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03/06/2006 05:45:30 AM · #1 |
What would constitute as a good all-round lens for a wedding?
I'm kinda stuck with my 18-55mm kit lens (not fond of the manual focussing on it at all)
And I'm getting a 50mm 1.8 soon.
Obviously, money is an issue.
Canon or Sigma - I dont mind.
THanks! |
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03/06/2006 06:08:38 AM · #2 |
You will hear this quite a lot, but if you really cant afford the Canon 24 - 70 F2.8 L then the logical choice is the Tamron equivalent, the 28-75 f2.8. Sharpness, contrast and overall image quality is slightly lower than the Canon equivalent, but for less than half the price of the Canon is really is the best lens you can buy if you are on a budget. I have shot a couple of wedding with it and it really does perform well.
Thats not to say I wouldnt LIKE the Canon 24-70mm :-)
Message edited by author 2006-03-06 07:20:55. |
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03/06/2006 06:38:01 AM · #3 |
Just phoned around, nobody recognises the 25-70mm Canon?
This guy said the Sigma 28-70mm is also not bad in that kinda range?
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03/06/2006 06:45:25 AM · #4 |
Sorry for double post,
But how about a Sigma 18-200mm (3.5)?
I'm just thinking in the long run - post wedding - how this could benefit me?
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03/06/2006 07:21:51 AM · #5 |
Originally posted by Guyver:
Just phoned around, nobody recognises the 25-70mm Canon?
This guy said the Sigma 28-70mm is also not bad in that kinda range? |
Sorry, I meant Canon 24 - 70 f2.8
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03/06/2006 07:43:40 AM · #6 |
Thanks for the help!!
Can anyone please comment on the 18-200mm Sigma for wedding and general all-round use?
Would really appreciate it.
;o) |
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03/06/2006 08:15:21 AM · #7 |
| Ask yourself this question. What do you shoot most of the time??? The 24-70 2.8L is a fantastic lens with good range. Then you can complete your collection with something a little bigger. |
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03/06/2006 08:19:02 AM · #8 |
Originally posted by Guyver:
Thanks for the help!!
Can anyone please comment on the 18-200mm Sigma for wedding and general all-round use?
Would really appreciate it.
;o) |
Usually, the 10X zooms have a lot more compromises in design than in zooms with a lesser range. Personally, I'd avoid them unless there was NO other option.
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03/06/2006 08:20:09 AM · #9 |
Its difficult to answer because I am still experimenting with everything it seems.
From Macro attempts to long shots, to action to... literally anything.
I cant afford the 24-70 Canon, but I can afford the 28-70 EX Sigma. (Seems pretty much the same?)
Yet, for that price I can buy the Sigma 18-200mm as well as the Canon 50mm 1.8.
So two good lenses, or one very good one?
But the big question is, would I be able to pull off the wedding with the Sigma and the canon option?
(Bear in mind I'll also have my kit lens) |
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03/06/2006 08:22:23 AM · #10 |
Every lens is a compromise - speed (large aperture), cost, optic quality, lenth of zoom, etc). To get a $400 10X zoom there are a lot of compromises in optical quality and speed (that is a 3.5-6.3 lens - canon says only their 1D line of camera will autofocus with a base ap of 5.6 or smaller - so in theory your camera won't autofocus at the 180mm+ range of that lens)
As for what is the best wedding lens, alot depends on you and your style. Photography is about LIGHT, and weddings don't have much of it LOL. SOOO, you can do the high ISO natural light and go for big glass (2.8 or faster) or you can add light, aka flash. I know of a couple of wedding photographers that use lots of flash and canon's 28-200 or even the 18-200 lens. I fyou ahve lots of light then fast glass is not super important. Acccurate focus always is. For outdoor weddings it is much easier in some ways (more light) but that often makes it worse too- too much sun, or harsh shadows or ugly backgrounds on one side, etc.
