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10/24/2005 11:34:02 PM · #26 |
Take the 30 minute ride to Hartford, The Camera BarDown town. One of the best service shops in the area. VERY good staff.
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10/25/2005 12:44:14 AM · #27 |
theSaj: I had the same experience... i thought it was me... however they did fix it great and got it back in a reasonable amount of time... I was scared to death to let my "baby" go alone like that with no protection... I just hope I dont have to do it again..
Debbie |
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10/25/2005 01:15:54 AM · #28 |
Originally posted by theSaj:
Originally posted by "Blemt":
I had a camera come back from Canon 10 weeks after we sent it. And as a dealer we are supposed to get priority service |
If they did that...I would make a detour on my next trip down to PA to the New Jersey repair factory. Walk in and be like....look...where is my camera? is it fixed? no? walk up to a repair person....fix now! if you don't have the part....give me a new one NOW and you can sell this one as a refurb on ebay.
I'm sorry...at 10 weeks and $4,000 I'd be so fuming the American CEO might find me on his doorstep. I know it sounds irate but I have essentially been robbed of several thousand $$$ as far as I am concerned from goods companies. And sadly, I find when I treat them nice nothing gets done. Then I have to call and be irate and come on strong...then all of sudden they can do something. *blargh* |
I can definitely empathize with your situation, Jason, but I will tell you that as a former employee at one of these New Jersey type factory/plants, you wouldn't get through past security at the front reception desk. As a matter of fact, once they saw you had an angry attitude you could be sure they would ask you to leave without seeing anyone, or even escort you out the front gate. However, they may have a representative come out and meet you if they feel you weren't a threat.
Message edited by author 2005-10-25 01:19:27. |
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10/25/2005 03:15:39 AM · #29 |
Originally posted by blemt:
I can sure understand your frusteration, but don't take it out on the dealer. |
Hi-ho,
Never fear, I'm not gunning for Canon resellers :-). I have nothing but praise for the dealer I deal with (Tracey Kidd and Ian at Photowarehouse Christchurch, free plug for their efforts.)
I'm more than likely to take it out on Canon, as I'm in a position of managing some contracts for work (My 'real' job) that could go to Canon for software and photocopiers/faxes later in the year.
Although it's not a deciding factor, my poor experience with Canon service in the photographic field will almost certainly effect my decisions with respect to any contracts I sign on behalf of the business when we go to tender. That's real money, not the 'pittance' I spend on camera gear in the scheme of things.
Cheers, Chris H.
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10/25/2005 09:51:05 AM · #30 |
Originally posted by neophyte:
Take the 30 minute ride to Hartford, The Camera BarDown town. One of the best service shops in the area. VERY good staff. |
Well they only gave me the two Jersey & California as options to ship it to for warranty work. So I was unaware I could use any other options.
Originally posted by Olyuzi:
As a matter of fact, once they saw you had an angry attitude you could be sure they would ask you to leave without seeing anyone, or even escort you out the front gate. However, they may have a representative come out and meet you if they feel you weren't a threat. |
Oh I know...it's called exterior calm. But then again. Sometimes I like to do the shocking.
ie: I was at Circuit City and trying to find a CD. I approached two workers and was referred to the CD and Video help desk. I looked over and saw that no one was there. I pointed this out to them. They said they probably just used the restroom and would return shortly. Why neither of the two workers could assist - I don't know (it was not crowded or anything).
So I went, now about 10 minutes passes. I make eye contact several times, see their reaction, and they simply continue to ignore me. At around the 15 minutes I've been sitting there waiting. I've read all the boxed set titles. I've read the stickers on the counter. Now I've even read the phone. It's at this point I see a label beside a button. On it is written "Page".
So I decide to pick up the phone. I tap the "page" button and declare over the intercom. "Customer service needed at the CD sales station. Customer service needed at the CD sales station."
Several more minutes pass by. It's now been 20-25 minutes. I pick up the phone once again. Tap the "page" button. "Manager requested at the CD sales & info booth. Manager requested at the CD sales & info booth."
Still nothing but I see a quick confused glance from a manager currently dealing with another customer. After he finishes with the customer he comes promptly over and states "the phone is for employee use only" and I flat out told him. "I don't care. I've been standing her for over 20 minutes waiting."
