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DPChallenge Forums >> Web Site Suggestions >> Should the spot editing rule be softened?
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Showing posts 26 - 40 of 40, (reverse)
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 06/26/2002 12:29:13 AM · #26
lisae,

I'm pretty sure you were around when we were going through the disaster of trying to figure out which image edits should be allowed, and I think our decision to just disallow spot editing was the best we could have made.

I would bet (but am open to be convinced otherwise) that the timestamp option can be turned off on any digital camera, and we shouldn't make a concession for that. That said, I will also say that the timestamps on those images are awfully strange-looking... I've never seen anything like them. I do, however, believe that the removal of the date was not done in defiance of the rules, but it's just a question of fairness and equal enforcement on the site.

In regards to "whining", you absolutely aren't -- and I (as well as Langdon and the other site moderators) do appreciate any and all of your criticism of the site. They are certainly well-thought, and I always look for your name on posts to get an alternative view of things :) Your post is also certainly in the right section of the forums with the best intentions, and its purpose is clearly constructive.

I think we're doing a good job at firming up a solid set of rules, but the rules are made by us, and I'll be the first to say that they should be adjusted when necessary to fit the needs of the site. In this instance, though, I don't think a change is necessary.

The decision about disqualification will be made (and if necessary, put into action) by tomorrow. It's been discussed with most of the moderators. I'm not trying to open that can of worms again, but I figured I'd update you all on the status. That, and I wasn't here to chime in when the thread was active ;) Actually... I was over in your neck of the woods last week, lisae -- my sister was studying in Perth, so I was visiting her for a week, and then we went to Sydney for four days.

Drew
 06/26/2002 01:09:35 AM · #27
Originally posted by lisae:

This is a fun contest on the internet, not the Nobel Prize.

Honey, there IS such a thing a the Pulitzer Prize. They award big money and prestige for such things as.. oh.. photographs!

Frankly, I know of no reason why images posted on this site would not be eligible for the prize. The internet is a form of media, is it not?

You may not realize that a lot of people take pride in the effort of what they do; getting a bit of recognition on a silly little internet photo contest may be the highlight of their day.

- TS
 06/26/2002 01:31:51 AM · #28
It's kinna late, but I'd like to drop my 2 cents down the well. My vote would be to keep the rules as they are and not allow any spot editing. Just keep it simple. Once you start it'll be like letting the camel's nose in the tent.
 06/26/2002 02:00:43 AM · #29
I have been using a D1x for a while and I have had a big problem with dust on the CCD which leaves dust on the image, the only way to get around it is to spot edit the dust out. To me this should not be illegal being that you are removing something that was not in the image but got on the CCD. You guys let me know what you think. This is a problem only with digital SLR cameras and not point and shoots becasue you can''t remove the lens from a point and shoot to expose it to the elements.

* This message has been edited by the author on 6/26/2002 2:02:08 AM.
 06/26/2002 02:17:22 AM · #30
Originally posted by Corey:
...this is a problem only with digital SLR cameras and not point and shoots becasue you can''t remove the lens from a point and shoot to expose it to the elements

But I'm not allowed to remove the speck of dust on my lens? How about that splattered bug on the windshield ruining my "Road" shot? How about just smoothing out those tiny wrinkles near the model's eye?

I can't see any way to compromise on this issue -- either allow or don't allow spot-edits. If you're a reasonable and compassionate voter, you will consider fctors which seem beyond the control of the photographer. But, ultimately, we can all choose to submit or not submit a photo here.

This site is (for now) designed to compare "unedited" images. If you don't want to submit your image for evaluation complete with dust, flare, date, or any other flaw, then don't. Fix it as desired and post it elsewhere, then link to it here. Usually several people will look at it and offer feedback anyway.

BTW--the date-stamp feature is common in video, and may be useful for insurance or evidentiary purposes, particularly if the raw files are immediately copied to non-erasable media (CD-R).
 06/26/2002 03:12:41 AM · #31
Originally posted by Corey:
I have been using a D1x for a while and I have had a big problem with dust on the CCD which leaves dust on the image, the only way to get around it is to spot edit the dust out. To me this should not be illegal being that you are removing something that was not in the image but got on the CCD. You guys let me know what you think. This is a problem only with digital SLR cameras and not point and shoots becasue you can''t remove the lens from a point and shoot to expose it to the elements
Yes dust is a really serious issue with the D1 series (word is that the D100 won't be much better either). The consolation is that by the time I've resized the picture for DPChallenge it's usually not a problem. That said, I've had dust ruin some of my best macro work. However, I stick by what I said earlier in this thread - the only choices are "no spot editing" or "anything goes".

Corey - if you haven't come across them yet there are ways to clean the CCD (other than asking Nikon to do it) - if you're stuck then mail me and I'll send you some links.