I shot a wedding 2 weeks ago with a Tamron 24-135 SP 3.5-5.6 lens. Worked great. I used flash and it gave me near and far without swapping lenses - great at the reception. I have used a sigma 18-50 2.8 at times too - nice and wide, and at 2.8 i can take some pics (at ISO800) without flash. Not long enough reach if you get more than 30 feet away. The tamron 28-75 2.8 is very popular too, but you'll need a wider lens (tokina 12-24 f4 is a good choice). the 50 1.8 is a good choice as well.
Now if it is a big church, you'll need a 70-200 2.8 or other 150mm type lens that is fast. a 70-300 4-5.6 ain't gonna cut it. Some churches let you use flash, some do not, and many won't during the ceremony.
If you're shooting your sisters wedding and don't care much, go for it. If you are getting paid, any amount, you are technicall a professional and if you screw it up, they won't have the wedding again. They may sue you, sister or not. If nothing else, you're name will be mud.
SO to avoid that, learn t shoot and process RAW - it give you 2 more stops of light. Get a 580EX flash NOT the 550. YOu need eTTL-2 and preferably a backup (borrowed, rented) and LOTS of batteries (4 to 5 sets - these can be disposiables). Get a lightsphere2 for it. Have 2 or 3 camera batteries. have a backup camera! Even a film body if you trust yourself with film.
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03/06/2006 08:22:52 AM · #11 |
Usually, the 10X zooms have a lot more compromises in design than in zooms with a lesser range. Personally, I'd avoid them unless there was NO other option.
Sigh. I was afraid of that. |
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03/06/2006 08:32:11 AM · #12 |
Now if it is a big church, you'll need a 70-200 2.8 or other 150mm type lens that is fast. a 70-300 4-5.6 ain't gonna cut it. Some churches let you use flash, some do not, and many won't during the ceremony.
If you're shooting your sisters wedding and don't care much, go for it. If you are getting paid, any amount, you are technicall a professional and if you screw it up, they won't have the wedding again. They may sue you, sister or not. If nothing else, you're name will be mud.
SO to avoid that, learn t shoot and process RAW - it give you 2 more stops of light. Get a 580EX flash NOT the 550. YOu need eTTL-2 and preferably a backup (borrowed, rented) and LOTS of batteries (4 to 5 sets - these can be disposiables). Get a lightsphere2 for it. Have 2 or 3 camera batteries. have a backup camera! Even a film body if you trust yourself with film.
I have done some weddings before, so I kinda know what i'm doing. Have to admit, only one as an "official" photographer where I used my friends pentax Film camera and shot on full auto. (Was a bit nervous)
As for processing RAW - i'm pretty good with that already. And getting sued is not an option in this country really... :)
But now, with two more lined up this year (for which I am getting paid) the stakes are raised - even if they are friends.
Was thinking of getting a Sigma 500 DG flash? Is that alright?
It is bottom of the range I think?
I havent had a flash unit yet, so it's all new ground for me...
Anyhow, I suppose looking at my situation now, it might still be better to go for the 28-70mm 2.8 Sigma then? |
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03/06/2006 08:53:11 AM · #13 |
I hear good things about the sigma 500 flash. having paid weddings gives ou the money to buy equipment. being a paid wedding photographer is a business and for any business you need the right equipment/tools to do a good job.
perhaps i could fix your car with a one screwdriver, one wrench and a hammer. But i bet i could do a better job with a compete tool kit. They need not be the best tools money can buy, but those last longer and make it easier to do the job.
I decided last march to make money with my camrera - most as a wedding photographer. I got a flash (metz 54 MZ4 used), and the sigma 18-50 2.8 (new off ebay), I loaded the hack in to my rebel (free). I practiced. What mode works for me (Av and M)? What flash mode, modifiers, etc work for me? (metz in A mode mostly with the lightsphere mostly). THere is very little time at a wedding to think, and NO time to re-do. The happy couple may kiss for 30 seconds, or 1/2 second - you are expected to get that shot. You are a pro, not Uncle harry. Same for the garter, bouquet etc. This is not as easy as it sounds, believe me. I have not missed a kiss yet, but i have missed pics waiting for the flash to recycle - one reason i like Av mode.
