Pros: Need Help pricing a Job - DPChallenge Forums

Tamron SP AF 28-75mm f/2.8 XR Di for Canon

11/08/2005 11:12:37 AM · #1

I've just gotten a call from a company I did a shoot for last year.

I had shot 1 product (4 different shots/angles) fully processed. I submitted them the high res fileS and gave them full use of these shots. I charged $600 ($150 per shot). It was my first job with them.

Sample:

Now they want 4 shots of 2 different products. Same type products (small and relatively easy to shoot). My thought was $1000 ($125 per shot). Am I too high or am I serioulsy undervaluing myself?

My thinking is that the more shots I take of the same object and/or with similar setup/lighting, my price per shot should go down. Does that make sense?

Any opinions? I need to give them an answer today. I'd start shooting as early as tomorrow or Thursday.

Message edited by author 2005-11-08 11:13:52.

W.R.Miller

Canon EOS-50D

11/08/2005 11:16:31 AM · #2

First of all, I'm no pro... But, I would at least stick with your original price from last year of $150 per shot. I wouldn't reduce the cost because they if they hire you again they will expect the pricing to be less. Then if you bid the next job that requires more set up but less shots you would have to explain yourself why the price has now gone up. If you did these a year ago you may even want to give yourself a little raise over last years pricing.

JRalston

Canon EOS-20D

Canon EF 70-200mm f/2.8L IS USM

11/08/2005 11:31:57 AM · #3

Try this:
Stock Price Calculator

Canon EF 100mm f/2.8 USM Macro

11/08/2005 11:41:04 AM · #4

Originally posted by JRalston:

Try this:
Stock Price Calculator

Wow! This yielded a LOW price of $275 with an average of $425. That's for 1 photo used in a brochure with distribution less than 10,000. I would probably have charged about 300-350 for 1 photo. Would you typically charge less for the 2nd, 3rd and 4th given that they are all the same lighting (more or less) just different angles?

Prof_Fate

11/08/2005 11:47:11 AM · #5

I'd charge the same for every photo. Or a price for the day of my services and then a smaller fee per pic they used.

think about it - you go to Sears or JCPEnney to get your kids xmas pics - they take 2 or 5 or 10 poses. You pay the same for every print you get and they didn't change the lighting, did they?

This is how you build 'profit'!

I am doing a day of pet portraits - so i set up my lights and in come the dogs - do i charge the first one for my labor to set up the lights and everyone else less? If someone has 2 dogs, does the second dog get a discount? Nope.

Spork99

OM System OM-1

11/08/2005 11:57:10 AM · #6

Originally posted by mariomel:

Originally posted by JRalston:
Try this:
Stock Price Calculator

Wow! This yielded a LOW price of $275 with an average of $425. That's for 1 photo used in a brochure with distribution less than 10,000. I would probably have charged about 300-350 for 1 photo. Would you typically charge less for the 2nd, 3rd and 4th given that they are all the same lighting (more or less) just different angles?

Depends on the usage. If they want to use each shot, they should pay for each shot. If they just want variations for doing comps, fine, send them low res files and they can pick and then you provide them the hi-res files. If they are goig to use all the shots, then, yeah, they should pay the license fee for each shot. You might negotiate "some" on the fee if they agree to credit you, but that's up to you.

I think at $150/shot, they are really getting a bargain.

You might consider calling other pros to see how they price their work. Most will gladly share that info if they're smart. As long as you don't agree to give the same quote for a specific job, there's nothing wrong with it.

11/08/2005 12:13:48 PM · #7

Hmmm..Lot's of different opinions here.

I could justify most of the prices listed here as we have charged a wide range of prices depending on use, set-up time, etc. Our company has a fair amount of experience selling photos for advertising, corporate and manufacturing but what we can afford to do or charge and what you can afford to do are entirely different.

mariomel...I think the pricing you listed is fair, and more important..what you feel comfortable with. Could you get more? Maybe. Could your price be beat..yes. But thats true with anyone.