"Why didn't you ask for help?"
"I did, I ask those two employees over there and was sent her and have been waiting for over 20 minutes."
Anyways, I finally got serviced. Was the manager annoyed? I sure hope so. And I hope those two guys who decided just to sit and BS talking for 20 minutes instead of doing their jobs got a supreme lecturing to afterwards.
*shrug*
I believe respect is a mutual thing. I am not obligated to respect you if you do not return the courtesy. I am being kind enough to patronize your business. And no, I'm not going to simply stop shopping at a mega-chain store because one lousy set of employees are on shift.
Sometimes you just gotta "squeak"...
And I always try to be polite with my dealings with the underlings. Unless they try to simply blow me off or give me some pop-off answer that I know is a lie from past experience. Then I get a bit tiffed.
Or, one of the other things that gets my feathers ruffled. When managers bad mouth good employees in front of customers. I'm getting REALLY sick of that. And I notice a lot towards elderly.
ie: was in McDonald's it was 5 minutes before they switch over for lunch. They still have all the breakfast menus up. So I order a bagel sandwich. A minute or two later I hear the manager ranting. I told everyone to stop serving breakfast. (First off, if you want to stop serving. Change the signs. Second, as it was still during McDonald's official breakfast time it might be why the signs were still in breakfast mode. Anyways, they had to cook me a "bagel" sandwich. And I the manager mutter under his breathe. "Stupid ol' b!@$%". So here I got proper and good customer service. Are elderly sometimes a bit slower...yes. But hey, they're our elders. And this wasn't some 21 yr old but a 30+ year old manager. I was a bit annoyed to say the least.
Message edited by author 2005-10-25 09:55:20. |
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10/25/2005 10:15:54 AM · #31 |
I agre that sometimes the squeaky hinge get the oil but....Underlings? Whoa........
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10/25/2005 10:19:45 AM · #32 |
Originally posted by bear_music:
Originally posted by jhonan:
Do pros have some sort of service agreement with Canon? |
Yes, Pros can register as such with Canon and get all sorts of help others cannot get. Including loaners I believe. They take good care of their pros. But obviously they can't do the same for every Canon user in the world, that would be costly beyond belief.
Not to say they shouldn't organize their service department for the masses a heck of a lot better, but...
Robt. |
The pros are the ones they rely on for most of their endorsements. Sad but true that they'll treat them better than the average consumer.
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10/25/2005 10:40:32 AM · #33 |
Funny how shit happens sometimes.
I remember one incidence that sorta mirrors the pro-layman issue.
Back in 1998 I bought a used 1995 Acura Integra (which I still own) from our local Acura / Mercedes Benz dealership. I brought it in for scheduled maintenance on appointment. An oil change I think. Just as my car goes into the shop, this older guy shows up driving a brand new Benz. Guy walks up to the counter, has no appointment, asks for service. So guess what happens? Right. They take his car right in and start working on it while my car sits on the hoist. Took over an hour to get my car back while Mr. Benz was in and out in less than 30 minutes.
Money talks.
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10/25/2005 10:42:31 AM · #34 |
| Wow, I really wish that I didn’t read this thread. I was just about to email Canon to see about getting some work done on my relatively new 20D (under 1000 shots). This should be fun. lol |
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10/25/2005 12:28:18 PM · #35 |
Originally posted by neophyte:
I agre that sometimes the squeaky hinge get the oil but....Underlings? Whoa........ |
I'm an underling, most people I know are underlings, though I know a few "proud strugglings" (those who are self-employed and hoping they make enough to pay the monthly bills).
We underlings are those who do the work. The "enlisted". The underlings I find often are in agreement with me...sometimes more vocally. They just are not empowered to do anything about.
Not meant to be an insult in anyway. But frankly, most of us are "under" someone and few of us are in the position to make changes - even when we see they're blatantly needed.
Message edited by author 2005-10-25 12:28:26. |
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10/25/2005 12:29:42 PM · #36 |
Originally posted by hi131:
Wow, I really wish that I didn’t read this thread. I was just about to email Canon to see about getting some work done on my relatively new 20D (under 1000 shots). This should be fun. lol |
Hey, just curious what is wrong with your 20D ???
