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01/30/2006 10:52:56 PM · #1 |
I recently had to shoot a high school gymnastics meet and I need some help. I have never been so lost in my photographic endeavors. I do not know very much about gymnastics except that the gyms tend to have horrible lighting and they do not allow flash. So basically I was wondering if any of you who have experience shooting gymnastics could help me out with where to shoot from, what to shoot, or any other tips you may have.
Message edited by author 2006-01-30 22:54:05. |
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01/30/2006 11:04:53 PM · #2 |
I've shot a couple of gymnastics meets for younger girls, and you can see some of my stuff HERE
The problem I faced was not being able to get onto the main floor to get into any positions, but I found that the key was to keep moving, look for good angles, and try not to get where the athletes are moving towards or away from you very often (unless you want a shot like that for artistic purposes), as the low light can render the AF a little useless.
I shot primarily in ISO 1600 to give my shutter speed a boost, and you'll want to stick to a minimum of 1/250 sec. With the 20D, you should even be able to go to ISO 3200 with no real problems. If you have one, take a nice fast zoom lens with you, and may a good midrange or a fast prime in the 35 - 50mm range. You're not going to be changing lenses a lot though, so I'd say stick primarily to something like a 70-200mm.. but it all depends on where you can shoot from.. every gym will be different. (so, actually, just bring all the lenses you have if you can. lol).
As for what to shoot, that's extremely dependant on who you're shooting, what you're looking for, and what, if anything, you'll be publishing. Good close-ups of action work very well, and it's nice to try and stop-motion some of the moves, which takes a good amount of timing. Your 5fps burst will help in this.. use it! Also try and get some expressions and candids, don't just focus on the action.
Anyway.. that's all I have to add. I'm no pro of course, and I only shoot for fun, but most of that is what I find works for me. |
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01/30/2006 11:09:17 PM · #3 |
Based on the gyms I've shot at you'll need to
-shoot at 2.8 or faster
-shoot at 1/320 or faster
-shoot at 1000 iso or faster
my usual settings tend to be 2.8 1/320 at iso 1600... that's with a D1H though and I know the newer canons ISO 1000 is like nikons old iso1600.
70-200 is the focal length youll probably want.
i usually have better luck with incandescent fine tune -2 white balance, than I do with a custom setting. Again this is for my older D1H. |
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01/30/2006 11:21:25 PM · #4 |
Of the lenses you show on your profile page I'd say that the 50mm f1.4 is your best bet. If you can get close enough you'll be OK but if not, prepare to do a lot of cropping. If you are good at picking when to shoot there are moments in gymnastics when the action is slowed almost to a stop so then you can use a slower shutter speed.
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01/30/2006 11:25:36 PM · #5 |
Originally posted by coolhar:
Of the lenses you show on your profile page I'd say that the 50mm f1.4 is your best bet. If you can get close enough you'll be OK but if not, prepare to do a lot of cropping. If you are good at picking when to shoot there are moments in gymnastics when the action is slowed almost to a stop so then you can use a slower shutter speed. |
Problem with cropping is that, even with the 50mm f/1.4, you'll rarely be using the aperature open that large, and you'll still need to use higher ISOs in all likelihood, and the noise levels on a large crop will be more severe. It's a good idea to have this lens.. but from experience, a 50mm prime is extremely tough to shoot with unless you are allowed full range of the gym floor. |
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01/31/2006 12:06:06 AM · #6 |
Originally posted by Artyste:
Problem with cropping is that, even with the 50mm f/1.4, you'll rarely be using the aperature open that large, and you'll still need to use higher ISOs in all likelihood, and the noise levels on a large crop will be more severe. It's a good idea to have this lens.. but from experience, a 50mm prime is extremely tough to shoot with unless you are allowed full range of the gym floor. |
He said the gym had "horrible lighting". the 50mm is the only fast lens he has. A 85mm f1.8, a 135 f2, or even a 70-200 f2.8 would be better but he didn't ask for advice on buying a new lens. Cropping won't be a problem if he can move freely; otherwise it's his best alternative with the arsenel he has listed on his profile page.
Message edited by author 2006-01-31 00:10:25.
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01/31/2006 12:08:10 AM · #7 |
Originally posted by coolhar:
Originally posted by Artyste:
Problem with cropping is that, even with the 50mm f/1.4, you'll rarely be using the aperature open that large, and you'll still need to use higher ISOs in all likelihood, and the noise levels on a large crop will be more severe. It's a good idea to have this lens.. but from experience, a 50mm prime is extremely tough to shoot with unless you are allowed full range of the gym floor. |
He said the gym had "horrible lighting" and that 50 is the only fast lens he has. A 85mm f1.8, a 135 f2, or even a 70-200 f2.8 would be better but he didn't ask for advice on buying a new lens. Cropping won't be a problem is he can move freely; otherwise it's his best alternative with the arsenel he has listed on his profile page. |
He said the gyms *tend* to have horrible lighting.
