which inevitably reflects on Rikki. What Lynch mob????
As for your 'everyone' cheats to some extent - I haven't, not once, not a stroke, not a dodge nothing. If everyone is cheating we might as well all leave now. |
The lynch mob to me is looking for more punishment for rikki above what he already received. They don't have to be willing to travel to his house and burn it down to be a lynch mob.
I didn't say everyone cheats, I said I see an example of cheating in every challenge..that is indisputable.
As for you personally, congratulations. |
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08/01/2006 10:14:41 AM · #658 |
| In the midst of arguing about whether we should argue :), I have a question for SC... When is the recalculation expected to be complete? When will we see new ribbon winners on the front? It's not a problem, I'm just curious, and I guess I should quit checking every five minutes, huh... :) |
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08/01/2006 10:16:32 AM · #659 |
Originally posted by hokie:
I said I see an example of cheating in every challenge..that is indisputable. |
Appearances can be deceiving. We HAVE had challenges with no DQ's, and most "examples" are either accidents (thought it was Advanced, entered the wrong challenge, etc.), misunderstandings, or post-processing inexperience. Outright cheating and attempts to skirt the rules are relatively rare from what I've seen. |
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08/01/2006 10:19:21 AM · #660 |
| ...and the thread goes on...and on...and on...and on |
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08/01/2006 10:23:05 AM · #661 |
Originally posted by hokie:
The lynch mob to me is looking for more punishment for rikki above what he already received. They don't have to be willing to travel to his house and burn it down to be a lynch mob. |
I have to disagree. What many of us, or at least I was/were looking for was an explanation as to why Rikki's punishment wasn't in accordance with what the rules specifically state. I think many of us were surprised as the rules don't seem to describe a gray area for this matter. I don't think that Rikki needs to be beheaded or cast into the burning hellfires, but we all like to know that the SC is taking this sort of thing seriously and that we can hopefully expect it not to happen again, at least from the same person.
Whenever anything of this scale happens, people want to talk about it, just like they wanted to talk about Rikki when he was awarded all those ribbons. I'm not Rikki's friend so perhaps I have a different view but it seems to me that this thread has continued to be quite civil and is, in fact, littered with support from Rikki's friends. Rikki's character doesn't need defaming from us...unfortunately, he did that himself. |
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08/01/2006 10:27:34 AM · #662 |
Well said mk.
I'm glad I refreshed on the other screen before I posted what I was going to. |
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08/01/2006 10:34:28 AM · #663 |
Originally posted by ClubJuggle:
Originally posted by ergo:
Would like to see his profile, perhaps with a note attached as to why he's being suspended, and all his images, just for the record.
Removing his profile from the site simply wipes this off the record. But keeping his profile accessible shows that someone who has violated some basic rules has been caught and dealt with. |
Rikki submitted a ticket and requested to cancel his account. Even though he has been suspended, he has a right to do this. Canceled profiles are not visible to the public.
~Terry |
But DQ'd entries are still visible in the individuatl challenges?
Why then would a cancelled accounts not show the challenge history?
I understand the bio and portfolio being hidden but why not show the challenges?
Or is there an easy way I am missing to see all the challenges entered by a cancelled account?
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08/01/2006 10:43:01 AM · #664 |
Originally posted by scalvert:
Appearances can be deceiving. We HAVE had challenges with no DQ's, and most "examples" are either accidents (thought it was Advanced, entered the wrong challenge, etc.), misunderstandings, or post-processing inexperience. Outright cheating and attempts to skirt the rules are relatively rare from what I've seen. |
Well Shannon, there are more ways to "cheat" than simple photo edits, as witnessed by this very topic.
I am not criticizing or throwing stones, simply stating what we all know.
Maybe we should have new rules that specifically state how many and to whom people should share info (this is said tongue in cheek) But before dismissing what I am saying....think about just how subtle my meaning is and where do we draw the lines? Obviously at 30 or more. But exactly where?
And think about what the term "lynch mob" means. Often times people caught in the crossfire of the mob and the "lynchee" get hurt.