Message edited by author 2005-11-08 12:14:34.

11/08/2005 12:14:27 PM · #8

I see your point, but think it is a little different when the subject is an imobile object. With your dogs or the portraits at JCPenney, they move, bark, etc, (the dogs, not the people) Every photo is different and a result of careful thought. My "object" won't blink, bite or bark at me. Once the lighting is set, I can snap though the different positions fairly effortlessly. That's why I seee the reduced charge for the subsequent photos.

Originally posted by Prof_Fate:

11/08/2005 12:26:38 PM · #9

Do not price this as stock!!

It gets priced as a commercial day rate. I don't know what the day rate where you live is, but could be like $1200 + expenses and PP.

11/08/2005 12:38:34 PM · #10

I price photo jobs a bunch of different ways.

Day rates are best sold when you have to travel to a location or you will be working in studio with an art director (or some representative) from the company acting as a director.

If you are working at your own speed, the customer has given you a set number of shots and or products to shoot then we find it is best to price it by the piece.

Our studio can handle objects up to 40' square so we can handle a lot of different products. We charge by the piece different if the object is a Mercedes verusus a wristwatch but the set-up is the determining factor. We have had some wristwatches that took longer to set up than a Mercedes!

We bill $150 an hour for studio time and we have charged $25 per shot (a catalogue shoot) up to $1,000 a shot (an Advil beauty shot).

11/08/2005 12:46:38 PM · #11

Do you have a half a day minimum? Do you have a link to where you work? :D

Originally posted by hokie:

11/08/2005 01:00:22 PM · #12

Originally posted by Brent_Ward:

Do you have a half a day minimum? Do you have a link to where you work? :D

We can offer half days but normally don't. If you figure the time set aside for the client, the time to set up etc, etc you are better off quoting a per piece price.

We have a really old, stinky corporate site. We are an old industrial commercial photo company and our site is left over from the 90's!. Check out how old the Mercedes is!

But I was hired to help change this so our new site with the latest stuff will be up in a couple months. Our site isn't as fancy as yours brent :-D

//www.photoworksgroup.com/

11/08/2005 01:04:36 PM · #13

Originally posted by hokie:

Originally posted by Brent_Ward:
Do you have a half a day minimum? Do you have a link to where you work? :D

We can offer half days but normally don't. If you figure the time set aside for the client, the time to set up etc, etc you are better off quoting a per piece price.

We have a really old, stinky corporate site. We are an old industrial commercial photo company and our site is left over from the 90's!. Check out how old the Mercedes is!

But I was hired to help change this so our new site with the latest stuff will be up in a couple months. Our site isn't as fancy as yours brent :-D

//www.photoworksgroup.com/

It helps to have an AD (me) on staff for design jobs! ;o) I'm by no means a web designer, I'm a print guy. But I manage to truck along. Thanks for the compliments on my site. :D

Message edited by author 2005-11-08 13:05:34.

11/08/2005 01:36:30 PM · #14

Originally posted by Brent_Ward:

It helps to have an AD (me) on staff for design jobs! ;o) I'm by no means a web designer, I'm a print guy. But I manage to truck along. Thanks for the compliments on my site. :D

You are smart to have a variety of skills.

When I started off out of college with my pitiful little ad agency I learned very early that I would get more photo/design jobs based on my business sense more than all the cool photo's and graphics I was ever involved in.

A lot of buyers are not usually creative and they respond to boring business demeanor, timelines and meeting their needs more than flash. So I applaud anyone here that learns all that, not just how to shoot photos.

11/08/2005 01:43:56 PM · #15

Here are solme of my product photos. Please forgive the links page, it's still under construction.

product photos page

11/08/2005 02:17:13 PM · #16

Originally posted by Brent_Ward:

Here are solme of my product photos. Please forgive the links page, it's still under construction.

product photos page

You light really well. I imagine those images were clipped?

Were those shot in your own studio, on location or at another studio?

