24-105mm f4L IS - DPChallenge Forums

08/20/2005 01:42:38 AM · #27

PS: what kind of English is "more preferred"? Bad or badder?

PPS: I'm not a native English speaker, you are, DUDE...

PPPS: If you want to grow up, go to a coast and find some work there, as a photographer in NYC for example, instead of joining the army or starting to drink or getting married to your shit for brains high school darling and be a dad at age 22 just to find out at 28 that a 9to5 and a wife and four kids and a mortgage that's killing you is not the life you imagined for yourself.

RESPECT YOURSELF

08/20/2005 01:42:48 AM · #28

Originally posted by BeeGee:

Are you contemplating getting the 5D, Fetor? Are you a pro? Or trying to become one? Well, if you do, get the 1Ds or the 20D, not some compromise. The 5D is the rich man's 350D, stupid.

i got the 20D already check under the name, and its not a professional camera.

Originally posted by BeeGee:

Oh, and by the way, did you help to re-elect that idiot president of yours?

nope i wasnt old enough to vote this past election, but if i was i would deffinantly vote for him

Bush is my hero

08/20/2005 01:45:03 AM · #29

thanks fetor for proving that my theory flies. If you weren't a Bushie, I'd be crushed now.

As for the 20D, I wasn't talking about you but the other dude, the one who can't delete the stuff he wouldn't need to quote.

Bobster, who do you think has issues? Me, Fetor, Bush? ;-)

08/20/2005 01:47:24 AM · #30

Bobster Lobster: I love your work, looks like a very creative, high potential photographer's art to me. Congrats, dude ;-D

08/20/2005 01:57:21 AM · #31

Originally posted by BeeGee:

WHAT HAPPENED TO "NO OFFENSE" DUDES?????

2.8: you say it's needed - well, go check the pictures you've been taking with your 2.8 lenses and tell me how many of them (ratio/percentage) were taken with the lens wide open for the reasons you keep giving. The bokeh, blurred background you can get with a 2.8 vs. a 4.0 is a joke of an argument. If you take a picture in which subject and background are far enough apart, nice bokeh is much more about the shape of the aperture than the aperture used.

Of course it focuses faster, of course it's a little brigter in the view finder, but SFW?

"bull crap" sounds like ignorant rant and taking offense - DID YOU EVEN READ MY POST FROM START TO FINISH?

Maybe you should read it again, with an OPEN MIND, if you have one.

Think about whether you're pissed off at yourself for getting expensive L-glass for a "job" that could just as easily be done by using the cheaper f/4.0 L-glass.

Are you contemplating getting the 5D, Fetor? Are you a pro? Or trying to become one? Well, if you do, get the 1Ds or the 20D, not some compromise. The 5D is the rich man's 350D, stupid.

Why are you, kyebosh, using your outdated 1D with a self-respect killer like the ok but far from excellent tamron 17-35 instead of getting the Canon 16-35 2.8 L? Because you can't afford it right now? Because you prefer to "drive" your 1D with a plastic fantastic 50 1.8 II instead of dishing out some real money to get an up to date camera like the 350D or 20D or even the upcoming 5D and treat yourself with enough respect to buy a 35 f/2.0 or 50 f/1.8 I or 50 f/1.4?

Ask yourself instead of leashing out, you hot blooded youngsters.

Oh, and by the way, did you help to re-elect that idiot president of yours?

Bruno, Switzerland, a little older (31) and hopefully a little wiser - I shut everyone else up didn't I? Plus, what the F are you still doing in front of your computer at this hour? Shouldn't you be out partying or in bed at your age on a Friday night? ;-)

NO OFFENSE DUDES!! R-E-S-P-E-C-T (yourselves)!

First off I did read your post from beginning to end.

I don't see why you're associating the 5D specifically with F4 lenses?
I don't see why you're insulting a perfectly good 1D? No, I cannot afford the glass i'd like to use, i'm still in debt from buying the things I have gotten so far. Bringing up the gear that I can afford doesn't change the facts that the best gear is the best gear. I just don't have the means to get it. I bought the 1D for the build quality, the speed of the AF, the custom functions, the flexibility, the quality, but not for pure image quality. If you think that the 350D is better at sports than a 1D, which I often use it for, that's crazy. I bought it because it suits what I like to do, not because it suits what you do. BTW, even at 2.8 the Tamron consistantly resolves more detail than my 1D can save. Insulting anyones gear is childish and innapropriate here. Please refrain from doing it. I was simply stating the FACTS about lenses.

If I check right now the % of shots I shot using the lens wide open... well I shot 95% of the shots I shot with my 80-200L at 2.8, wide open. Shooting sports at night is pretty darn demanding. It used to be even worse when I didn't use a flash. I'm talking F2.8 at iso 3200, and still getting underexposed images. Where was I supposed to go from there? Buy IS? Doesn't work.

