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11/16/2005 02:38:19 PM · #1 |
Greetings more knowledgeable than I DPC'ers,
My wife is in the process of repainting one of our bathrooms, and we've come to slight disagreement on what to do with the molding at the top of the wall where it meets the ceiling. The ceiling is textured / bumpy and a creamish/white. We are wondering would it be better to leave this piece of molding white, or to paint it the same color as the trim in the room? If we end up painting it, its going to have to be removed then refastened as I dont think there is a way to tape the textured ceiling.
Thanks for any advice / opinions
Mike
//www.mikefairbanks.com
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11/16/2005 02:40:32 PM · #2 |
Most of the time the crown molding is painted with the rest of the trim in the room. But, painting it with the ceiling may work for you.
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11/16/2005 02:43:23 PM · #3 |
trim color ... more work, but it'll look better
:)
only an opinion, of course |
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11/16/2005 02:44:25 PM · #4 |
Seems to me the whole room will look fresher if you paint the ceiling at the same time as the walls. If you do, you'll want to remove the molding anyway, since it's more difficult to tape off wall and ceiling--the molding will cover up where the paint doesn't meet. Less trim work = less time and hassle. So, as long as you have the molding off anyway...you might as well paint it. =)
The molding appears to be easy to remove since it hasn't been caulked or painted into place. The only "hazard" is the risk of breaking the molding when you remove it.
I say, "go for it!" A little extra now will give you a great deal of satisfaction in the long run.
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11/16/2005 02:48:05 PM · #5 |
I have done TONS of remodeling over most of my life and several houses. Crown moulding should be painted the same as the trim in the room. Usually I prefer an oil-based paint for trim (for durability). I guess it's possible to paint it the same color as the ceiling, but I wouldn't recommend it. Textured ceilings are pretty much a thing of the past and IMHO do nothing but attract dirt and spider webs and are IMPOSSIBLE to clean. Removing the crown moulding and replacing it is possible, but could do significant damage to the walls and/or ceilings in the process. My recommendation would be to leave the crown moulding, and remove the textured ceiling. The process is very messy and somewhat time consuming but the end result is WELL worth the effort. My wife and I (mainly me) are in the process of doing this throughout our house right now. The house is 2400 sq. feet and it will take some time, but I've found that tackling one room at the time is not too bad. A large 2-3" "putty knife" works well for the task. When you're done you have a nice smooth ceiling that is easy to clean and paint! A colored ceiling can do wonders for a room!
My $0.02 USD.
Edit to add
Just took a better look at your picture. The top of the crown moulding is not caulked so it should be even easier to remove the textured ceiling around the moulding. Once you're done, caulk your joints and corners with painters caulk and you'll have a nice finished look.
Message edited by author 2005-11-16 14:55:55.
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11/16/2005 03:02:57 PM · #6 |
Paint it the same color as the rest of the trim. If you use a smaller brush, you should be able to do it without taping off the ceiling. It does look like your ceiling could use a good coat of paint too, though! Painting over texture is a pain but it can be done. Just get a long nap roller and check out the paints that go on pink but dry white. Glidden has some. Really makes it much easier.
And P_P, maybe things are different in S.C. but your statement about textured ceilings being a thing of the past is far from the truth around here. |
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11/16/2005 03:08:03 PM · #7 |
Originally posted by mk:
And P_P, maybe things are different in S.C. but your statement about textured ceilings being a thing of the past is far from the truth around here. |
Maybe I should've rephrased... They are very common, but don't seem to be very well received not only in S.C., but pretty much throughout the country. Seems every home improvement show I watch complains about "textured ceilings" It's gone so far as many listings marketing "smooth ceilings" as a selling feature.
Textured ceilings were very common in houses built in the 70's, 80's and 90's, but the trend lately as far as I can tell is towards smooth, easy to maintain ceilings.
Message edited by author 2005-11-16 15:09:13.
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11/16/2005 03:09:44 PM · #8 |
Some things to consider.
1) size of the room
2) height of the ceiling
3) colour of the rest of the trim
If the room is small and the trim colour is much different than the ceiling and/or wall colour the room may look a lot smaller.
If you have high ceilings then it might be beneficial to paint the crown moulding the same colour as the ceiling. This will give the impression of a lower ceiling.
Just some thoughts.
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11/16/2005 03:10:14 PM · #9 |
Originally posted by Palmetto_Pixels:
Originally posted by mk:
And P_P, maybe things are different in S.C. but your statement about textured ceilings being a thing of the past is far from the truth around here. |
Maybe I should've rephrased... They are very common, but don't seem to be very well received not only in S.C., but pretty much throughout the country. Seems every home improvement show I watch complains about "textured ceilings" It's gone so far as many listings marketing "smooth ceilings" as a selling feature. |
Ah yes, that seems much more accurate. Although they are handy in older houses to cover the sags and stains and cracks. :) |
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11/16/2005 03:17:09 PM · #10 |
Originally posted by mk:
Ah yes, that seems much more accurate. Although they are handy in older houses to cover the sags and stains and cracks. :) |
True... then again, hanging new drywall to conceal the cracked/stained ceiling 10' off the floor is always a great contact sport! I actually dropped an 8' sheet of drywall on my wifes poor little head doing this once. OUCH!!!