Check out our new website..it just went up 30 minutes ago...along with my photo...man...I am getting old!!!

Photoworks Creative Group

Message edited by author 2005-11-08 14:20:33.

11/08/2005 02:29:33 PM · #17

Originally posted by hokie:

You light really well. I imagine those images were clipped?
Were those shot in your own studio, on location or at another studio?

Check out our new website..it just went up 30 minutes ago...along with my photo...man...I am getting old!!!

Half are probably clipped, the other half just had there white point adjusted.
Shot in my old studio. I'm trying to get more work so I can get a studio in Denver.
Aren't we all... ;o)

11/08/2005 02:34:31 PM · #18

Well, I called them back and told them I'd take the 8 photos (i'll take more obviously and let them choose 8) for $1000. The plan is to use them for product brochures with a print run of 3-5000 copies each. I thought of charging less ($800) but this pricing made more sense to me.

They said they'd call me back. I hope I didn't price myself out of a job. I'm thinking of a career change, so I'd hate to lose a potential long-term client over a few hundred bucks.

11/08/2005 02:46:52 PM · #19

Originally posted by Brent_Ward:

Half are probably clipped, the other half just had there white point adjusted.
Shot in my old studio. I'm trying to get more work so I can get a studio in Denver.
Aren't we all... ;o)

Absolutely!!

I sell our photographers and photographers we contract more than I shoot photos myself. I will do location test shots and events shots as part of my marketing responsibilities. (Or sneak friends into the studio after hours and shoot them with all the cool lighting gear) <:D

If you check out my portfolio here you will see my sister in-law and her husband in formal wear for an ad I am doing for a charity ( a freebee), my daughter ( a lens test), a friend's headshot for her TV show ( trade for ad space), a test shot for my new exhibit booth for Hanes Underwear (spec photo depending on selling the booth), A regional jewelry store ad photo and a test for Biltmore Estates (shot with water cause we drank all the wine before I finished the shoot! ..:oD..hic!).

11/08/2005 02:49:37 PM · #20

Sorry to hi-jack the thread...sitting here finishing up our website and got bored.

That is a good price mariomel. $125 per shot is totally fair and what I would consider mid-priced for good commercial work. They would be hard pressed to find better for less!

Message edited by author 2005-11-08 14:49:56.

Canon EF 300mm f/2.8L IS USM

11/08/2005 05:27:33 PM · #21

Originally posted by hokie:

That is a good price mariomel. $125 per shot is totally fair and what I would consider mid-priced for good commercial work. They would be hard pressed to find better for less!

Well, it now 5:26 and I have not heard back from them. I expected to, since when I asked them when this needed to be done, they said ASAP. I guess somebody must have undercut me.

Here's a question: what's the point of sticking to your mid/hi pricing to "keep your reputation of quality work" if somebody is going to come along and undercut you with bargain pricing. He's going to get the job, and if he does a reasonable job, he'll keep getting the work. I, on the other hand, will have my head high, knowing that I didn't sell myself short, but I'll be starving cause I get no work. What's the point?

Skip

Canon EOS-1D X

11/08/2005 07:35:40 PM · #22

mario, don't sweat it. when it comes to pricing, you win some, you lose some. in the long run, though, it's not the price, but the relationships that you build with people that will make a difference.

with this one, you may still get it, or you may have lost it. if you lost it, give them a little time to get this project out of the way, then approach them, non-confrontationally, and ask them why. try to find out if there was something you could have done differently, or if it came down to price. if people are simply price-buyers, they are best left alone. on the other hand, you may find that somebody simply offered something that you could have done, but they didn't know you could do it.

yes, it's a tough question, but in reality, there's always going to be someone out there willing to charge less, and there's always going to be someone willing to pay for less. however, if you have a reputation for delivering quality work, on time, on budget, and for being a decent person, and for being willing to work with people, you'll stay busy enough not to have to worry about the ones that get away. you do great work, and have loads of talent. stick with it, and it will all work out in the end. good luck!

oOWonderBreadOo