I agree that the bokeh is more dependant on the aperture, I never said anything to have you point this out.

Your calling me ignorant on this matter, only points out your ignorance. I think that an F4 lens can do a lot of things a 2.8 can do, but there are definite properties of the 2.8 that are better.

The 5D, I suspect will be better performing than a 1Ds in terms of image quality. Also I think it will be cheaper than a used 1Ds. Is that stupid? Depends.

Unfortunately, due to the lack of face to face contact between us, you seem to think i'm rather upset. This is not the case. My style of communication seems to get this reaction from people. Perhaps i'm too honest, and to the point.

Ps: I didn't vote in the last election. I hate politics.

Canon EF 70-200mm f/4.0L USM

08/20/2005 01:59:07 AM · #32

look at us
we are idiots
bickering over F stops

im leaving this thread alone
adios

nborton

Canon EOS-1D Mark II

08/20/2005 02:02:01 AM · #33

Originally posted by Fetor:

look at us
we are idiots
bickering over F stops

im leaving this thread alone
adios

and over a lens that doesn't exist at this point.

it has been amusing to read though.

08/20/2005 02:02:57 AM · #34

and that too

doh!

08/20/2005 02:03:17 AM · #35

Originally posted by Fetor:

look at us
we are idiots
bickering over F stops

im leaving this thread alone
adios

lol, back to pinholes, horay!

08/20/2005 02:03:32 AM · #36

lol, this thread is shaping up to be a very entertaining read. I personally cant believe anyone would have Bush as a hero especially with him debating evolution, f-ing up stem cell research, and continuing a dumb war for an ever changing reason (remember WMDs that Saddam was ready and prepared to launch, then the WMD that had dissappeared, oh wait... Saddam didnt have anything, he is just an evil person, lets send more troops to iraq call it operation freedom) Just for fun I'll name Michael Moore as my hero. Someday humanity will realize that killing each other has never solved anything and just how precious every life is. The bible clearly says "thou shalt not kill", why do religous people like Bush and his conservative base continually overlook that key part?

Back to cameras... hey theres nothing wrong with a 350D! I prefer the smaller size and lighter weight and cheaper cost to a 20D.

edit- added stuff

Message edited by author 2005-08-20 02:06:41.

Canon EF 70-200mm f/4.0L USM

08/20/2005 02:06:09 AM · #37

Originally posted by nico_blue:

lol, this thread is shaping up to be a very entertaining read. I personally cant believe anyone would have Bush as a hero especially with him debating evolution, f-ing up stem cell research, and continuing a dumb war for an ever changing reason (remember WMDs that Saddam was ready and prepared to launch, then the WMD that had dissappeared, oh wait... Saddam didnt have anything, he is just an evil person, lets send more troops to iraq call it operation freedom) Just for fun I'll name Michael Moore as my hero. Someday humanity will realize that war has never solved anything and just how precious every life is.

Back to cameras... hey theres nothing wrong with a 350D! I prefer the smaller size and lighter weight and cheaper cost to a 20D.

Say no to politics!

nborton

Canon EOS-1D Mark II

08/20/2005 02:11:29 AM · #38

Originally posted by kyebosh:

Originally posted by nico_blue:
lol, this thread is shaping up to be a very entertaining read. I personally cant believe anyone would have Bush as a hero especially with him debating evolution, f-ing up stem cell research, and continuing a dumb war for an ever changing reason (remember WMDs that Saddam was ready and prepared to launch, then the WMD that had dissappeared, oh wait... Saddam didnt have anything, he is just an evil person, lets send more troops to iraq call it operation freedom) Just for fun I'll name Michael Moore as my hero. Someday humanity will realize that war has never solved anything and just how precious every life is.

Back to cameras... hey theres nothing wrong with a 350D! I prefer the smaller size and lighter weight and cheaper cost to a 20D.

Say no to politics!

say no to starting thred wars about bush vs. world, nikon vs. canon, f4 vs. f.28. :D

08/20/2005 02:13:04 AM · #39

Originally posted by nborton:

Originally posted by kyebosh:

Originally posted by nico_blue:
lol, this thread is shaping up to be a very entertaining read. I personally cant believe anyone would have Bush as a hero especially with him debating evolution, f-ing up stem cell research, and continuing a dumb war for an ever changing reason (remember WMDs that Saddam was ready and prepared to launch, then the WMD that had dissappeared, oh wait... Saddam didnt have anything, he is just an evil person, lets send more troops to iraq call it operation freedom) Just for fun I'll name Michael Moore as my hero. Someday humanity will realize that war has never solved anything and just how precious every life is.

