| Author | Thread |
|
|
04/16/2005 09:30:33 PM · #51 |
Download and carry with you a printout of the PDF available at the last link.
|
|
|
|
04/16/2005 09:40:32 PM · #52 |
| I have a thought. If you were witness to a person taking photos of a dam, powerplant or any place like that, how would you feel if later there was a situation and you could have possibly prevented it. Or if the feds were not thourough, and let a terrorist go. What then? We are in a different world now and to be somewhat safe we will have to suffer alittle. I would not like being scutinized like that but I will understand why. |
|
|
|
04/16/2005 09:43:10 PM · #53 |
Those photographer rights don't mean squat here in N.Y.C.
|
|
|
|
04/16/2005 09:48:00 PM · #54 |
Originally posted by bcoble:
I have a thought. If you were witness to a person taking photos of a dam, powerplant or any place like that, how would you feel if later there was a situation and you could have possibly prevented it. Or if the feds were not thourough, and let a terrorist go. What then? We are in a different world now and to be somewhat safe we will have to suffer alittle. I would not like being scutinized like that but I will understand why. |
Would any of this have happened before 9-11, I think not. So the terriost did not only destroy 2 buildings, but the acomplished their main goal of putting fear into our hearts. I for one say screw that!! I am going to live my life just how I lived before 9-11. They may have changed some pople, but by god they won't change me. I living life to the fullest, I could be killed tommorow, by a car, not a terriost. That dosent mean I wont go driving tommorow. So I say keep living.
|
|
|
|
04/16/2005 11:25:21 PM · #55 |
Originally posted by TLL061:
wow , robert thats deep . I hope you never see any terrorism on your farm , but here in thre real world i think there doing a great job , never felt safer , you know here in the real world , oh yea get over it gore lost |
I live in Detroit. In my average week, my commutes take me near more then a few places that if I were a spineless, ready to give away my freedom kind of person, I would be quite upset driving near them, let alone live near such locations.
BTW, I didn't vote for Al Gore and I don't care that he lost the 2000 election. What I do care about is what our elected leaders do, if those elected leaders ignore credible threats that prior administrations took seriously and in that previous administration the actions they took resulted in the arrest and the end of those credible terrorist operations, then I have a right to be upset about what happened.
I do not feel that giving up any of the rights we have will provide any more security, if the laws that were already in place are ignored. |
|
|
|
04/17/2005 02:23:27 AM · #56 |
Didn't see it mentioned here...but, do you think someone of race that did have devious intentions (any race that is) to destroy something, would be standing out in the middle of an open space shooting pictures of it? Would be like a pedophile posing naked children at a junior league soccer game (digusting image, but you get the point).
I think they would have a GIANT lens or just doing the drive by/detective type hiding in a car type thing in the movies. (C:
|
|
|
|
04/17/2005 04:41:41 AM · #57 |
i am always surprised about americans (not all of course)
Quite the trade off, giving up your privacy and freedom to be (falsely) safe, as there are no guaranties, quite the opposite when you control people it is in their nature to rebel
If the photographer would have had a gun, he probably would not have been a national threat.
If this argument was about giving up your guns, we would have the same red-necks which are now saying that 'all-in the name of security' screaming stating it our rights to bare arms
I my self was a tourist in NYC and experienced being told off from many of it's beautiful buildings because i was talking picts
|
|
|
|
04/17/2005 05:27:40 AM · #58 |
Originally posted by Pano:
I my self was a tourist in NYC and experienced being told off from many of it's beautiful buildings because i was talking picts |
There is a phrase in NY that works very well when someone gives you bullshit. When they say something to you reply "F U". They will then assume you are just another New Yorker and leve you alone. Every New Yorker understands that phrase. I use it quite often when I visit NY.
|
|
|
|
04/17/2005 05:30:15 AM · #59 |
its true..i clearly notice a more intens suspicion against people taking pictures in public. When u take an image of a public building u might be a possible terrorist and if u shoot a picture of a child in public u might have perverted aims with that. All these are nasty consequences of the world we created. Its sad but true and i guess we have to live with that changes and act accordingly.
