Sigma 500 DG or 500 DG Super please help!

03/07/2006 07:12:08 AM · #1

Okay... what to buy...

The price difference is quite substantial, and from what I gather, the only thing that makes the Super better, is a LCD screen at the back to view your settings, and also that you can shoot it off camera via infrared.

Now, Ive never shot with a flash before, so I wouldnt even know what the lcd is telling me really.

Also... 'off-camera?' Do you like... hold it in your hand?

:)

Still, being in a learning phase I am torn between forking out an extra... err.... $200 for the Super.

Is it really worth it? Can someone please help?

Thanks

Tamron AF 28-300mm f/3.5-6.3 XR Di LD Aspherical IF for Canon

03/07/2006 07:46:50 AM · #2

I bought the standard DG yesterday.
I paid Â£119.99 from Jessops in the UK. Equates to $210 US.
The super would have been Â£199.99 ($350 US)

I have never shot with this type of flash before, though the test shots I fired off in my kitchen last night (No Flash - On Camera Flash - Sigma Flash) showed excellent results.
I played about with the bounce etc and found that I could achieve some excellent results with practically no shadows, compared to the harsh shadows and Glare (Of the wall tiles) with the standard onboard flash.

Put it onto full power (for manual camera mode - I was in Av priority) and just fired of a shot to see what happend and got a completely white screen. Did the same on the 1/16 power setting and was still mostly white! - God that thing is powerfull!
Looking forward to getting out and giving it a good test now!

03/07/2006 08:07:00 AM · #3

Thats awesome pix-al... looks like youre in the same boat as me with regards to flash experience.

Any reason you didnt go for the super? Money issue?

Tamron AF 28-300mm f/3.5-6.3 XR Di LD Aspherical IF for Canon

03/07/2006 08:12:25 AM · #4

Originally posted by Guyver:

Thats awesome pix-al... looks like youre in the same boat as me with regards to flash experience.

Any reason you didnt go for the super? Money issue?

Yep - Money.

I was looking to buy a used Speedlite on Ebay, but even the lower spec ones were selling for Â£70 to Â£80, so I thought I might aswell spend on a new Sigma...

I needed a good flash as I have recently been asked to do a few bits for people (Fingers crossed - got my first paying gig next week!).

I am new to this like you, so was not prepared to slpash out on a top of the range 580EX!
Maybe I'll upgrade in the future, if I make enough money out of it ;-)

AL.

Message edited by author 2006-03-07 08:12:44.

cheekymunky

Tamron SP AF 28-75mm f/2.8 XR Di for Canon

03/07/2006 08:12:44 AM · #5

I've got the standard DG as well (second hand), Its pretty simple and for the money you cant really go wrong. I want to take mine off camera for macro work (when i get round to it), for this I will use a bracket and Sync-cord from the camera to the flash - I dont have any real need for IR. The only thing I find is that in some situations the metering will be a bit off, in which case I switch the camera over to manual (I usually use AV) and play around till i get it right. If I ever have money burning hole in my pocket (cant see this happening for a while!) I'll get a better flash, but at the moment it suits me fine. With the standard it basically has two modes 'on' and 'off'! with the super I think there are a lot more functions and modes to play with.

Tamron AF 28-300mm f/3.5-6.3 XR Di LD Aspherical IF for Canon

03/07/2006 08:14:13 AM · #6

Originally posted by cheekymunky:

With the standard it basically has two modes 'on' and 'off'! with the super I think there are a lot more functions and modes to play with.

With the ST you get TTL, FUll power and 1/16th power. The super I think you get more control over flash power?

03/07/2006 08:17:40 AM · #7

Thats some really great advice so far guys, thanks.

Now I just need to hear from someone who's got the super :)

03/07/2006 08:21:06 AM · #8

With the ST you get TTL, FUll power and 1/16th power. The super I think you get more control over flash power?

What is this ttl and e-ttl?

Tamron AF 28-300mm f/3.5-6.3 XR Di LD Aspherical IF for Canon

03/07/2006 08:26:11 AM · #9

Originally posted by Guyver:

What is this ttl and e-ttl?

Oooooh - You need to do some research!

Basically, the flash metering is done Through The Lens (TTL).
There are different ways of doing this however. Digital SLRs such as the 350XT have to have an E-TTL compatible flash. otherwise the camera and flash cannot talk to each other to communicate exposure values etc. If you have a non E-TTL flash - it will only work on full manual mode!

Only the Speedlight EX range and some third party flashes specifically designed to cope with E-TTL can be used with the 350XT for example in auto modes...

eschelar

Canon EOS-7D

Canon EF-S 17-55mm f/2.8 IS USM

03/07/2006 08:31:47 AM · #10

E-TTL is a flash metering mode that allows the camera to "read" a scene before firing the flash in a picture.

When you press the shutter, it fires a series of pre-flashes and analyzes the scene. It then checks reflected light throughout the different parts of the picture, especially the focal point(s) and adjusts the flash duration/power to what it feels is appropriate.

It then opens the shutter and begins the normal exposure.

This process takes a very brief moment and I'm not sure, but I don't think it increases shutter lag. I think it's able to use the ordinary shutter lag time. I could be wrong there though.