Back to cameras... hey theres nothing wrong with a 350D! I prefer the smaller size and lighter weight and cheaper cost to a 20D.

Say no to politics!

say no to starting thred wars about bush vs. world, nikon vs. canon, f4 vs. f.28. :D

amen brother, amen ;-)

KiwiChris

Canon EF 17-40mm f/4.0L USM

08/20/2005 02:16:10 AM · #40

Thought I'd chuck my 2c in here as well...

BeeBee, no offence taken or intended, but go out and rent/buy one of the lenses you're bagging before ranting on about it.

Looking at your profile your only fast lenses are the 50/1.8 and the Tamron 17-35 F/2.8-4. At the wide end of the Tamron you wont really see any advantages in the F/2.8 appart from the shutter speed, and although the 50/1.8 is a great lens it's not really long enough to show up the image advantages in terms of contrast and DOF that the F/2.8 L glass can give you.

And for what it's worth, I shoot wide open with both of my F/2.8 lenses almost all the time...

Cheers, Me.

edit: odd typo.

Message edited by author 2005-08-20 02:20:01.

08/20/2005 02:37:18 AM · #41

I love you guys, you start making sense. And those who can't leave the thread alone - isn't that beautiful? :-D

kyebosh: I didn't get the impression that you're angry, but your style/way of saying things is a little too harsh, bitter and aggressive. That's why people don't get you. I was just like you, not too long ago.

That's why I pointed out over and over that I was not trying to offend anyone. If people like fetor get offended, even though they're told not to be, they're taking things personally that were never meant that way.

Go have a look at the portfolios of the successful people here on DPC. You'll see that they all have this sensitive thing to them that makes people click (and vote highly).

You, kyebosh, have great potential. Your self portrait is stunning. But stop being so harsh, so black and white thinking. Instead of saying no to politics, say no to Bush and YOU CAN HELP TO MAKE THIS WORLD A BETTER PLACE, you can stop yourself from being bitter and you can try to communicate more clearly, more to the point and more neutrally, objectively, instead of putting "bull crap" out there - oh, wait, that was the fetor dude and he left us alone, thank God :-)

No, what I'm trying to tell you, what I learned recently, is that once you start talking to people with an open mind, talk about stuff, not offend or give them the chance of being misunderstood by leaving out stuff that's crucial for your argument, then you'll be understood, not frustrated. You'll score higher in challenges, too, because you have the eye, you just need to get away from the pre-conceived notion that a shot has to be technically perfect to score highly. It sure helps, but the vision you put across is that much more important.

I love your self portrait, kyebosh, the sports stuff, the tree - WOW! Now go check out fetor's stuff and stop wondering immediately, why his good equipment doesn't make him a good photographer. The narrow minded Bushie he is, he can't have the vision you have, ever, IF HE DOESN'T CHANGE HIS ATTITUDE or get that job on a coast. As long as he's a redneck, he doesn't stand a chance to see what this world is all about.

I lived in NYC for two years and travelled the American West for 7 months. You think I'd have done that if all the people there had been Bushies and Fetors? I don't think I could have taken 2 weeks, not to mention 31 months total... NO OFFENSE, Fetor, but F*** BUSH. HE IS A TERRORIST, NOT A HERO. He has had more people (civilians, mind you!!!) killed in Iraq than the US lost in the Korea and Vietnam wars and 9/11 combined. Should he be trusted with leading your beautiful country? I DON'T THINK SO, BECAUSE I DO T-H-I-N-K. God bless America, smart people like you guys who keep reading this thread instead of shutting down like Fetor - are you still there, redneck republican, couldn't keep your nose out of this after all? Cool, maybe this'll teach you something. If not, it was worth my time and effort to try. You're not a lost soul. You'd be one if they lured you into the army and you'd be shipped off to Iraq to kill innocent people who have nothing to do with the Cowboy's messed up, fundamentally unchristian view of the universe.

As for fast lenses, I just ordered the 70-200 2.8 IS and the 35 f/2 and am waiting for the 24-105 to become available. It won't be any brighter than the tamron and the 28-105 that I currently have, but it sure will be better.

I did rent, over the last few weekends, the 100-400, which didn't thrill me all that much and the stellar 70-200 2.8 IS - WHAT A LENS!

Got mine at adorama.com, refurbished by Canon USA (after sitting in a showroom or something for a while), with a 90 day warranty from Canon, US$ 250 off the regular price of the new lens.

Hooooray! Had I gotten it right here at home, I'd pay US$ 2300 - that's what the much cursed globaization is good for. When international companies try to screw you over, you just gotta get around their crooked way of marketing their product - get it where it's cheap, at NO RISK whatsoever. I love the good sides of capitalism.

