Buying a new, custom-built computer

Sigma 24-70mm f/2.8 IF EX DG HSM for Canon

07/11/2006 05:30:18 PM · #1

Hi All,

Well, my partner's machine kicked the bucket yesterday - it is officially toast. And mine is kind of old and on its way out, too. Actually, his machine dying was a surprise. We were planning on getting a new one for me first.

Normally, I would go out and buy all the parts and then assemble the thing myself. But I don't have the time to do that right now. However, I still want to be able to pick out all the components and have one custom built.

I've seen Monarch Computer recommended in the forums. Their level of customization is exactly what I'm looking for. However, when I checked out their reviews in Price Grabber and similar sites, in the past 6 months they have an awful lot of negative reviews. So I'm not really comfortable buying from them. Are there any other places that provide a similar level of customization that anyone would recommend? (Or even if you've only heard about - that's ok. I'll do the research myself!)

Thanks in advance!

Liz

PS - I'm looking at mid-range PC's for him, and maybe mid- to high-end PC's for me. Macs aren't an option for me - I need a PC for work.

coronamv

Canon EOS-350D Rebel XT

07/11/2006 05:37:27 PM · #2

My advice is to find a local store that is priced around the same as web prices. So if you were to have a problem you can go down there and talk to them. I used to deal with a company in Atlanta Ga Called www.ginstar.com they were a mile from my house. great prices and good service. But as far as NYC don't know of any.

Canon EF 24-105mm f/4.0L IS

07/11/2006 05:47:46 PM · #3

Originally posted by coronamv:

Thanks, Mark. There was a local store in Brooklyn that I trusted for many years and I'd bring my machines there whenever I had a problem I couldn't solve. I even had them build a machine for my Mom. But unfortunately, that store is no longer.

So actually, yes, I will add that to my question here, too - can anyone recommend a place in NYC that would provide this service? I'm still open to online shops, though, so all recommendations are welcome.

Melethia

Canon EOS-80D

07/11/2006 07:22:23 PM · #4

I know this is heresy (I built mine, too) but you may want to consider just getting a Dell - prices are pretty darn good these days and to some extent you can choose your options. It'd be quicker, anyway.

07/11/2006 07:34:59 PM · #5

I built a number of systems in the 80's and 90's as well as having some built locally, but now I buy from Dell (and Apple, but that's another story). The prices are good and I've had little problems (with 7 systems from 2 to 5 years old, there has been only two repairs).

For a good workstation class system I'd recommend looking at the Precision 380 on the Small Business site. Lots of configuration flexibility and no nonsense (system comes clean of junk software), and a 3 year warranty.
Dell Precision Workstation 380

TechnoShroom

Canon EF 100mm f/2.8 USM Macro

07/11/2006 07:37:29 PM · #6

Last computer I helped buy started off as a barebones system from Directron. You can pick the basic parts and just add to it at home if you have any time available. Might be the cheapest solution if you still have some up to date parts from the old computer.

07/11/2006 08:26:48 PM · #7

Melethia - Hehehe... yeah, that is heresy! ;-) Seriously, though, thanks - it's at least worth taking a look at the Dell's.

Talmy - You, too, with the Dell's, eh? :) OK. Thanks. I will seriously consider, especially at the moment time and my own lack of it are the key factors here.

TechnoShroom - I considered getting a barebones and then putting in the rest, but I know that even this I don't quite have time for. It's been a few years since I built a system, and so I'm rusty. Plus, it's not something i had done a lot of anyway, so I never got particularly quick at it. So I know it won't be a fast job for me. But thank you, I do appreciate the suggestion.

I'm not necessarily looking for the cheapest solution here - just what I can customize the most (I really want to pick my own motherboard, if I can) and have all the labor taken care of for me so I don't have to take the time later.

Thanks for all the suggestions so far. I will be doing more research into them. In the interim, I'm still open to more ideas, so if you've got 'em, fire away!

Liz

07/12/2006 12:25:42 AM · #8

I've checked out Dell, and their prices do seem to have improved, but I'm still not happy with the level of customization.

However, I have found another site online that's like Monarch, except they've gotten stellar reviews in a number of different places: Puget Systems. From what I've read in the reviews, they are most interested in building the computer that's right for you, and sometimes they'll even talk you down from getting high-end stuff that you don't need. I like business people who will do that. They're few and far between. They also sometimes give free upgrades when they can't get a part right away. So I have a feeling I will probably be going with these folks. Now I just need to figure out what to buy!

Thanks for all the suggestions, everyone. :)

Liz

fotomann_forever

07/12/2006 12:28:26 AM · #9

Alienware has some awesome machines, but are a bit expensive. Mostly aimed at gamers, so they are fast.