Personally i tend more to the option of keeping our heads cool and don't trade freedom for false security as Pano stated.We should not forget to keep respect for every human being regardless racial features. We have made that mistake before and all the sad outcomes to be found in our historybooks. Its easy to abuse these rights on this wave of fear and cry for safety going on.So better to keep our eyes open for those who are willing to abuse.
Maybe it would be wise to focus a bit more on where all this hatred comes from instead of looking for simple solutions on a deeply complicated problem. Like with every disease the roots should be treated rather than the effects as these always proof to be short term solutions.
I think basically it all comes down to a part of this world seemingly to have everything and the other part have nothing. And the immensly increased power of media making this all so visible and twisting it even. The only solution might be based on mercy and keep room for understanding. And thats gonna be a long and hard way.
|
|
|
|
04/17/2005 08:27:03 AM · #60 |
Originally posted by nsbca7:
There is a phrase in NY that works very well when someone gives you bullshit. When they say something to you reply "F U". They will then assume you are just another New Yorker and leve you alone. Every New Yorker understands that phrase. I use it quite often when I visit NY. |
No... actually that is not a good idea. You might end up getting your a$$ kicked if you say it to the wrong individual, or even worse.
Best thing to do is walk away. I know this might sound like the wimpy thing to do, but there are certain situations where you need to swallow your pride and just walk away. If a cop or security asks you what you are doing, be polite, and tell them. If they tell you to leave, (regardless of what you think your rights are) then just walk away, and try coming back another day.
|
|
|
|
04/17/2005 11:22:20 AM · #61 |
And they call it "The land of the free"?
|
|
|
|
04/17/2005 11:34:29 AM · #62 |
Originally posted by _Armadildo_:
And they call it "The land of the free"? |
Yeah thats the true irony. |
|
|
|
04/17/2005 12:39:05 PM · #63 |
I'm sure I had rant turned off...???
|
|
|
|
04/17/2005 12:44:10 PM · #64 |
Must be because old heavy set fellas aren't perceived as potential terrorists, but I rambled about the USA for over 3 months last summer and never encountered any problems.
From the state of Washington to NYC I travelled about and took all kinds of photos and not once was I ever asked not to photograph something. I must have taken 600 photos of NYC sights alone, and not once were my friend and I ever approached or warned that this type of action was prohibited.
I am planning another trip to the USA this summer and look forward to meeting some wonderful folks and taking photograhs of some awesome vistas.
In passing.... compared to some places I have been to in my life... America is indeed the "Land of the Free".
Ray :O) |
|
|
|
04/17/2005 12:48:32 PM · #65 |
Rob, when you said
"From what I have read and heard regarding the 9/11 commission reports, the Clinton Administration took immediate action upon hearing about potential terrorist threats, made the law enforcement and spy agencies work together and succeeded in stopping a few threats before they happened. The Bush Administration ignored the same kind of threats and only reacted, after the terrorists were succesful in their operations."
Boy do you need a history lesson and you need to stop listening to NPR. I won't preach here, but please study before you talk.
|
|
|
|
04/17/2005 12:50:09 PM · #66 |
Originally posted by dragonlady:
I was going to photograph some construction workers on a courthouse nearby for the "People" challenge, but I noticed as I parked across the street that there were police cars and surveillance in that area..I figured that it would be wise to forget that idea and go elsewhere to avoid being arrested. |
Dragonlady, did you ever think to walk up to the Police Officers and ask for permission, telling them who you were? |
|
|
|
04/17/2005 12:53:31 PM · #67 |
Originally posted by DaveN007:
Welcome to the world of law abiding citizens who believe that the Second Amendment means something.
***********
"I certainly support people's rights to take pictures of their family- in their own homes, of course. "
Telephoto lens? There is no legitimate purpose for a lens that allows remote surveillance of a target. Only law enforcement and the military should have telephoto lenses.
We must tax, restrict, then ban private ownership of these Terrorphoto lenses.