 06/26/2002 04:17:06 AM · #32
Thanks Drew... and everyone else for your opinions. The weather was pretty good here for... well... part of the time you were here at least :). Too bad you came in winter, when it rains so much. And you know what? In a week I'll be in the US!
 06/26/2002 05:40:32 PM · #33
Originally posted by lisae:
Thanks Drew... and everyone else for your opinions. The weather was pretty good here for... well... part of the time you were here at least :). Too bad you came in winter, when it rains so much. And you know what? In a week I''ll be in the US!

cool! First time here? What part are you coming to?



* This message has been edited by the author on 6/26/2002 5:39:58 PM.
 06/26/2002 06:30:48 PM · #34
As to the point of having date stamps at all:

For a photography contest, yes they are useless. But some of us do take snapshots as well as "art pieces." It is handy for me when I am taking pictures of my little boy to have the date stamp on, then when I look back I know how old he was. And yes, I have forgotten it on when I was taking a picture for DPC. My alternatives? Crop or re-shoot. If you are taking a once in a lifetime shot for DPC, check to make sure it is turned off.

My vote? No spot editing.
 06/26/2002 06:59:19 PM · #35
Originally posted by GeneralE:
Originally posted by Corey:
[i]...this is a problem only with digital SLR cameras and not point and shoots becasue you can''t remove the lens from a point and shoot to expose it to the elements

But I'm not allowed to remove the speck of dust on my lens? How about that splattered bug on the windshield ruining my "Road" shot? How about just smoothing out those tiny wrinkles near the model's eye?

I can't see any way to compromise on this issue -- either allow or don't allow spot-edits. If you're a reasonable and compassionate voter, you will consider fctors which seem beyond the control of the photographer. But, ultimately, we can all choose to submit or not submit a photo here.

This site is (for now) designed to compare "unedited" images. If you don't want to submit your image for evaluation complete with dust, flare, date, or any other flaw, then don't. Fix it as desired and post it elsewhere, then link to it here. Usually several people will look at it and offer feedback anyway.

BTW--the date-stamp feature is common in video, and may be useful for insurance or evidentiary purposes, particularly if the raw files are immediately copied to non-erasable media (CD-R).[/i]

The speck of dust on your lens can be seen while you are taking the picture, you can check the front of your lens for that dust. Dust on the CCD is INSIDE the camera, you can only see it upon further review, usually only noticeable on a computer monitor. It dosen't do me much good to clean the dust off of the lens when that isn't where the dust is. According to the makers of the camera you need to send it back to them to clean it. I usually carry at least 2 lenses with me when I go out and every time I change one I run the risk of getting dust inside the camera, in that case I don't know it until I get a chance to get home and download, by then I am screwed and can't just retake the picture.
 06/26/2002 07:10:37 PM · #36
Why is there a ban on spot editing? Where would Ansel Adams be without it? It seems quite silly. It is a major part of digital photography. Why limit one of our best tools? Especially when, as so many have pointed out, if it is done well you will never know. There is more to photography than just recording the image. What is done with it is just as important. Most of the best photographers are also great in the darkroom.

How about having periodic contests that allow a "no holds barred" approach to editing?
 06/26/2002 07:33:22 PM · #37
Originally posted by Zeissman:
Why is there a ban on spot editing?

To level the playing field. As the admins have said before, if you don't like it, go start your own site.
 06/26/2002 08:27:47 PM · #38
Originally posted by Zeissman:
How about having periodic contests that allow a "no holds barred" approach to editing?


That actually sounds like a good idea. Perhaps we could revisit this once the site expands to multiple challenges per week?

-Terry
 06/27/2002 12:39:36 AM · #39
cool! First time here? What part are you coming to?

Yeah, it's my first time overseas at all! We're going all over the place, starting in Florida to meet some friends, going on a road trip with some people up north, meeting other friends in Boston and New York, then going to Phoenix Arizona to stay with... more friends, and see the Grand Canyon and some guy's telescope, then to San Antonio in Texas to go to SIGGRAPH (a big computer graphics conference). Plus I have some relatives in Albequerque. A big 3 week trip!
 06/27/2002 12:44:50 AM · #40
Originally posted by lisae:
[i]cool! First time here? What part are you coming to?

Yeah, it''s my first time overseas at all! We''re going all over the place, starting in Florida to meet some friends, going on a road trip with some people up north, meeting other friends in Boston and New York, then going to Phoenix Arizona to stay with... more friends, and see the Grand Canyon and some guy''s telescope, then to San Antonio in Texas to go to SIGGRAPH (a big computer graphics conference). Plus I have some relatives in Albequerque. A big 3 week trip![/i]

Sweet--you are in for a treat! A good friend of mine just spent a couple of months in Australia and New Zealand--sent me post cards from many places--very beautiful there! If you happen to stop on the coast of NC going to Boston, (Hwy 17 or I-95 the whole way) let me know!





* This message has been edited by the author on 6/27/2002 12:45:46 AM.
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