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11/16/2005 03:21:30 PM · #11 |
Originally posted by Palmetto_Pixels:
... but the trend lately as far as I can tell is towards smooth, easy to maintain ceilings. |
Man I wish that was true of our builders, I hate our textured ceilings and had enough with them telling me "no, you can't change that, no you can't paint it this color, no you can't buy your own paint for us to paint with, you have to do it yourself after closing" so I was afraid to ask about anything. Last time I ever do a new construction without being there to supervise everything.
I also agree, paint the ceiling molding the same as your other trim, I would think you could use the blue painters tape to cover the ceiling, they have different widths now and as long as you don't press to hard you probably won't get the texture to punch through.
Good luck with it, we just went through 2 different painters to do all the main rooms (living, kitchen, hearthroom, dining room) rooms and a stairwell...the first one was not very detailed and missed a lot of stuff so we sort of fired him, the second took a lot of pride but was VERY slow. Glad that's over with.
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11/16/2005 03:25:08 PM · #12 |
Originally posted by Palmetto_Pixels:
True... then again, hanging new drywall to conceal the cracked/stained ceiling 10' off the floor is always a great contact sport! I actually dropped an 8' sheet of drywall on my wifes poor little head doing this once. OUCH!!! |
I'm about to do this in one of our rooms - right after I tear down the brown cork ceiling that's been painted over with clouds that's attached to the accoustic tile. Good grief. Or maybe beadboard, pending some investigation. |
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11/16/2005 03:31:51 PM · #13 |
Originally posted by sabphoto:
Man I wish that was true of our builders, I hate our textured ceilings ... |
Let me begin by apologizing to any builders that I may offend with the following statement.
Unfortunately quality craftsmanship in construction seems to be a thing of the past or available only to the incredibly wealthy. There was a time when people actually took pride in building something. One of my favorite houses I ever had the opportunity to live in/restore was a 1925 bungalow style house. With the huge housing boom in the 70's and 80's, the quality of work took a drastic turn for the worse. One of the interesting things is the reason for textured ceilings. When you finish drywall, it's difficult to get a smooth joint where the sheets meet. One way to "hide" this joint is to apply a texture. The textured ceilings were an effective way to throw up a ceiling very quickly, without having to spend the time leveling and smoothing every single joint.
Message edited by author 2005-11-16 15:33:30.
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11/16/2005 03:33:06 PM · #14 |
Originally posted by mk:
I'm about to do this in one of our rooms - right after I tear down the brown cork ceiling that's been painted over with clouds that's attached to the accoustic tile. Good grief. Or maybe beadboard, pending some investigation. |
YUCK!!! I thought I had problems just scraping the "cottage cheese" off of our ceiling.
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11/16/2005 03:53:05 PM · #15 |
We contemplated getting rid of the cottage cheese stuff in our first home. Spray a little water, do a little sraping... no big deal right? Lukcily my husband started on a very small hall bathroom, yuck!! What a mess. Needless to say, that was the only room we did. And luckily the house we've moved into has nice smooooth ceilings. :-)
I don't know if this would work but might be worth a try. Maybe you can get something like a trowel. I don't even know if that's the right work for it. It's a long piece of flat metal with a handle attached in the middle that you could hold between the moulding and the ceiling while you're painting that section to keep the paint from coming in contact with the ceiling? We just had our exterior painted and they had something like that they were using. Just a suggestion, I've never used one. Just trying to throw things out there so you don't have to take down your molding or get rid of the cottage cheese. I'm all about shortcuts! :-)
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11/16/2005 03:57:39 PM · #16 |
Originally posted by jenesis:
We contemplated getting rid of the cottage cheese stuff in our first home. Spray a little water, do a little sraping... no big deal right... |
Yeah... water doesn't work so well. It tends to soften the paper on the drywall behind the "cottage cheese" and you end up chewing up the ceiling when you try to scrape. IMHO it works better dry, and you're right it's VERY messy. I recommend starting in a small room like a bathroom to get a taste for what it's like. Again, I think the end result is well worth the hassle.
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11/16/2005 04:10:14 PM · #17 |
The popcorn textured ceiling is usually used as a secondary coat, so if you take it off you will have to do at least a finish coat on the joints. The chemical that helps the plaster adhear to the drywall is photosensitive and as a result you will get poorer grab and the smoothcoat will be a bit tougher to get right. If you hate the texture, scrape the popcorn and put up some 1/2" drywall and coat that, it will make a better look and save you some time in my experience.