(My unit being a 20D. And I think there is an issue with a very large portion of 20D having lens communication problems, particularly with IS lenses.) |
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10/25/2005 12:32:39 PM · #37 |
Originally posted by orussell:
Originally posted by bear_music:
Originally posted by jhonan:
Do pros have some sort of service agreement with Canon? |
Yes, Pros can register as such with Canon and get all sorts of help others cannot get. Including loaners I believe. They take good care of their pros. But obviously they can't do the same for every Canon user in the world, that would be costly beyond belief.
Not to say they shouldn't organize their service department for the masses a heck of a lot better, but...
Robt. |
The pros are the ones they rely on for most of their endorsements. Sad but true that they'll treat them better than the average consumer. |
I think pros should be treated better than the average consumer, myself. The average consumer should still be treated very well, mind you, but I think having loaners for pros is a smart thing.
Although, like I said, they didn't have a loaner for my 1d for me even if I had been a CPS member. |
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10/25/2005 12:33:54 PM · #38 |
| And for all who complain that "money talks", you are a part of it. Why do you think you can get "service" for your toothache over orphans in South Africa who can't get "service" for being parentless and filled with AIDS? |
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10/25/2005 12:38:56 PM · #39 |
Originally posted by thatcloudthere:
And for all who complain that "money talks", you are a part of it. Why do you think you can get "service" for your toothache over orphans in South Africa who can't get "service" for being parentless and filled with AIDS? |
Extreme analogy but very true.
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10/25/2005 01:34:13 PM · #40 |
Originally posted by thatcloudthere:
And for all who complain that "money talks", you are a part of it. Why do you think you can get "service" for your toothache over orphans in South Africa who can't get "service" for being parentless and filled with AIDS? |
Yes....and I bet the money you spent on you 1D could have fed 10 children for an entire year. Only $18-$30/month can change these kids lives forever.
There is always hyperbole to such levels. And my issue is that the $4,000 I paid included a warranty & service. Just want what I already paid for... Canon factors into the cost that warranty.
Second, one of the main reasons for the situation in Africa is "intellectual property". A relatively recent concept (just in the last few hundred years) conceived of by those who had much stuff and wanted more so now they not only can own much stuff but they can own thoughts, ideas and invention. Eliminate patents and any company could make the needed drugs to help in Africa and an much more affordable cost.
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10/25/2005 01:47:09 PM · #41 |
Originally posted by theSaj:
If they did that...I would make a detour on my next trip down to PA to the New Jersey repair factory. Walk in and be like....look...where is my camera? is it fixed? no? walk up to a repair person....fix now! if you don't have the part....give me a new one NOW and you can sell this one as a refurb on ebay.
I'm sorry...at 10 weeks and $4,000 I'd be so fuming the American CEO might find me on his doorstep. I know it sounds irate but I have essentially been robbed of several thousand $$$ as far as I am concerned from goods companies. And sadly, I find when I treat them nice nothing gets done. Then I have to call and be irate and come on strong...then all of sudden they can do something. *blargh* |
I'd love for you to try either of these........ummm.....stunts. Please do and let us know when you get released from jail. Penalties and legal fees would make your $4000 investment look like peanuts. Have you priced criminal defense attorneys lately?
I know that if you tried barging in where I work, you'd be on the ground, cuffed and surrounded by people with guns pointed at you before you got past the lobby. I don't think they've ever had to shoot anyone, but I have no doubt they would.
I'm certain the top executives have very effective security as well.
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10/25/2005 01:49:09 PM · #42 |
Originally posted by theSaj:
Originally posted by thatcloudthere:
And for all who complain that "money talks", you are a part of it. Why do you think you can get "service" for your toothache over orphans in South Africa who can't get "service" for being parentless and filled with AIDS? |
Yes....and I bet the money you spent on you 1D could have fed 10 children for an entire year. Only $18-$30/month can change these kids lives forever.
There is always hyperbole to such levels. And my issue is that the $4,000 I paid included a warranty & service. Just want what I already paid for... Canon factors into the cost that warranty.
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I bought my 1d with the sincere belief that the money I'm spending on my equipment now will do the world good in the long run. Give me time.
Also, if you read my posts you will see that I agree that Canon's service is less than what it should be...that is, less than what you paid for.