Canon EF 100-400mm f/4.5-5.6L IS

07/12/2006 12:57:19 AM · #10

Originally posted by fotomann_forever:

Alienware has some awesome machines, but are a bit expensive. Mostly aimed at gamers, so they are fast.

Thanks, Leroy. I've known abut Alienware's high-end systems for some time, and so that's why I didn't even bother looking at them. However, with your mention of them I decided to take a look, and I may be wrong, but I think their pricing of their mid-range systems is actually comparable to Puget... I'm quite surprised! They actually might have the better deal. So, thanks, Leroy - you've given me somewhere else to look.

Liz

awpollard

Canon EOS-5D Mark II

07/12/2006 01:38:41 AM · #11

That is a shame about Monarch, I checked their reviews on reseller ratings and yes it looks like they are having a ton of problems.

One that is getting good reviews at Reseller Ratings rating is Velocity Micro same build your own theory... parts are high end (not OEM'd) so they cost a little more...but good rigs.

Message edited by author 2006-07-12 01:39:01.

Canon EF 24-105mm f/4.0L IS

07/12/2006 10:28:21 AM · #12

Originally posted by awpollard:

Thanks, Andy. Yes, I was disappointed about Monarch, too. Let's hope they're just going through a phase. Thanks for telling me about Velocity Micro - I'll check them out.

The more I look, the more I realize for my partner's machine we really need to go to a higher end one. We think it died because of overheating, and so I'm seriously looking at these liquid cooled systems, which of course, are a lot more expensive. We also want to get the primary drive set up in a RAID 1 config so that it's always backed up (the drive failed, as well as the video card and possibly the motherboard on his machine). So we're talking about something that isn't in the budget computer line.

Thanks again for the suggestions. They're much appreciated!

Liz

Edited to add: Puget Systems got fantastic reviews on
Reseller Ratings. That's why I'm hopeful about them.

Message edited by author 2006-07-12 10:31:48.

Melethia

Canon EOS-80D

07/12/2006 10:36:09 AM · #13

I set mine up as a RAID machine when the old hard drive ate three months worth of mediocre pictures... I looked briefly at a couple of those sites mentioned (as well as the bigger commercial guys) and I didn't see many that offered RAID'd SATA drives. I'd highly recommend the RAID - it was a pain to get operating (lots of trial and error) but now that it's working, all is good. I also still back up once a week or so to an external drive, and will be making DVDs one of these weekends. All it takes is one hard drive crash with no backups and you appreciate the spending money for more part. :-)

Canon EF 100-400mm f/4.5-5.6L IS

07/12/2006 10:47:48 AM · #14

Originally posted by GentleSoul:

The more I look, the more I realize for my partner's machine we really need to go to a higher end one. We think it died because of overheating, and so I'm seriously looking at these liquid cooled systems, which of course, are a lot more expensive. We also want to get the primary drive set up in a RAID 1 config so that it's always backed up (the drive failed, as well as the video card and possibly the motherboard on his machine). So we're talking about something that isn't in the budget computer line.

Well unless your partner is a gamer and needs the absolute maximum performance, I'd avoid liquid cooled systems. Their long term reliability is questionable. Speaking as an electrical engineer, the fewer the mechanical components the better off you are. Gee, why is it that the only parts I tend to ever have to replace are disk drives and fans?

Poor cooling is almost always a result of poorly designed custom built or BYO systems, or adding power hungry components to systems that were not designed to handle them. Large companies have mechanical engineers that design the cases and check the airflow. They can't afford high failure rates.

Also don't fool yourself with RAID 1. It's not a substitute for backing up. It's intended for applications which require 100% uptime by having redundancy against failures (think "banks", but also any company that needs to record real-time financial transactions.) The reason it isn't a backup is many-fold:

1. No protection against theft or "acts of god" -- flood, fire... You need an off-site backup to protect from these.
2. No protection against Operator Error (accidental erasure).
3. Power supply catastrophic failure can take out both drives.
4. Computer viruses can corrupt data.

The easiest solution is to skip the RAID and buy two external hard drives. On a regular basis mirror the system drive to alternate external drives. Occasionally verify that the mirrored information can be recovered. Keep the drives at a different location. Now you are covered against virtually all failures.

Message edited by author 2006-07-12 10:52:21.

awpollard

Canon EOS-5D Mark II

07/12/2006 10:48:38 AM · #15

I'll say one thing... I've been running Vista Beta 2 on AMD64 +3400 and 2G's RAM and it is quite peppy. My video is only an nVidia 6600 OC with 128M RAM... Still everything runs quite a bit faster than the same hardware on 32 Bit (x86) XP. I can do all the visuals and gadgets with this set up with little or no strain on the box.