As far as the paint, if your baseboard is a short clamshell and the crown is a two inch ogee, then why draw attention to it, paint it into the wall. If the trim makes an important statment, then pick it out with color, the bigger and prettier it is the more it warrants a different shade from the rest of the room.
A couple of practical points: use a latex adhesive caulk at the wall and celing lines to cover the contact points and paint out and over the joint when you paint the wall and celing, then pick out the crown after. This will minimize the cracks between moulding and plane. If you don't have great skill with a brush you might just leave the first drop (that is the little section of the crown closest to the wall) tha celing color, and use the break into the ogee as the color divider, it is easier for most people since the break is outward.
As to using latex or oil, unless you are planning to strip it down to wood, you have little choice, repaint with whatever is on there ( except lead of course) oil will not adhear well to latex, nor will latex adhear well to oil.
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11/16/2005 04:15:29 PM · #18 |
Looking at the picture, and the poor fit & finish of the moldings, I think it's VERY Unlikely they'd be difficult to remove, and I strongly recommend doing so.
Robt. |
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11/16/2005 04:17:30 PM · #19 |
Also, here's a neat painting related tip that I learned recently: wrap a piece of masking tape around the base of the brush, where the bristles meet the metal part. This keeps the paint from getting way down in the base of the brush and makes it MUCH easier to clean.
(And you thought you could just ask a simple question, didn't you, Mike?) |
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11/16/2005 04:20:30 PM · #20 |
Originally posted by BrennanOB:
...As to using latex or oil, unless you are planning to strip it down to wood, you have little choice, repaint with whatever is on there ( except lead of course) oil will not adhear well to latex, nor will latex adhear well to oil. |
While it's true you can't paint latex over oil, I was under the impression you can use oil to cover anything (except lead of course). I thought oil would adhere to latex.
Edit: Quick google search shows mixed opinions, but the general consensus is that you can paint oil over latex as long as you "de-gloss" the surface by either sanding or using chemical methods.
Message edited by author 2005-11-16 16:29:47.
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11/16/2005 04:23:52 PM · #21 |
Originally posted by bear_music:
Looking at the picture, and the poor fit & finish of the moldings, I think it's VERY Unlikely they'd be difficult to remove, and I strongly recommend doing so.
Robt. |
The moulding looks like a pre-finish job. Depending on the age of construction, it could possibly be a "synthetic wood". If it's not real wood (which I have a gut feeling it isn't ), it will be very brittle and easy to damage if you try to pull it down. Of course there is always the option of ripping it down and replacing it with a crown of your choice (that's probably what I would do).
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11/16/2005 04:32:07 PM · #22 |
I am currently working as a bathroom designer, I am a qualified plumber and carpenter, and IMHO I would remove those moldings, scrape the ceiling, and repaint everything with a smooth semi gloss paint, keep the ceiling white or as close to white as possible, a little creamy should be ok, and if possible put some tiles on the walls, if not, paint with a glossy paint, creamy or some bright color.
those 1960 moldings are showing some bad craftmanship as the lines don't match, and that ceiling is awful, steam does rise in bathrooms and sets on the ceiling, as the steam is not pure it leaves stains and dirt that can be very hard to clean on a smooth surface, but impossible on that kind of surface !
just my opinion...
if you want to see some of my work I have some pictures on my server.. before and after, the after pictures are taken a few days before the bathroom was finished..
I designed this bathroom from scratch, I did all the work and didn't get any help...
here are my bathroom pictures |
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11/16/2005 04:38:14 PM · #23 |
Originally posted by DanSig:
if you want to see some of my work I have some pictures on my server.. before and after, the after pictures are taken a few days before the bathroom was finished..
I designed this bathroom from scratch, I did all the work and didn't get any help...
here are my bathroom pictures |
Very cool! Although I probably could have done without the closeup shot of the toilet. ;) |
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11/16/2005 04:42:01 PM · #24 |
Originally posted by DanSig:
...IMHO I would remove those moldings, scrape the ceiling, and repaint everything...
those 1960 moldings are showing some bad craftmanship as the lines don't match, and that ceiling is awful... |
What he said... think RESALE VALUE.
Although I don't necessarily agree with your color choices, but that's a minor point.
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11/16/2005 04:48:36 PM · #25 |
Hey Dansig
I am desperate for a plumber? How much for a trip to Yorkshire? We could call it a working GTG!!!!
FYI - in England the mouldings you are talking about is called coving, pronounced coe - ving.
In Victorian and Edwardian houses original coving is considered an original fixture that is much valued along with original fireplaces and picture rails etc. I will try to get some pics of the mouldings in our house to show you. Our ceilings have large light roses in the centre and the ceilings are papered. Our friends have 4 cherubs in the plaster of the ceiling of their lounge! Real Victorian overkill!
:)P
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