Zoom ratios over 2X must be banned.
Flash? You have no business taking pictures in the dark.
Memory cards need to limited by law to 32MB. 32 1 MB pictures is a reasonable limit.
We need to get SLR- "Assault" cameras off our streets. There is no legitimate reason to have a camera that can take 25 fully automatic pictures in seconds.
(Cut to heavyset, slightly dorky looking guy wearing a MILITARY-esque black vest crammed full of photo gear...zoom in on the three camera bodies dangling from his neck.)
First we must ban the Canon DO concealable "Cop Shooter" lens.
Tripods? They were designed by the military as machine gun mounts. Ban them.
Everyone can have a 1 megapixel instamatic. Period.
************
Now you know how I feel. |
Dave I hope this is a joke. I am as right wing as they come, but this is going way too far. It is like the liberals that say that guns kill people, which is like saying that my pencil makes my spelling mistakes. |
|
|
|
04/17/2005 12:56:35 PM · #68 |
Originally posted by phreakon:
I had a recent incident at a bridge (during the bridges challenge), and was asked to leave because I might be a terrorist or suicidal maniac. I was going to persue a case against them because I felt my rights were violated because it was a state trooper that asked me to leave. Well, the new Jersey Bridge Commission, is a private company and in no way affiliated by the state. Odd that a state trooper would be partolling the area, but I had no case since I was on private property. Also, that was not the first, or last time I have been questioned for having a camera in public.
Recently, I decided to attempt to photograph independance hall, as I have always admired the history of that building. Its nostalgic, for a lot of Americans. Well all the shots had at least six considerably overweight security guards. It appeared that there were more than 10 on duty. Now, I can understand the need for "some" security due to the occasional teenager maybe adding graffitti to the building, or drunkard throwing a rock through a window, but I seriously doubt that a terrorist would ever attack a nostalgic building, no matter how much of "America" it represents. So what are we left with? Portraits of a historic building with 10 security guards on duty standing out in front of the place smoking cigarettes. It's obscene if you ask me.
However, Hyperfocal, if the person you are describing has a case and feels that their civil liberties have been violated, (as there may or may not be more to the story) I suggest you have them contact the American Civil Liberties Union. //www.aclu.org/
In my own opinion, as I am sure this thread is going to bring out two differing political views on the subject, I'm going to add my 2 cents on this one, as much as I try to avoid politics on this site. Look, I have studied our country's history a great deal, and I am proud of our founding forefathers. They created a wonderful constitution of these United States. They made that wonderful document so that we would have freedom and liberty. They never promised that our nation would be secure. When I read stories like the one in this thread, I get sick to my stomach over the apparently tyrannical state that this nation has become. I will continue to fight for my rights, and the rights of others, no matter what. This over-surveillance that we have had to endure lately does not make us more secure anyway. It is an illusion.
I'm guessing that the person in the story was violated and surveilled because due to the Patriot act, law enforcement was able to do so very easily. Folks, if a person is a suspect of a crime, all that law enforcement ever needed was a warrant issued from a judge in order to search and seize. It's in the bill of rights. The patriot act removes the part about having to have a judge issue the warrant. Honestly, I don't understand why people aren't upset about that. There is a reason we have a judicial system, and that act completely undermines the rights of American citizens, as well as our law. So far all I have seen are instances like the one described in this thread. If law enforcement feels that they need to skip the judicial part of our law, and take surveillance into their own hands, then why not do away with the court system in general? Seriously, this stuff drives me nuts.
Look, before all the peole with opposing views start spitting literary bile at my post, I understand that some Americans want the security. Its ok, I'm not heartless to your needs. However, the security you want can be acheived without changing the law, or surveillance of our citizens. Stop watching the television....actually, that would be a really good start.