Just posting my particular view, which is probably in the minority. |
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08/01/2006 10:47:26 AM · #665 |
Originally posted by rswank:
But DQ'd entries are still visible in the individual challenges?
Why then would a cancelled accounts not show the challenge history?... |
Any images still visible in the challenges weren't DQ'd because they weren't influenced by friend voting. Whether the Admins choose to hide a profile from view or not, the individual entries remain visible in the challenges to maintain site legacy. |
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08/01/2006 10:53:07 AM · #666 |
Originally posted by hokie:
...and where do we draw the lines? Obviously at 30 or more. But exactly where? |
It should be left at personal responsibility.
Personally, I draw the line at zero.
My son (yakatyou) has recently registered on this site and he has indicated that he would like to do a little favor for me. He wanted to give one of my challenge entries an 8 when he thought it deserved a 7.
I was adamant that he should vote the entry what he honestly thinks it deserves, or just not vote on it. |
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08/01/2006 10:54:54 AM · #667 |
Originally posted by hokie:
Maybe we should have new rules that specifically state how many and to whom people should share info (this is said tongue in cheek) |
Sharing info is not cheating. Influencing the vote is, and I haven't seen any other examples of that. By the time I enter a challenge tonight, lots of people will have seen my entry:
My co-workers saw it because they asked what I shot this week- but they don't vote (if they're even registered at all). My wife, kids, and au pair all saw it because I don't lock myself in a closet when I edit, but they don't vote either. One or more DPC members will know it's mine because they were with me (at a GTG) when I shot it, but I trust that they would vote fairly or abstain.
However subtly you define cheating, I still maintain that it's relatively rare on this site.
Message edited by author 2006-08-01 10:57:06. |
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08/01/2006 10:58:06 AM · #668 |
Originally posted by scalvert:
...I don't lock myself in a closet when I edit... |
You should try that, then maybe we'd have a chance at the ribbons! :D |
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08/01/2006 10:58:48 AM · #669 |
Originally posted by hokie:
As for you personally, congratulations. |
I'm being congratulated for not cheating? Wow! |
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08/01/2006 11:29:43 AM · #670 |
Originally posted by scalvert:
... I still maintain that it's relatively rare on this site. |
Shannon, you (and I think several others on SC) thought cheating was relatively rare before the instant fraud came to light, even while some users were smelling a rat. Haven't your eyes been opened at all?
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08/01/2006 11:32:43 AM · #671 |
Originally posted by coolhar:
Haven't your eyes been opened at all? |
One out of tens of thousands certainly fits MY definition of relatively rare. It's easy to claim the sewers are infested with alligators, but finding one gator after years of searching does not an infestation make.
My position has always been that rampant cheating on this site is possible, but extremely unlikely. Nothing has changed in that regard.
Message edited by author 2006-08-01 11:38:32. |
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08/01/2006 11:33:07 AM · #672 |
i have hidden a number of posts in this thread because there is no need to drag other members into this discussion. this is not a witch hunt.
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08/01/2006 11:33:16 AM · #673 |
Sorry for the double post. My bad.
Message edited by author 2006-08-01 11:34:22.
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08/01/2006 11:40:27 AM · #674 |
Originally posted by scalvert:
Originally posted by coolhar:
Haven't your eyes been opened at all? |
One out of tens of thousands certainly fits MY definition of relatively rare. It's easy to claim the sewers are infested with alligators, but finding one gator after years of searching does not an infestation make. |
Well, I think that this case shows that cheating is happening on a scale that none of us were aware of. Perhaps we, as individuals, as members of SC, and a whole community, need to reassess out thinking on the point of how much cheating there is, or could be, going on. If we were able to do that, and we could follow up that awareness with a new approach to dealing with cheating, then something good would have come out of this crap heap.
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08/01/2006 11:40:31 AM · #675 |
Originally posted by muckpond:
i have hidden a number of posts in this thread because there is no need to drag other members into this discussion. this is not a witch hunt. |
Burn the Witch :-)
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