I have a lumedyne strobe (battery powered) but without a radio trigger it does me little good. cheap trigger are worthless...a pocket wizard is on the needs list, but that brings other issues (my rebel and metz both lack PC sockets, the wizard sits on the hot shoe or via PC cord..can't get it all to work at once...)
I have a 70-210 2.8 tamron i got cheap used and i love it. The last wedding was in too small a church to use it.
This year's weddings are paying for a 30D. I have an old back up flash if i need it. i hope i never do. I guess i should get another flash...if i book another wedding then i'll spring for it!
SO my plan for running 2 bodies is - i don't know. One thought is 30D with 18-50 2.8 and rebel with 70-210. But where to put the flahs, and that 70-210 is large and heavy, no fun to carry.
Perhaps the 30D gets the tamron 24-135 and flash, the rebel get the 18-50 / 50 1.8/70-200 as hte needs arise and no flash.
See, more equipment does not make it easier LOL
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03/06/2006 09:03:31 AM · #14 |
But i bet i could do a better job with a compete tool kit.
The trick is which tools to buy... :)
Oh, and no need to tell me about the pressures of getting the right "moments".
I kinda thrive on it. |
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03/07/2006 01:51:44 AM · #15 |
Some tools are basic needs, and (to continue the car analagy) you pretty much need combination wrenches and sockets in SAE and metric. You can do the work with craftsman, cornwell, mac, matco or snap-on. Most agree snapons are the best - in quality and feel. but you pay more for them.
You can perhaps replace a water pump with those tools. but having deep and shallow sockets, long and short ratchets, fine tooth ratchets for tight spaces, ratcheting box end wrenches etc will make the job go quicker, easier (less busted knuckles or rounded fasteners).
Car tools are easier - especially if you work ina shop with other mechanics - you get feedback on what you need, and why, and which brand is best and if it even matters. you can borrow tools and try them out too. Anybody can turn a wrench, but knowing what needs fixed is perhaps more important.
photography is so much more personal in regards to style and ego. You still need a minimum of tools thought, and the person still matters most - anyone can push the shutter button, but not everyone can take a good photo.
I have found that as my equipment improves so do my photographs. I expect to get better with my 30D - it has a few features I know i can use to get shots i now can't.
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03/07/2006 02:18:24 AM · #16 |
Prof has a point there with the wide end of things. I'd go with his recommendations (and that Sigma 500 with a lightsphere).
Just some anecodotal advice from others' experiences.
A friend of mine got married a weekend ago and a friend of mine shot tons of people at the wedding. He didn't take a lot of pics of the bride and groom, but he did some amazing posed pics of people at the reception.
Low light in the extreme.
He used the 18-55 and on-camera flash.
Shooting RAW helped with keeping highlights.
Shooting Asians helped prevent excessive blowout (Asians don't usually have very oily/sweaty faces, so reflect less light than typical whiteys like me).
My downstairs roommate used to shoot weddings in Vancouver and he used the 85mm f/1.8 and 80-200 f/2.8L (now mine :). I think he also has a 24-70 which he is NOT going to sell to me, cheap or otherwise. :)
He used a Metz flash with an external Battery pack. He said that he could cycle that flash back up to ready in less than a second.
I personally missed their kiss because someone stood up in front of me and I had to dodge and shoot. Their kiss was in the 1/2 second range.
Good thing I was only there as a friend, not as a shooter. :) |
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03/07/2006 02:30:24 AM · #17 |
You say Sigma 500, with a 'lightsphere'...
Whats a lightsphere? |
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03/07/2006 03:10:29 AM · #18 |
I have the Sigma 18-200 & I have shot a couple weddings. This lense is not that great UNLESS you have no problem using your flash all the time. I do not like flash as it takes most of the shadows out of the photo.
So, I find that I often use my Canon 50mm f1.8 & my Sigma 105mm Macro f2.8. They both do a good job. I am currently looking at the Canon 135mm f2.8 soft focus, an obsure lense with a great rating for sharpness. The soft focus can be turned on & off and the lense is only around $275. the other lense is the Canon 85mm f1.8 for around $325.
For weddings, the need for a lense that does well in low light and the Sigma 18-200 will not get you there.
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03/07/2006 03:19:02 AM · #19 |
Thank you aquapreta!!
