AA results a disgrace? - DPChallenge Forums

03/14/2005 03:05:36 PM · #76

I guess I don't understand what the word "challenge" means.

To me it means to enter MY best shot that I think would ribbon. I don't enter to get critiques, but I do appreciate a GOOD one!

I used to wait for a good challenge and go take a picture of what I thought depicted it, but now I just take pictures of whatever and if I have a picture that I think will do well in a challenge, I enter.

I disagree with the "enter whatever just because I can." I think it is a waste of time for the serious entries. Frustrates the voters because we have to vote on shots that don't apply or are a suck. hehe..

If you all want a critique there are plenty of places out there to get them.

oh and Nards, I don't give out critiques anymore because nobody wants to hear it. :-/ so I just comment and say wow, nice or congrats. Less stress.

03/14/2005 03:11:38 PM · #77

Originally posted by Sonifo:

I disagree with the "enter whatever just because I can." I think it is a waste of time for the serious entries. Frustrates the voters because we have to vote on shots that don't apply or are a suck. hehe..

You only have to vote on 20% of the entries if you wish.

Sonifo

Canon EOS-400D Rebel XTi

03/14/2005 03:13:40 PM · #78

Originally posted by rex07734:

Originally posted by Sonifo:

I disagree with the "enter whatever just because I can." I think it is a waste of time for the serious entries. Frustrates the voters because we have to vote on shots that don't apply or are a suck. hehe..

You only have to vote on 20% of the entries if you wish.

I really don't think it is fair to stop at 20%. :-)

03/14/2005 03:17:51 PM · #79

Originally posted by Sonifo:

Originally posted by rex07734:

Originally posted by Sonifo:

I disagree with the "enter whatever just because I can." I think it is a waste of time for the serious entries. Frustrates the voters because we have to vote on shots that don't apply or are a suck. hehe..

You only have to vote on 20% of the entries if you wish.

I really don't think it is fair to stop at 20%. :-)

I didn't say it was fair. I vote on 100% in any given challenge. Just making a statement.

bledford

Canon EOS-300D Rebel

Nikon AF Nikkor 35mm f/2.0D

03/14/2005 03:43:33 PM · #80

The idea that somehow the Ansel Adams challenge was an example gross misjudgment on the part of the voters is, to me, invalid given the history of results for this site. For any given challenge, the top ten may contain 2-3 entries that really "scream" the challenge topic. Take 1970s, for instance, I look at those images and mostly I see 1960s icons (peace signs, civil rights, etc.).

This notion that somehow the top three images in a given challenge don't deserve to be there or that the voters were ignorant in their placement of these images is nothing new. The same argument can usually be made for every subjective challenge (i.e. not challenges that *only* require a tangible subject be present in the photo, such as Road Signs).

zarniwoop

Nikon D50

03/14/2005 03:47:48 PM · #81

Yeah the challenges really only give a vague sense of focus. It's possible to ignore or very loosely interpret the rules and still win. I think this a good thing, the challenges provide enough focus to prevent every one being a free study but they don't completely overpower creativity.

Stagolee

Kodak Easyshare C180

Canon EF 50mm f1.2L

03/14/2005 03:55:52 PM · #82

Originally posted by bledford:

You are 100% correct.

To qoute that popular TV show "the tribe has spoken" It really doesn't matter what the individual thinks of the results because as a collective these were the images we liked the most.

It is that simple so why not just accept the result instead of trying to embarrass the winners to further scrutiny and justification.

They are the winners so let them have there moment of glory.

coolhar

Canon PowerShot Pro 90 IS

03/14/2005 03:59:13 PM · #83

Originally posted by Sonifo:

... I don't give out critiques anymore because nobody wants to hear it. :-/ so I just comment and say wow, nice or congrats. Less stress.

