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05/24/2005 09:03:33 AM · #1 |
Below each picture when you are voting, you see a horizontal series of small squares ranging from white on the left to black on the right, with all the shades of gray in between. If your monitor is adjusted properly, you will be able to see the difference between any two adjoining squares, including the ones at the ends. You should be able to see a difference between the two squares at the far left, and you should also be able to see a difference between the two squares at the far right.
Can you see differences between ALL of the squares on your monitor? |
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05/24/2005 09:12:56 AM · #2 |
yup on all my monitors...
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05/24/2005 09:22:27 AM · #3 |
Me too. Are we getting some undeserved comments in Lighting?
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05/24/2005 09:31:13 AM · #4 |
Yup... all present and accounted for...
Robt.
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05/24/2005 09:37:56 AM · #5 |
I cannot see the last three black bars on my work monitor. I have great difficulty in setting up this and my home monitors to show both ends of the spectrum clearly.
This is a product of using several year old LCD monitors at home and work (Samsung SyncMasters) - I am sure that the same afflicts many. I can whack up brightness to the max on each, and the contrast controls will only let me choose between seeing the difference between bright whites or seeing slightly more difference between the blacks - not both.
I am sure that others can see faults with my pictures that are invisible to me. Equally, I sometimes do not see detail in the dark areas of other people's pictures that are intentional. But I cannot afford the space/money for a new monitor as well as all the rest of it...!
I try and avoid relying on detail in the darkest and lightest shades in order to minimise this for DPC (though my "light" entry is a bit dark on my work screen). This issue is not something that would be easy to eliminate for the majority of users.
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05/24/2005 09:40:12 AM · #6 |
| Yep. I've gotten two comments (out of three) that my entry is over-exposed. I'm really interested to know if it really is or not, as it doesn't appear to be on my screen. |
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05/24/2005 09:49:10 AM · #7 |
I can see everything to the left of the red line as individual squares.
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05/24/2005 09:59:07 AM · #8 |
Hmmm... Philip Dyer and bear music were two of the first people to respond to this thread, and they also were the first two people to comment on my lighting entry! And those comments were "glowing", so to speak. (Thanks, guys, I really appreciate those comments a lot. They mean a lot to me.)
Probably just a strange coincidence...
The thing that is confusing me is that, on my lighting entry, I'm getting some of the most enthusiastic comments I've ever gotten, and yet my score is lower than you would expect from reading the comments. I'm afraid that my entry doesn't look very good on monitors that are adjusted too dark. Or maybe not... Just a theory... |
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05/24/2005 10:01:42 AM · #9 |
| Thanks for letting me know that. I just made some adjustments that allow me to see the individule boxes. This could make a difference. |
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05/24/2005 10:08:27 AM · #10 |
| home yes... and that's where I vote frm. Work I can not get it to set up right. The two boxes on each end look the same. |
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05/24/2005 11:30:46 AM · #11 |
Now I'm curious to know which picture it is - it can wait until the 29th. :-) I've seen lots of images that ended up with relatively mediocre scores, but which only had glowing comments. It's no fun to hear someone say that this kind of thing just happens sometimes, but that may be the only answer here.
But this does raise an interesting point, that has, of course, been brought up before. Should people have to pass some kind of basic requirements test before voting? This could be as simple as just displaying a splash screen the first time a person votes on each challenge that asks if you can see all of the boxes. Of course you could lie, but at least this will force people to be aware of the limitations of their monitors (if any) before commenting.
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05/24/2005 11:35:54 AM · #12 |
Originally posted by PhilipDyer:
Should people have to pass some kind of basic requirements test before voting? |
Absolutely. But I think that the IQ test should be more complicated than:
"Can you see the boxes?
[] Yes
[] No
[] What boxes? Where is the Trolls 'R Us page that I was looking for?"
Maybe just ask everyone to produce their degree certificate in photography and fine art.
Message edited by author 2005-05-24 11:38:01.
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05/24/2005 11:48:59 AM · #13 |
Originally posted by legalbeagle:
Originally posted by PhilipDyer:
Should people have to pass some kind of basic requirements test before voting? |
Absolutely. But I think that the IQ test should be more complicated than:
"Can you see the boxes?
[] Yes
[] No
[] What boxes? Where is the Trolls 'R Us page that I was looking for?"
Maybe just ask everyone to produce their degree certificate in photography and fine art. |
it's very simple.. if you score above 25 in this test in less than 30 minutes then you can vote :)
MENSA
I scored 29 in 17 minutes :) |
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05/24/2005 12:58:10 PM · #14 |
Originally posted by PhilipDyer:
But this does raise an interesting point, that has, of course, been brought up before. Should people have to pass some kind of basic requirements test before voting? This could be as simple as just displaying a splash screen the first time a person votes on each challenge that asks if you can see all of the boxes. Of course you could lie, but at least this will force people to be aware of the limitations of their monitors (if any) before commenting. |
I think that Philip's "splash screen" idea (see above)is excellent, and I'm not just saying that because he left a nice comment on my photo :) . When I first joined DPChallenge, I didn't even *notice* those little square boxes for a couple of months, or if I did notice them, it didn't really strike me that they were very important! As a result, I'm sure I unfairly voted on some images, and I know that at least one of my own images was messed up, because I edited it on a monitor that was too dark. I ended up getting tons of comments that the image was "overexposed".
A splash screen that was displayed when you begin voting, that asks you if you can see all the boxes, would, at the very least, call people's attention to the fact that they should at least try to adjust their monitors properly. I don't think that people who *can't* see all the squares shouldn't be allowed to vote, but they would hopefully at least take their monitor's misadjustment into account when voting.
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05/25/2005 03:23:06 AM · #15 |
I, of course, agree whole heartedly a click-thru calibration check should be mandatory before each voting session. I have been one of those advocating the implimentation in previous threads on the subject.
However, just having the grey boxes is not enough. The gamma setting of the monitor also has to be taken into consideration. Several monitors can each be set to a different gamma, and then calibrated for that gamma. Each one of those monitors will see the grey squares -- but an image, if displayed on each of them, could look considerably different from one to the next. Having just the grey boxes is only slightly better than useless -- at least the person will know they are seeing the full tonal range for the gamma the have set ... what ever that may be.
What gamma should the site standardize on? That could likely be the biggest barrier to getting it implemented -- perhaps even more so than D&L getting the time to implement it. ;) I for one would prefer 2.2 gamma as it is the web standard for graphics display and this is a web site -- but the mac camp will lobby for 1.8, and there will have been those that argue for a compromise somewhere between where nobody is happy.
Calibration is an oft-discussed topic, but until the 'powers that be' move to standardize the display of images the voters will continue to not know if they are seeing the image as the photographer created it to be seen; and likewise, the photographers will not know if their images are being seen the way they wanted them to be.
A calibration standard would not end the disagreements over opinions on the images -- but it would provide a stable platform on which to discuss our differing views.
David
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