I LOVE SMART AMERICANS. PLEAESE TRY TO MAKE A DIFFERENCE, EDUCATE YOUR FRIENDS - if you have any that are Bushies and thus NEED EDUCATION ;-)))

NO OFFENSE, JUST LOVE AND RESPECT.

PEACE, BROTHERS, ONE PLANET, ONE FATE, NO NUKES, F*** BUSH.

Rant over :-D

08/20/2005 02:41:48 AM · #42

ii hope that F*** Bush thing meant Free Bush

08/20/2005 02:42:40 AM · #43

Originally posted by BeeGee:

I LOVE SMART AMERICANS. PLEAESE TRY TO MAKE A DIFFERENCE, EDUCATE YOUR FRIENDS - if you have any that are Bushies and thus NEED EDUCATION ;-)))

NO OFFENSE, JUST LOVE AND RESPECT.

PEACE, BROTHERS, ONE PLANET, ONE FATE, NO NUKES, F*** BUSH.

Rant over :-D

That deserves an amen as well!
Amen BeeGee, amen!

08/20/2005 02:48:53 AM · #44

Originally posted by BeeGee:

NO OFFENSE, Fetor, but F*** BUSH. HE IS A TERRORIST, NOT A HERO. He has had more people (civilians, mind you!!!) killed in Iraq than the US lost in the Korea and Vietnam wars and 9/11 combined. Should he be trusted with leading your beautiful country? I DON'T THINK SO, BECAUSE I DO T-H-I-N-K. God bless America, smart people like you guys who keep reading this thread instead of shutting down like Fetor - are you still there, redneck republican, couldn't keep your nose out of this after all? Cool, maybe this'll teach you something. If not, it was worth my time and effort to try. You're not a lost soul. You'd be one if they lured you into the army and you'd be shipped off to Iraq to kill innocent people who have nothing to do with the Cowboy's messed up, fundamentally unchristian view of the universe.

where do you get your statistics? i would like to see them. and when you said civilians, did you mean US civilians or iraqi civilians?

i dont agree with the statement about how he has killed civilians. sure there are some casualties but not as many in this war as there was in vietnam!
heck we lost thousands of people in vietnam, ever go to DC and walk the wall? those are names of people who died then and in ww2 i belive
bush is doing whats best for our country, i mean we got suddam right? thats a huge accomplishment in its own.

and yes i am enlisted in the united states marine corps I leave november 7th to Basic training, and if they need me in iraq or afganistan, i will be more than happy to go, because i swore i would protect and serve my country by obeying the orders of the president and the commanding officers above me, and if that includes giving my life if my country needs me to, then so be it.

PS
its a shame that you put down the brave souls that are spending months and years in afganistan and iraq in the blistering heat, away from their family so you can sit at your house ranting about how wrong everything is over there and how bush is a ignorant moron. let the people who are in charge do thier job and you do yours, what ever that may be. i may die in the next year or two doing what bush wants me to do, but you know what, thats ok because i know that if i do i died to protect you

Message edited by author 2005-08-20 02:55:56.

Nikon AF-S NIKKOR 24-70mm f/2.8G ED

08/20/2005 02:51:19 AM · #45

Fetor it's the Vietnam Memorial wall.

Edit: Glad you do support the country. A friend of mine was in Afganistan. He's a Marine, and he made it back safe and sound.

Message edited by author 2005-08-20 02:53:00.

colda

Nikon D800

08/20/2005 02:54:11 AM · #46

Wow Bruno, after reading your well presented post in DigiFotoCH I'm quite suprised to see you post in such a way on here - or maybe you like to add a little 'eau d'troll' to this forum :)

FWIW, I see the need for 2.8 and larger apertures, after spending so much time craving that bit more light I have recently purchased a 28-70 and a 70-210 2.8 (cheaply on ebay) and am very happy with them

Darren

08/20/2005 02:55:05 AM · #47

Originally posted by kyebosh:

Fetor it's the Vietnam Memorial wall.

Edit: Glad you do support the country. A friend of mine was in Afganistan. He's a Marine, and he made it back safe and sound.

yeah go marines!
i know 5 people that are currently enlisted in the marines or army and 2 of them are over seas right now

08/20/2005 03:05:37 AM · #48

Jesus Christ... people should stop killing other people. Dying for ideals is stupid, especially stupid ideals. There is no cause that is worth more than a life.

Does it make a difference if it is US civilians or iraqi civilians? Is one life more precious than another? So what if we got Saddam? Can you explain this war to an iraqi mother who witnesses her 3 children, husband, brothers and sisters blow up or get shot in front of her? What has capturing Saddam done for her? Aren't these the people who we are supposed to be freeing?

If there were no armies in the world it would be a much much better place...

08/20/2005 03:09:38 AM · #49

let me point out a obvious factor of war and armies

men like to fight