VOIP - Vonage versus Cogeco - DPChallenge Forums

Tamron SP AF 28-75mm f/2.8 XR Di for Canon

01/06/2006 03:38:41 PM · #1

I've had VOIP telephone for about five months now, at two different homes, through the same cable co., Cogeco. I was hoping the poor quality at our first house was due to location, but the same poor quality has followed us to our new home & new modem so I'm going to cancel it. We lose connection for a few seconds every once in a while, very annoying.

I'd prefer to give Vonage's VOIP a try rather than jumping straight back to Bell's POTS.

I've had Cogeco's cable Internet ever since they first offered it, and they had a rough year or so getting it right, so I assume they're having the same issues learning how to properly offer VOIP. Their cable Internet service is very good now. I have the 5Mbps down, 640Kbps up service, very fast and quite reliable from what I can tell.

====== Here's my question =======

Do you think my VOIP issues might be solved by moving to Vonage, or are they likely caused by the Internet connection?

My brother has used Vonage for a while now, but I think his service might not be so great either.

DjFenzl

01/06/2006 03:47:43 PM · #2

I've been using ViaTalk for about 6 months now and have been pretty happy with them. I have a cable modem so my speeds are pretty good, voice quality is very good. I also like being able to get my voice mail e-mailed to me in wav files.

I have Adelphia for my cable Internet provider and can say with confidence THEY SUCK. My Internet connection crashes all the time. Anyway one night my Internet went down and due to a glitch with the expense reporting system at my work my cell phone was shut off. Because it was a "soft disconnect" on my cell phone I could still get crappy 56K Internet on it (it's a PDA too). So I hooked my cell phone up to my computer and used it as a modem - I was then able to call out and talk to my wife using ViaTalk and my crappy 56K connection. I was VERY impressed and would definitely recommend them. They have really good prices too.

Canon EOS-20D

01/06/2006 03:51:08 PM · #3

I such took a look at the Cogeco website. Are you paying $45/mo for VOIP?

Ombra_foto

Olympus E-300 EVOLT

Olympus 40-150mm f/3.5-4.5 Zuiko Digital

01/06/2006 03:54:56 PM · #4

I've been using Vonage for over a year now. I'm on WOW cable and NOT at the highest speed with two computers and phone ran through it.
I was amazed when I set it up that the sound was clearer than I had with the old POTS line.
Two months after I got it, I put one of my daughters on it.
Never had a complaint as long as internet was running.

hankk

Sigma 24-70mm f/2.8 EX Aspherical DF for Canon

01/06/2006 04:04:29 PM · #5

Try //www.testYourVoIP.com to see if your internet connection supports VoIP.

Try the speed test at //www.dslreports.com/tools to insure that you are getting the speed you think you should be.

Finally, check out //www.voiptroubleshooter.com/ There's a lot more to VoIP Quality of Service (QOS) than bandwidth. Delay and jitter matter quite a bit. The codec used matters (and the Packet Loss Correction the codec uses matters).

Since you've discussed routers, I'll get a little more technical :-)
Run a protocol analyzer (I use packetizer, which is a Windows port of Ethereal) and see what the IP address the RTP packets are being sent to. Then run a tracert to that address (I use Blighty Design's "Sam Spade" tool). You shouldn't have more than 100 mSec or so of delay, and the delay on several tries should be about the same.

01/06/2006 04:07:02 PM · #6

Originally posted by mk:

I such took a look at the Cogeco website. Are you paying $45/mo for VOIP?

yup, Canadian $. Vonage would be $40 for the same package.

Tamron SP AF 28-75mm f/2.8 XR Di for Canon

01/06/2006 04:16:58 PM · #7

Originally posted by hankk:

I've done plenty of speed tests, Cogeco is very fast. I can't control any of the VOIP settings, certainly not the codec. I'm pretty much "black-boxed" by Cogeco. :-(

I've run lots of tracerts from inside to outside the Cogeco network, and pings are very fast, 10ms or so, if memory serves. I haven't done one recently though. I will tonight. I'll take a look at voiptroubleshooter this weekend, thanks for the link.

Canon EOS-20D

01/06/2006 04:19:58 PM · #8

Originally posted by Strikeslip:

Originally posted by mk:
I such took a look at the Cogeco website. Are you paying $45/mo for VOIP?

yup, Canadian $. Vonage would be $40 for the same package.

You've got a lot of phone needs then! ;)

We've been using the $15US plan for about 7 months now and I love it. Zero problems. But I have no idea if it's your cable service or not, sorry.

01/06/2006 04:30:04 PM · #9

Originally posted by mk:

You've got a lot of phone needs then! ;)

Hehe, my wife, go figure. :-D And I've got two chatty little girls, so the minutes are only going to increase. :-O

hankk

Sigma 24-70mm f/2.8 EX Aspherical DF for Canon

01/06/2006 05:28:18 PM · #10

Originally posted by Strikeslip:

I've done plenty of speed tests, Cogeco is very fast. I can't control any of the VOIP settings, certainly not the codec. I'm pretty much "black-boxed" by Cogeco. :-(

I had a similar experience with Lingo. I told thier support group about //www.testyourvoip.com and they liked it. I called a month or two later, and they told me to try //www.testyourvoip.com! :-)

If Cogneco is serious about VoIP, they will improve, but they need to know that you're experiencing a problem. And providers don't always believe what customer's say because the provider uses the wrong metrics (e.g. ping time, delay and jitter as defined in RTCP) when the should be using something like RTCP-XR.