E-TTL II is a later variant.

E-TTL is considerably older than E-TTL II.

I believe the 300D, 350XT, 20D, and all of the higher current cameras all use E-TTL II.

It's pretty sweet actually.

A friend of mine took a couple hundred pics of people at a wedding quite close-up and used flash undiffused right off the on-body flash on his 300D. The shots universally looked awesome. VERY little in the way of blow-outs in spite of a fair number of greasy foreheads. He's quite tall and usually takes pictures looking down on a face too.

If your flash unit only supports E-TTL, then the camera will detect this and use the older system.

It was a few months ago that I read up on this, but I'm pretty sure it's at least 90% accurate :).

03/07/2006 08:31:50 AM · #11

He he he...

But the 500 dg and super does have E-ttl dont they?

*edit* late post, sorry, got the answer already!

Message edited by author 2006-03-07 08:34:36.

Tamron AF 28-300mm f/3.5-6.3 XR Di LD Aspherical IF for Canon

03/07/2006 08:36:40 AM · #12

Originally posted by Guyver:

He he he...

But the 500 dg and super does have E-ttl dont they?

*edit* late post, sorry, got the answer already!

He he - Yes E-TTL 2 I believe...

Nikon AF-S DX NIKKOR 18-200mm f/3.5-5.6G ED VR II

03/07/2006 08:43:52 AM · #13

Okay, so far I know this...

THe Sigma 500 DG is an excellent flash on a 350D.

But my question still remains...

Would the Super make so much difference in the long run?

Refwhett

Nikon D300

03/07/2006 08:49:22 AM · #14

I have the DG super for the nikon and it is great. The wireless part is not very important to begin with, but as you get more experienced with using flash and different lighting techniques it does become very practical, allowing for much more versatile lighting setups. I guess it really depends on where you wnat to take your photography.

bluenova

Canon EOS-350D Rebel XT

Canon EF-S 18-55mm f/3.5-5.6

03/07/2006 08:51:48 AM · #15

According to my suppliers:

Sigma EF-500 DG ST = Supported Exposure Control - TTL, E-TTL II
Sigma EF-500 DG Super EOS = Supported Exposure Control - TTL, E-TTL

Tamron AF 28-300mm f/3.5-6.3 XR Di LD Aspherical IF for Canon

03/07/2006 08:54:45 AM · #16

Originally posted by Guyver:

Also... 'off-camera?' Do you like... hold it in your hand?

This is where the wireless would come into play. You can basically sit the flash on a tripod and operate it wirelessly (with a transmitter I presume?) and use it as a kind of Studio flash. Would work well for portraits etc.

I personally can't see me doing this at the moment, so it is not a problem for me to go with the Standard version.

eschelar

Canon EOS-7D

Canon EF-S 17-55mm f/2.8 IS USM

03/07/2006 08:59:12 AM · #17

Links to check the specs:

Sigma 500 DG ST

... or here

Sigma 500 DG Super

They both appear to have E-TTL II.

Primary differences appear in this portion of the description of the Super:

For bounce flash it can be tilted 90Â° upwards and 7Â° downward for close-ups. Also it can be swiveled 180Â° to the left and 90Â° to the right. It incorporates "modeling flash" mode to provide proper light distribution to check the shadow of the subject. The multi pulse flash features enable reduced power setting from 1/4 to 1/128 in 6 steps and the pulse frequency of the flash can be set from 1Hz to 199Hz. EF-500 DG SUPER incorporates wireless TTL flash photography, slave flash photography, and FP flash photography (synchronized with high shutter speeds). In addition, manual flash also can be set at 8 output power levels. The covering focal length of the flashlight can be seen on the LCD panel, and a flash ready signal can be seen in the viewfinder. The EF-500 DG SUPER also incorporates auto power off system.

If it were me, I'd pay the extra. It's still a little over half the cost of the 580EX.

At this point, I'm not even sure what the 580EX does that the Sig 500 super doesn't that has much application to anything but the most specialized work.

PS. FWIW, I've used a slave flash on a tripod with my little P&S. It's pretty useful in some situations, but generally kinda so-so.

Edit. Bluenova, click the link for the Sigma Super above and then call your suppliers and tell them to sharpen their pencils. That's the Sigma website.

Message edited by author 2006-03-07 09:11:18.

bluenova

Canon EOS-350D Rebel XT

Canon EF-S 18-55mm f/3.5-5.6

03/07/2006 09:07:10 AM · #18

Originally posted by eschelar:

Yea, that's strange cause my suppliers say E-TTL for the Super not E-TTL II, I will check with them.

Mr_Pants

SiPix Blink

03/07/2006 09:19:40 AM · #19

The FP mode (high speed synch mode) is very useful. If you want to use a fairly wide aperture for a portrait, using the flash to fill in in quite bright daylight, then your shutter speed would be quite high. Normal X-synch for a 350D is 1/250 I think, and you would not be able to get the shutter speed faster than that with the flash switched on without FP mode engaged, as it could not synchronise with the shutter. One annoying trick of the Sigma, however, is that it automatically cancels FP mode when the shutter speed drops below the X-synch speed, something that the 580EX does not do.