Benjamin Franklin said, "They that would trade a little liberty for a little security deserve neither." To me, that is the honest truth. |
You need to do some research also. The ACLU was formed many years ago by the Communist Party to use our laws to protect their spies. Not it is a run a muck group of mis guided people that are trying to limit your freedoms. Don't believe all you hear in the media. |
|
|
|
04/17/2005 12:57:15 PM · #69 |
it really isn't funny...HOWEVER being from North Mississippi and know the area quite well...it is NOT the norm to see a redneck (all MS, TN, AR caucasians or any other ethnicity) with photography equipment that they have not stollen, borrowed from terrorist, etc) and a NEW black SUV with wheels still attached?well.......
on serious note..just moved to arizona from area by MS river...it's no better here...crime is rampant every where, every state. Hopefully, your family will survive this abuse of several of their constitutional rights...good luck and God bless
Message edited by author 2005-04-17 13:06:31. |
|
|
|
04/17/2005 12:57:41 PM · #70 |
Originally posted by gwphoto:
It is like the liberals that say that guns kill people, which is like saying that my pencil makes my spelling mistakes. |
Guns are designed and built to kill.
Pencils are not designed and built to make spelling mistakes. |
|
|
|
04/17/2005 12:59:32 PM · #71 |
Originally posted by MadMordegon:
Originally posted by gwphoto:
It is like the liberals that say that guns kill people, which is like saying that my pencil makes my spelling mistakes. |
Guns are designed and built to kill.
Pencils are not designed and built to make spelling mistakes. |
Show me a gun that killed someone with out a person pulling the trigger. Grow up. |
|
|
|
04/17/2005 01:20:41 PM · #72 |
In regards to racial profiling from earlier....one of my best friends lives in LA...her grandfather was a naturalized Japanese citizen...he was a successful entrepreneur.
During WW2....he spent 3 YEARS in an internment camp (in Arkansas, I believe). He had committed no crime.....he just looked like the enemy. By the time he got out, he had lost his home, his business, and he had to start over from scratch.
A few years later the government admitted they were wrong for detaining him and gave him a check for some ridiculous amount like 3 thousand dollars.
People....this was not that long ago....we've got to learn from our mistakes and not let things like this happen again.
|
|
|
|
04/17/2005 01:42:21 PM · #73 |
Originally posted by gwphoto:
You need to do some research also. The ACLU was formed many years ago by the Communist Party to use our laws to protect their spies. |
Care to document that please?
Although, since the breakup of the USSR red-baiting isn't quite what it used to be, it is obvious you intend to disparage the motives and methods of this group -- I personally think your accusations are unfounded and misleading. |
|
|
|
04/17/2005 02:23:47 PM · #74 |
Originally posted by GeneralE:
Originally posted by gwphoto:
You need to do some research also. The ACLU was formed many years ago by the Communist Party to use our laws to protect their spies. |
Care to document that please?
Although, since the breakup of the USSR red-baiting isn't quite what it used to be, it is obvious you intend to disparage the motives and methods of this group -- I personally think your accusations are unfounded and misleading. |
YOu can start here, //www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-bloggers/1382463/posts and then do a google on the founder Roger Baldwin. This is a dangerous group of people and the truth needs to be told. |
|
|
|
04/17/2005 03:48:37 PM · #75 |
Originally posted by gwphoto:
Originally posted by MadMordegon:
Originally posted by gwphoto:
It is like the liberals that say that guns kill people, which is like saying that my pencil makes my spelling mistakes. |
Guns are designed and built to kill.
Pencils are not designed and built to make spelling mistakes. |
Show me a gun that killed someone with out a person pulling the trigger. Grow up. |
The unfortunate part about this comment is that there have been occasions where the person that did pull the trigger was not grown up, and the one shot ... never will.
Oh,,, by the way... I am all grown up... :O)
Ray |
|
Home -
Challenges -
Community -
League -
Photos -
Cameras -
Lenses -
Learn -
Help -
Terms of Use -
Privacy -
Top ^
DPChallenge, and website content and design, Copyright © 2001-2025 Challenging Technologies, LLC.
All digital photo copyrights belong to the photographers and may not be used without permission.
Current Server Time: 07/20/2025 08:43:04 AM EDT.