I'm sorry to hear that, I remember when I was new here you left a comment on one of my shot's. I looked at your profile and saw a mess of ribbons, and that made me feel even better about my shot. I know what you mean about the stress, and that they don't want to hear constructive criticism. It's much more that way now than it used to be. But I'd still like to encourage you to take up commenting again, at least once in a while. People respect your opinion, you have a lot to give, and some of us are still receptive.

bbower1956

Canon EOS Rebel T6s

Canon EF 70-200mm f/2.8L IS USM

03/14/2005 04:02:23 PM · #84

People that only want to hear that their pictures are great should only send them to their parents.

If you don't want to lose you should not compete.

zarniwoop

Nikon D50

Nikon AF Nikkor 35mm f/2.0D

03/14/2005 04:04:52 PM · #85

There is no reason to want to lose.

Artifacts

Canon EOS-5D Mark II

Canon EF 24-105mm f/4.0L IS

03/14/2005 04:39:53 PM · #86

Hmmmmm... I don't know what all the discussion is about...

It appears to me that, perhaps for the very first time, voters got it EXACTLY RIGHT! ;) ;)

Bear_Music

Samsung Galaxy S24 Ultra

Sony 24-70mm F4 Vario-Tessar T* FE OSS

03/14/2005 04:44:29 PM · #87

Originally posted by stdavidson:

Hmmmmm... I don't know what all the discussion is about...

It appears to me that, perhaps for the very first time, voters got it EXACTLY RIGHT! ;) ;)

Close enough so as makes no nevermind, that's for sure. Personally the only anomaly I saw in the top group, really, was the horses at 4th place, because that image (while undeniably lovely) was totally un-ansel in my eyes, plus the haloing along the horsehead from the sky burn seemed very strange to me. But that's just me, and the voters spoke.

There were some images scored middle-of-the-pack that I thought should be top 20, but none outside the top 20 that I thought should be top 10, so I'd say from my perspective the voters did very well.

Robt.

coolhar

Canon PowerShot Pro 90 IS

03/14/2005 04:47:44 PM · #88

Originally posted by stdavidson:

Hmmmmm... I don't know what all the discussion is about...

It appears to me that, perhaps for the very first time, voters got it EXACTLY RIGHT! ;) ;)

I think the voters get it exactly right everytime. Except when they get fooled by an illegal entry. But I still don't have total respect for their tastes, lol.

PaulMdx

Canon EOS-1D

Canon EF 70-200mm f/2.8L USM

03/14/2005 05:09:28 PM · #89

Originally posted by jonpink:

Well I will probably get ripped for 'speaking out' ...

Viva la revolution, Jon.

I turned off the forums a while ago on DPC because I couldn't put up with banging my head against a wall on SO many issues.

If everyone took as many pictures as they made uninformed posts, I suspect a lot of us would see a VAST improvement in our photography.

Incidentally Jon, I saw the thread because a fellow member of the JP Fan Club pointed me here!

nico_blue

Canon EOS-5D Mark II

Tamron SP AF 28-75mm f/2.8 XR Di for Canon

03/14/2005 05:13:12 PM · #90

Let me preface by saying that I didnt enter the challenge bcos I wasnt able to find anything to shoot (On college campus + dont have a car + twas really cold outside)

While voting I was somewhat dissappointed with the entries in general... I feel people didnt really push their values far enough and a lot of entries ended up being dull, plain, grey-ish, landscapes lacking detail, and focus. (There were also a few who went a little overboard with dodging and burning, case in point the halo horses shot)... But overall I feel that most of the top finishers deserved their place, especially the blue ribbon shot. It was one of the shots that I felt used the whole range of black and whites, and was captured and presented skillfully. It was one of my few 10's this challenge.

So I guess my point is while I highly regard JonPink, his opinions, his comments and especially his photography, I disagree with him now and would instead declare the AA results a sucess.

For the people who didnt do well, I would encourage them to actively seek out comments e.g. threads asking 'why didnt my AA entry do well'...