However, I agree the 50mm should be in his bag and put to use if needed. The 70-200mm f/4 however, *should* be enough for most instances. I've had good success with f/4-5.6 |
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01/31/2006 12:25:16 AM · #8 |
I haven't shot any gymnastics, only basketball and volleyball indoors. Maybe the action is that much slower. But I don't think serious sports photographers consider f4 fast enough for indoor shooting with no flash. Even if you can get your shutter speed up enough to stop the action by going to a high ISO you will still be sacrifacing the highly desirable shallow depth of field needed to isolate an athlete, in this case a gymnast, from the background which tends to be closer in HS venues.
Mstark24, you might try checking the forums at SportsShooter.com for some advice from photographers more experienced in what you are trying to do.
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01/31/2006 12:27:08 AM · #9 |
Originally posted by coolhar:
I haven't shot any gymnastics, only basketball and volleyball indoors. Maybe the action is that much slower. But I don't think serious sports photographers consider f4 fast enough for indoor shooting with no flash. Even if you can get your shutter speed up enough to stop the action by going to a high ISO you will still be sacrifacing the highly desirable shallow depth of field needed to isolate an athlete, in this case a gymnast, from the background which tends to be closer in HS venues.
Mstark24, you might try checking the forums at SportsShooter.com for some advice from photographers more experienced in what you are trying to do. |
Oh, it's much easier to isolate a gymnast, they're always alone. and usually quite far from the background/crowds. I agree with you though, if I was shooting gymnastics for a newspaper or publishing of any kind, I wouldn't shoot with anything over 2.8 at all.
I'm still unsure as to whether this shoot is for fun or for something more. |
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01/31/2006 12:49:58 AM · #10 |
i cant imagine shooting f4 for this kind of thing.
if you actually have the light to shoot comfortably at 1.8 , or 2.8, the next thing I would do is lower my ISO. |
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01/31/2006 01:12:08 AM · #11 |
One of my favorite sports photographers is Dave Black, he has shot some great Olympic gymnastic shots. On his web site he talks about preparation for the shot. There isn't anything on gymnastics specifically, but looking at his stuff is inspiring.
Look for the quiet moments, the still points before and after the leaps. It is tempting to go for the high action shot, but you better plan for blur, and make that work for you. That momentary pause has more personlity anyway, and makes better shots. |
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01/31/2006 10:02:54 AM · #12 |
| The shooting I have been doing is paid work which is contracted through my school and an outside photographer for our yearbook and newspaper |
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01/31/2006 12:18:25 PM · #13 |
Get a lens - one of the ones for sale in this thread. You need a 70-200 2.8 type of lens.
Here are some available light shots in a gymnastics environment i took with the Tamron SP70-210  And yes, the blurred action in the last frame was intentional.
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01/31/2006 12:40:17 PM · #14 |
Whew, Dave Black's work is stunning.
Only sport I have shot indoors is basketball, and I can't imagine myself shooting anything slower than 2.8. No way. My Tamron 28-75/2.8 at ISO 1600 gives me barely fast enough shutter speed to stop motion. MF Nikkor 50/2.0 is my second option, but I usually decide on AF rather than a bit faster shutter speed. |
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01/31/2006 01:10:26 PM · #15 |
| maybe its just that we have good lighting in our gyms around here for basketball, but ive been using my f 4 for two years and it works great although I do complement it with the 50 1.4 |
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01/31/2006 01:30:54 PM · #16 |
| Yeah that might be the case, I guess Finland isn't really comparable to US when we're talking about basketball (=> gyms). ;) I've tried my MF Nikkor 200/4.0 but it just isn't fast enough. Well, let's say the bottom line is "use as fast lenses as you can afford". :> |
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01/31/2006 09:23:54 PM · #17 |
I'm surprised that a f4 lens is fast enough. But if it is, then you can use that.
I started shooting High School soccer at night with stadium lighting and use my 70-200 f2.8 at f2.8 with ISO 800-1600. Shutter speed tends to be around 1/200 or slightly less for me. Lastly, I use the auto advance.
I also use AI servo with Center focus point only to make the AF work as fast as possible. There is a custom function no. 1 for AF/AE button that allows the AE button to focus and the shutter button to release the shutter release. This way I place my thumb over the AE Lock button to activate the AI Servo AF and when I want to I release the shutter with the index finger.
Lastly, if you know the sport, you can anticipate the photogenic moments to prepare your shots as well.
Good luck
Message edited by author 2006-01-31 21:24:59.
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