Don't skimp on the OS when building your rig. If going XP use the 64bit (x64) version. It also might be a good time to wait if you got a few months. I'm seeing that Vista RC1 (release canidate 1) is done. MS will generally get up to RC3 before releasing the product.

I'm now having issues (dual booting) using XP at all now. Vista still has some issues, but mine install went flawless. And the platform is pretty flippin cool.

Andy

Melethia

Canon EOS-80D

Canon EF 24-105mm f/4.0L IS

07/12/2006 10:56:11 AM · #16

talmy - you do raise some good points on data security, that RAID isn't the "end all" solution. Main reason I went to it is if I have a single drive failure, I don't have to reinstall all my software. That's a HUGE pain in the... And yes, you can have an image on an external, but transferring that image to a fresh drive and having it work can be nearly as difficult as reinstalling software. I do, as you mentioned, backup to an external and keep DVDs as well for data.

07/12/2006 01:12:09 PM · #17

Originally posted by Melethia:

And yes, you can have an image on an external, but transferring that image to a fresh drive and having it work can be nearly as difficult as reinstalling software.

That's why I warned about testing the backups! Three times, on different systems with different backup techniques I found that backups that were being made were not recoverable! Sort of nullifies the backup routine! And at work, a couple of years ago, a storage server failure took nearly two weeks to recover the data because of problems with the backup hardware/software.

07/13/2006 01:27:36 AM · #18

WOW - clearly I have a lot more to think about!

talmy - I understand what you're saying about the RAID. Makes a lot of sense. We'll spend our money on an external disk or two instead. I also understand what you're saying about the liquid cooling system. But since fans break down, too, what do you recommend in terms of cooling? I'm not building this myself, but even if I was, I'm not sure I could guarantee that the system has good airflow. How do I help to ensure that the system I get is properly cooled?

Andy - you've got me drooling. :) I think we'll experiment with the OS on my machine when I have it done, which will be considerably higher end than my partner's (I'm the gamer - not him). I was originally planning on holding off on my machine until Vista came out, but mine's not going to hold out that long. It needs upgrades that aren't worth it at this point. So for me, I'll get either the 64-bit XP or the Vista. Hmmm... actually, maybe the 64-bit XP would be good for my partner, too. More to think about!

Thanks, guys! I'm so glad the folks here are so diverse. I always know that if I have a non-photography question, it'll get answered by someone out there. :)

Liz

Sigma 24-70mm f/2.8 IF EX DG HSM for Canon

07/14/2006 10:16:55 AM · #19

Originally posted by GentleSoul:

You would have to look at existing work by the builder. See how the air flows through the box -- cabling should be dressed to not block airflow. All fans should has ball bearings (the cheap sleave bearings will cause the fan to fail within a year if the system runs 24/7). Unless the system is used for games, there is no reason to buy a system that requires a fan on the graphics card. Also, in general, smaller cases have greater cooling problems than larger cases so go with the biggest box you can accomodate. For Intel processor based systems, the recent BTX case design gives superior cooling (and quieter operation) compared to the older ATX designs.

coronamv

Canon EOS-350D Rebel XT

07/14/2006 10:34:58 AM · #20

Go with an ANTEC case... Good power proper air flow and use a decent fan and heatsink. As long as your room where the PC will be located does not get too hot during the day you should not have any issues.

awpollard

Canon EOS-5D Mark II

Canon EF 100-400mm f/4.5-5.6L IS

07/14/2006 10:46:03 AM · #21

Originally posted by coronamv:

Antec power supplies are (not cheap but) whisper quiet as well.

I have blown (2) ebay 550w $29.99 specials, finally dropped the 100 bucks and got an Antec 550w, you can't even tell when the PC is on (except for the (4) 80mm fans that you can hear) Also the Antec's come with cool (black Mesh wrapped) leaders that you can proudly display through the glass side of your case.

I still like the Antec Lanboy case, pleasing to look at and comes with a carrying strap for all those Lan Partys.

eckoe

Canon EOS-5D Mark III

Canon EF 50mm f/1.8 II

07/14/2006 10:55:33 AM · #22

64 bit OS's are not fully supported by all software yet. Many developers are skipping support until Vista is fully released to avoid major code change issues with the new OS. Be sure that all of the software you use will be compatible with the 64bit OS's before you make a jump to these especially if these are business machines with specific software on them.

There's a high likelyhood that all is well, and that it doesn't matter, but some software just doesn't have full support for these systems yet.