If you can't find what you need on the web, or you're really interested in this stuff, PM me.

DigiFotoBuddy

Canon EOS-5D Mark III

Canon EF 17-40mm f/4.0L USM

01/06/2006 05:36:40 PM · #11

I had the same problem of loosing connection internet connection with Lingo. I blamed Lingo and then my cable company, and at last here is what I found....

Wireless computer network was having problem with the 2.4 GHZ wireless phone. Everytime there is incoming call, my internet connection will reset. See if someone else same problem. Solution is to disable the wireless network if you are not using. Or upgrade to 5.8 GHZ phone.

Prof_Fate

01/06/2006 06:05:45 PM · #12

I have comcast cable and Vonage for 6 months now.
No problem 99% of the time, and that other 1% is me - i have issues with quality if i am uploading a lot of stuff while on the phone ( like Mb's of photos)

I have a Uniden 5.8mhz cordless and it is FANTASTIC.

The other issues i have notices: I could not get Bell Atlantic to release my old number, so i had to get a new one.
No matter how i set the time on Vonage, my caller id reads california time (i live in PA)
Lately (3 or 4 weeks now) the message waiting light is not 100% releiable, nor does it turn off at times after i have deleted a message.

But for $27 a month, unlimited everything and all the toys (most of which i never use anyway) i am quite satisfied. Bell sucked me $75 a month and i had few toys (and not the ones i wanted)

Canon EOS-20D

Tamron SP AF 28-75mm f/2.8 XR Di for Canon

01/06/2006 06:12:41 PM · #13

Originally posted by Prof_Fate:

Lately (3 or 4 weeks now) the message waiting light is not 100% releiable, nor does it turn off at times after i have deleted a message.

How does the message waiting light thing work - are you using a machine or is the light somehow hooked up to your voicemail? Just curious. I have mine set up to email me when I get a voicemail and then I just listen to it online. I'm much more likely to check my email than check my voicemail. :)

rex

Canon PowerShot SD780

01/06/2006 06:55:04 PM · #14

I just signed up for Vonage a few weeks ago and it is great. You can set your bandwidth if you want. Maybe that will help you make a decision. Slippy if you want pm me and I will giove you my number and you can call it and listen to the quality. I am on Adelphia internet though.

psychephylax

Canon EOS-5D Mark III

Canon EF 28-135mm f/3.5-5.6 IS USM

01/06/2006 07:04:51 PM · #15

As someone who works in the VoIP world....

You are better off on working closely with Cogeco in determining what the problem is because if you had it before and it had issues and you're having issues still in a different location, others are having problems too.

My guess is that your underlying problem is caused by Cogeco and switching to Vonage won't fix it.

It can also be caused by your habits...Do you download while talking?

MWitt

Tokina AF 28-70mm f/2.8 ATX Pro-SV for Canon EOS

01/06/2006 07:10:24 PM · #16

We use these guys and we are really happy with our service. Cheap at $16.60 a month. Excellent quality, even during downloading.
SunRocket
Get two free phones with this service. No long distance charges in the US.

Message edited by author 2006-01-06 19:11:35.

Dr.Confuser

Nikon D800

Nikon AF-S NIKKOR 24-70mm f/2.8G ED

01/06/2006 09:17:53 PM · #17

I have listened carefully to several VOIP pitches. In the end, I am going to wait (perhaps a long) while before switching. Why?

* VOIP from available providers is more expensive than POTS. Why pay more?
* IP service is not as reliably available as POTS. What do you or those calling you do if the "internet is out?"
* Voice quality on available VOIP services is poorer than POTS. Why pay more for less?
* The VIOP providers have not nailed the 911 issues to my satisfaction. What if their database is incorrect and your 911 call sends the ambulance to the wrong place?

I tend to be an early adopter, but in this case, I don't see it as worth the risks and added costs at this point. Maybe others who have access to more reliable internet services and VOIP at lower costs would make a different decision. Before you switch, do your homework on the above.

At this point I would recommend it only to those who would be tolerant of the issues and willing to devote serious time to making it work. Sadly, I fit neither criteria.

psychephylax

Canon EOS-5D Mark III

Canon EF 28-135mm f/3.5-5.6 IS USM

01/06/2006 10:48:53 PM · #18

Originally posted by Digital Quixote:

* Voice quality on available VOIP services is poorer than POTS. Why pay more for less?

At this point I would recommend it only to those who would be tolerant of the issues and willing to devote serious time to making it work. Sadly, I fit neither criteria.

I agree on all the other points but the voice quality one is debatable. VoIP runs on your broadband connection, if your broadband connection is poor your voice service will be poor, the quality of your broadband connection is determined by how well your ISP maintains & upgrades their infrastructure. So to say that all VoIP has worse quality than POTS is incorrect, in my opinion.

As for "willing to devote serious time to making it work..." that's not correct either. The Operations and Engineering are the ones who spend serious time to make it work and make it work well. The Customer simply plugs in their MTA (voice capable cable modem in our case) and plugs in the phone in the back.

hankk