My point was only that money does talk. And we benefit from that fact every day. So at those times that our money doesn't talk loud enough (because we don't have enough of it) we dare not bitch. The conclusion of that belief is that professionals should get better service, not that non-professionals should get crappy service.
I would rather that money did not talk...I would much rather that we live in a healthy, communist world were everyone does their part to help each other out but that won't happen.
theSaj, if you've paid attention to all of my posts about this crappy, hurting world you wouldn't have had the balls to tell me how many dollars a month can change these kids lives forever.
Edit: Within seconds, I realized I overreacted...my apologies. I do what little I can do to stop the injustices which crowd out the light in this world.
Message edited by author 2005-10-25 13:53:34. |
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10/25/2005 03:15:57 PM · #43 |
Sorry thatcloudthere...
I think we're both over-reacting a bit. But it gets annoying when people trivitalize other's problems. It doesn't EVER make someone more inclined to care.
"My roof is leaking...and it's going to cost hundreds of $$$ to fix"
Telling someone "Well there are children in India who have no roofs" does not help. And although true. It is a very invalid point. In fact, my roof leaking is going to take away from my ability to send $$$ to help those in India.
It's just when people come with those type arguments they're extremely confrontational and accusational.
I think we all know, the whole world over, that "those who have, have an easier time getting more". And that the "rich get richer, and the poor get poorer". Every time I've ever seen such comments made they are taken as an attack. Because, in reality they are...they're a dismissal of one persons problems.
And if you can dismiss one person's problem due to magnitude than you must establish a scale of magnitude and a declaration of at what point of magnitude it is worthy of being an issue. Do you need to have a roof? If you have a roof is that good and should all your other issues be dismissed. There are millionaires who have been crippled by a child contracting an illness. The "haves" realizing that all their "have" can't save the one thing they want to keep "having".
No worry...
I confronted my mom on this at one point several years ago. My mom dismissed an issue that someone was seriously struggling with as "big deal" because at that time she was living in a gutted house with no heat, no water, no electricity and a leaky roof. This woman's issue did not even compare. But to that woman it was a struggle. And it should have been respected as a struggle.
The goal should not be to solve world hunger. Such is not enough. So no one dies of hunger. Yes, that's good. But to dismiss all those dying of leukemia would be wrong. The goal must be to see the cessation of "all struggles great and small". So, no...losing a Canon battery grip is no big deal when compared to the dying in Africa. Alas, within the limited scope of a camera forum it is a relavent issue. No, I would not go onto a forum for "Doctor's Without Borders" and say... "You know what is a real bum....Canon lost my battery grip!" That'd be ridiculous.
But just as my post about you selling your 1D is fairly ludicrous and inflammatory, likely was your statement. Sorry, I reacted as such. It caught me off guard.
And likewise, very few but God alone know what I've done with my life for others. Years serving the homeless and volunteering at a soup kitchen. Thousands of dollars I've expended helping people both near and far. And likewise, I do believe I need to be a good steward. Being ripped off (and I have to the point of probably at least $10,000 over the years) reduces my means for "doing good to my neighbor". So no one wants to lose that which they have investmented into.
Now you mention that you hope to actually make that 1D do some good. So share it bro. I'd love to see a post expressing your dreams and how you hope that camera will help. Perhaps you're planning on doing an extended mission trip in Africa and doing a lot of photography while there so you can come back and publish it in hopes of raising funds. Share....now that...would be a valid and "great" post.
- the Saj
PS - once again sorry for getting gruff. I am on very little sleep this week...*grouchy*
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10/25/2005 03:16:42 PM · #44 |
Originally posted by thatcloudthere:
I do what little I can do to stop the injustices which crowd out the light in this world. |
It's all we CAN do...that and to ensure that our hearts are not bruised to the point that we give up... |
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10/25/2005 04:08:14 PM · #45 |
Originally posted by theSaj:
Sorry thatcloudthere...
But just as my post about you selling your 1D is fairly ludicrous and inflammatory, likely was your statement. Sorry, I reacted as such. It caught me off guard. |
I think we were talking past each other...I still feel that "pros" should get better service than "non-pros" but that both should get good (read adequate) service. What's 'adequate' for a non-pro is not 'adequate' for a pro. I really do understand your frustration, though.