You say its not good in low light, and for weddings which I can understand, but overall as a lens to play around with?
Would you recommend it?
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03/07/2006 06:50:20 AM · #20 |
For someone starting out, buying the first equipment can be a kind of a challenge.
About two years ago at my best friend wedding I saw such a bad job of a suppoed pro photographer that I tought that I could do a lot better than that. So in the beggining of last year me and a friend started to plan in doing weddings. Stablish how much to spend and what to buy. At the end of last year he jumped out and I followed my fream alone, with the bills to pay and all the equipment. If I was starting now knowing what I know now I would change all my lens except the nikkor 50mm f1.8.
I would buy a 12-24mm sigma or nikon (becase the 18-70mm kit lens is not not bat but isn't wide enough for the group shoots and for inside litle homes), the sigma 30mm f1.4, keep the 50mm f1.8 and change my 70-300mm for a 70-200 f2.8
The tamron or sigma or other in the 24-70 range at f2.8 are good for sharpness but not great for the most low light situations like dark churches. With this conditions the f1.8 is the minimum for good exposure but is very demanding in pin pint focus because dof will be very litle.
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03/07/2006 07:17:34 AM · #21 |
Shot, thanks Nuno!
How is the photography business going now that your friend has pulled out?
I had a look at the Sigma 24-60mm EX today, I think I am definately gonna buy that one!
I'm afraid I wont be able to go any wider than 24mm then, so i'm gonna have to make do with what I have... |
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03/07/2006 08:22:17 AM · #22 |
| I usually shoot weddings, (and Quinceaneras), with a Tamron 28-75 f2.8 on one camera and a Canon 70-200 f2.8L on the other camera. Mostly try to go with natural light, but use a Canon 580ex with Lightsphere2 when necessary. The results with these 2 lenses have been great- they cover every range we have ever needed. |
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03/07/2006 08:38:36 AM · #23 |
Google Lightsphere. It's considered by most people to be indispensible.
It's definitely worth considering renting a second body if that's an option. If there are any rental agencies near you, it would be a great idea to rent a decent body with a 70-200 anything (canon, nikon, tamron, sigma) that has a constant f/2.8 aperture.
From what I hear, the Tamron 28-75 trumps all else in that range amongst the third party lenses (Sigma, Tokina, whatever). Sharpness, contrast and build quality considered.
If not, hrmph.
PS. There's no rental agencies around Taiwan that I've been able to find either.
Message edited by author 2006-03-07 08:40:59. |
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03/07/2006 09:19:53 AM · #24 |
Originally posted by Guyver:
Shot, thanks Nuno!
How is the photography business going now that your friend has pulled out?
I had a look at the Sigma 24-60mm EX today, I think I am definately gonna buy that one!
I'm afraid I wont be able to go any wider than 24mm then, so i'm gonna have to make do with what I have... |
I've shoot in some bride's home (bride with gests tipe of photos) that the only way I could fit everyone in the picute was cimbimg up in to the couch and shoot from there. So be able to go wide is very important. at least to me. But I'm in a different country and probably homes are from diferent sizes.
I also love to have 2 bodys, one with the 18-70mm and the other with the tele or the 50mm f.1.8
and yes, get the best flash you can buy. For two reasons. If your flash works great in auto it's one thing less you have to be worryed about (my sb800 does all the calculations and corrections for me). Secondly for power. High power means that you can use you flash better. for example in a very beautifull sky or sunset you want to keep the sky withought blown out. So you meter on the sky, use the ae button to lock exposure, compose and focus properly and the flahs will fill-in your subjerct. If you have a poor flash it will not have the power to fill in in bright backgrounds. And don't be afraind to use hight iso and fill-in flahs in low light. This way you capture the ambience and expose correctly your subject.
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03/07/2006 11:21:21 AM · #25 |
Originally posted by Guyver:
Thank you aquapreta!!
You say its not good in low light, and for weddings which I can understand, but overall as a lens to play around with?
Would you recommend it? |
I would highly recommend it... for $300 there is no lense that is as versatile... check the Sigma 18-200 page. |
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