An important part of photography in those days was the darkroom where you could make a good photo even better, dare I say excellent. In the same way an important part of digital photography is the digital darkroom (photoshop). For all those unfortunate purists who beleive that photoshop isnt part of digital photography I say that its no different (if not more powerfull) than a darkroom in many respects. Just think of each post-processing technique and filter you apply in photoshop as equivalent to adding a different chemical to your negative to develop your photo.

Photoshop in many ways levels the playing field between cameras and photographers. My G5 is never going to be able to do what a 20D can straight out of the camera but with tools like unsharpmask, neat image, contrasts, levels, etc photos from my G5 can surpass their 20D rivals in detail, quality and finish.

edit: typo

Message edited by author 2005-03-14 17:14:48.

Canon 12x IS USM (S3 IS built-in Lens) -- 36-432mm (35mm EQ)

03/14/2005 07:11:39 PM · #91

Originally posted by rex07734:

Here is a good way to get comments, anyone that comments on my photos I will return the favor.

Nobody took me up on my offer.

GeneralE

Canon PowerShot S3 IS

03/14/2005 07:27:49 PM · #92

Originally posted by bledford:

...Take 1970s, for instance, I look at those images and mostly I see 1960s icons (peace signs, civil rights, etc.).

We were still protesting the war when I was drafted in 1972. The US military did not evacuate Saigon (now Ho Chi Minh City) until 1975. And we have minority voters being systematically discriminated against today.

colyla

Canon EOS-50D

Canon EF 16-35mm f/2.8L USM II

03/14/2005 07:31:15 PM · #93

Originally posted by GeneralE:

I personally find that couching my criticisms in non-inflammatory and emotionally-charged terms will get it heard, without compromising the actual content. While I feel people should also be free to express themselves as they wish, I think the abrasive route is less effective at getting people to incorporate your suggestions.

Well said :)

floyd

Canon EOS-5D

Canon EF 17-40mm f/4.0L USM

03/14/2005 07:45:08 PM · #94

Sonifo - I'm sorry to hear that you don't comment anymore. I remember getting a very constructive comment from you way back when and it made it even more valuable when I looked at your work and saw that you really knew your stuff.

It's a shame that you don't think people want to hear constructive criticism but that's not been my experience. I try to comment constructively as much as possible and I've not had any bad experiences with people taking them the wrong way.

I'd like to encourage you to reconsider. You have much to offer.

John

pitsaman

Canon EOS-30D

Canon EF 50mm f/1.8 II

03/14/2005 08:06:04 PM · #95

I love my photo and don't care if many of you don't :-)
I gave myself 10 this time...

Voters here like simple contrasty and clean photos,no kids ,pets or religious symbols will score good.

Top 5 photos are usually the best ones for the general public which is used to $5 throw-away camera and everything in focus type photos.

Let's stop crying about why this or that photo got the ribbon ,if you really want ribbon than you have to abandon your way of taking photos and start following the DPC winning crowd (to become a whore photographer)which I will never do :-)
Just my 2 cents.

Message edited by author 2005-03-14 20:06:29.

bledford

Canon EOS-300D Rebel

Canon EF 24-105mm f/4.0L IS

03/14/2005 08:19:15 PM · #96

Originally posted by GeneralE:

Of course. But, the bulk of those challenge entries are not exclusively attributable to the 1970s (one could argue that those top-ten the themes shown apply to the present day [with the exception of the punchcard debugger]). My point is that AA did not seem to me at least to be too far out of line with what is the norm on this site. People tend to vote higher the more attractive image that somewhat meets the challenge than the mediocre image that fits it perfectly.

If nothing else, we are a picky crowd.

scalvert

Canon EOS-5D Mark III

03/14/2005 08:25:41 PM · #97

Originally posted by bledford:

People tend to vote higher the more attractive image that somewhat meets the challenge than the mediocre image that fits it perfectly.

Amen.