Originally posted by theSaj:
And likewise, very few but God alone know what I've done with my life for others. |
Well, not anymore... ;0)
Originally posted by theSaj:
Now you mention that you hope to actually make that 1D do some good. So share it bro. I'd love to see a post expressing your dreams and how you hope that camera will help. Perhaps you're planning on doing an extended mission trip in Africa and doing a lot of photography while there so you can come back and publish it in hopes of raising funds. Share....now that...would be a valid and "great" post. |
To start, I go to Honduras on Saturday to do a photo story about a village who is getting fresh, running water for the first time thanks to some churches who have drilled a well and will be installing a pump and piping. This time, I'm doing the photo story for my portfolio and the church to help people realize the dire water situation in much of central America.
I hope to spend my whole life doing stories like this and making people more aware of what's going on around them. I hope to go to school for photojournalism in May and want to do stories for Medicins sans Frontieres or CIDA or World Vision or whomever to wake people up. |
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10/25/2005 04:15:56 PM · #46 |
Originally posted by "thatcloudthere":
I still feel that "pros" should get better service than "non-pros" |
I agree, but as a consumer, I expect at least consumer service. Today I received my camera and lens back (IS mechanism on lens repaired). However, I did NOT get my battery grip back.
So now I have to find the serial number. Of course I'm moving and all packed. So they retorted to try contacting the seller. Which was Dell. Who's service was so sub-par that I doubt they have any record I even bought anything from them. Let alone the serial number. I mean this is the company that lost my first order, screwed up the second order, than screwed up the bill, and finally I had to call them to get a receipt. Well, I never got a receipt for the battery grip.
*growl* |
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10/25/2005 04:39:51 PM · #47 |
Honestly, I almost always get what I want from companies if I really try for it and if I'm really convinced that I'm right. My job requires daily negotiations with sales reps and I find that there are a few different ways to approach something like this.
First, decide what it is that you want or need. What is the bottom line? You want a battery grip.
Then, you need to get the right person on the phone. A manager or director or something.
Then, decide the following: Does this person I have on the phone right now really want to help me or do they want to get rid of me?
This will affect the rest of the conversation.
If you feel that they want to help you, ask them to do just that. You wouldn't believe how often (when I've got a willing party on the other end) my negotiation simply consists of "Here's my problem...what can you do to help me out?".
I do this for a few reasons...first, this person probably knows of more ways that they can help you than you do. They will give you some options. Second, they are often to help you more than you originally wanted...more than your bottom line. For example, they may say "Sir, I'll send you a brand new battery grip and discount your service fees by 10% for your trouble". Also, it lets them know that you know they are trying to help...you are now their friend.
Alternatively, if you feel that the person does not want to help you out then you just need to let them know what the problem is and exactly what you want for them to do. This is not a big deal, but it will require that you be consistent and persistent. You will need to decide whether you have to 'horse trade' (ask for more and expect less to meet your initial expectations) or be straight up and ask for what you want.
I always recommend that you write down how you want the conversation to go before you call...map it out so you don't get flustered. Friendly but firm. You wouldn't believe how much you can control a conversation if you map it out before hand.
All the best, and good luck in your negotiations to get what you deserve.
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10/25/2005 05:02:28 PM · #48 |
Thanks....
Hopefully I can find the box I packed the card and Serial number in....
- Jason |
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10/25/2005 10:13:04 PM · #49 |
Originally posted by theSaj:
Hey, just curious what is wrong with your 20D ???
(My unit being a 20D. And I think there is an issue with a very large portion of 20D having lens communication problems, particularly with IS lenses.) |
My problem is actually with the viewfinder. All the numbers are not showing up. Like the middle bar in an eight, if that helps any
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10/25/2005 10:46:19 PM · #50 |
Great, the serial cards not in the box. I think i took it out to check if the S/N was one of the defective units. (Which it wasn't.) So now i don't know where that is. Nor do I have a receipt. Courtesy of "Hell Computer" be a god-awful disorganized company.
So I've written all the codes on the box itself. Hopefully, they'll take me at my word. I don't really have much else at this point. Thanks to Canon's refusal to have any sort of RMA system.
I think if all else fails, I am going to file a claim with UPS. As I placed the object in the package. Canon did not receive it. *shrug* Annoying...
Message edited by author 2005-10-25 22:49:37. |
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