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DPChallenge Forums >> Hardware and Software >> Easily How to KILL your CAMERA, SO EASY!!!!
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 01/14/2005 11:10:50 PM · #1
hello challengers! I have the saddest problem of which happened to me today, i am still crying it is most like painful extent and hoping this warming will prevent other you from happening too!

i was with my friend who have a canon 20d new brand new and i have 10d, but he was going to taking photo of client with lighting setup in his full studio. his battery wireless died on his cordless transmitter to his lighting power pack so he is trying to using his pc cording connection, but then his camera was not working battery died, maybe? it was mystery but client waiting nicely and so he asking me for quick using of my camera and i gave and he hooking up to pc and my camera not working either! we gotten in repair destination nearby close and before they are closing and the persona said that our camera was like a kintucky friend chicken from the voltages of the power pack passing through the pc cable and ruining our cameras both of them instantly. they are completey passing away dead beyond. warranty from canon will not covering this mess it is most evil. i am still in shocking therapy. his bowens also will not covering any liability contention with our camera systems electocution, it is happening often is what repair said which is why he is recommending wireless all the time. i never hearding of this before or i would not give my camera but digital is supposing to be suspectable easily to this kinding of frying shock to ruin. that is my present story of gory. i am hopoing this is helping others beforehand!
 01/14/2005 11:22:08 PM · #2
I am very sorry to hear about the "demise" of two fine cameras :-(
I feel your pain; I'm sure we ALL do.
I didn't quite understand exactly HOW you fried them, but thanks for the warning anyway - a good reminder to be very careful with our precious gear.
 01/14/2005 11:37:20 PM · #3
Originally posted by Beetle:
I didn't quite understand exactly HOW you fried them,
I didn't get if it was tethered to the PC or the lighting power box. Both are cappable of transmitting surges. If it was a PC then something on the PC is fried too. If it was the power pack she may have recourse. Or the friend who borrowed her camera may find a way of covering the loss. That would be fair.
 01/14/2005 11:40:33 PM · #4


Man that sucks. That's one of the reasons I don't like lending any of my equipment.
 01/14/2005 11:42:36 PM · #5
I am sure you are devestated. Sorry for your loss.
 01/14/2005 11:47:54 PM · #6
A pcsync cord hooked from the camera to a studio strobe can do this?
 01/14/2005 11:52:29 PM · #7
Originally posted by photomayhem:
A pcsync cord hooked from the camera to a studio strobe can do this?


Electricity can be some funny shit. As Billy Bob would say, not ha ha funny either.
 01/15/2005 12:03:10 AM · #8
That's odd.... The Manual states that the 20D is good for 250V, either polarity on the PC connector. Not sure of the rating for the 10D...

I've not heard of a bowens unit that had a higher sync voltage than 180... Do you know what voltage the bowens was running at?

You weren't using a hot-shoe pc adaptor were you? It's only safe for 12V from memory, and you can definately toast the camera that way.

Cheers, Chris H.


01/15/2005 12:32:15 AM · #9
Originally posted by KiwiChris:
That's odd.... The Manual states that the 20D is good for 250V, either polarity on the PC connector. Not sure of the rating for the 10D...

I've not heard of a bowens unit that had a higher sync voltage than 180... Do you know what voltage the bowens was running at?

You weren't using a hot-shoe pc adaptor were you? It's only safe for 12V from memory, and you can definately toast the camera that way.

Cheers, Chris H.

Are you sure about the 20D being good for 250 volts? The Canon 10D sync voltage is 6 volts. A lttle over shouldn't hurt, but too much more than that and you risk burning out the flash contacts, which are part of the shutter assembly. That's one of the reasons why I bought AlienBees lighting equipment. Many of the other brands have much higher voltages.


01/15/2005 12:42:55 AM · #10
Originally posted by micknewton:
Originally posted by KiwiChris:
That's odd.... The Manual states that the 20D is good for 250V, either polarity on the PC connector. Not sure of the rating for the 10D...

I've not heard of a bowens unit that had a higher sync voltage than 180... Do you know what voltage the bowens was running at?

You weren't using a hot-shoe pc adaptor were you? It's only safe for 12V from memory, and you can definately toast the camera that way.

Cheers, Chris H.

Are you sure about the 20D being good for 250 volts? The Canon 10D sync voltage is 6 volts. A lttle over shouldn't hurt, but too much more than that and you risk burning out the flash contacts, which are part of the shutter assembly. That's one of the reasons why I bought AlienBees lighting equipment. Many of the other brands have much higher voltages.


Yeah, the 20D is safe to 250V since they switched to a semiconductor switch. Most of the Pro EOS film cameras are also 250V sync.

The speedotron strobes I used to use had a sync cable that was a 2 prong extension cord. This was convenient because you could just go get a really long cord from the hardware store. It was bad because you could also plug your camera's sync connector directly into the electrical socket in the wall (definitely NOT a recommended procedure).

Message edited by author 2005-01-15 00:44:06.
 01/15/2005 12:47:30 AM · #11
From the Canon 20D press release.

...

A semiconductor switch replaces the traditional sync contacts, ending scorching and frictional wear while at the same time increasing the limit for trigger circuit voltage to 250V. The result of these changes is a more rugged and reliable shutter unit with substantially improved performance.

...

ED: Oops too slow...

Message edited by author 2005-01-15 00:47:59.
 01/15/2005 12:50:06 AM · #12
According to this Canon Knowledge Bank article, the safe trigger circuit voltage (TCV) rating for EOS-1D, EOS-1Ds, and EOS-1D Mark II cameras is 250V. For the D30, D60, 10D, and 300D, it's 6V. The article doesn't mention the 20D, probably because it's so new, but I would expect it to be a 6V camera.

Anyway, a Wein Safe-Sync might have saved two very expensive cameras.


01/15/2005 12:55:29 AM · #13
Is your camera insured? if so you may be able to claim from that, All my gear is covered thru my home policy, and I have never had a problem with any claims.
 01/15/2005 12:56:48 AM · #14
Originally posted by KiwiChris:
The Manual states that the 20D is good for 250V, either polarity on the PC connector. Not sure of the rating for the 10D...


What does PC refer to in this? What is this acronym?
 01/15/2005 12:57:00 AM · #15
Originally posted by Spazmo99:
Yeah, the 20D is safe to 250V since they switched to a semiconductor switch. Most of the Pro EOS film cameras are also 250V sync.

Really? Okay, yet another reason to upgrade my 10D. Of course, I'm trying to get my wife to let me buy a 1Ds-MkII so I'll be keeping my 10D for quite a while.

Originally posted by Spazmo99:
It was bad because you could also plug your camera's sync connector directly into the electrical socket in the wall (definitely NOT a recommended procedure).

That might make a nice flash... once.


01/15/2005 01:09:17 AM · #16
The PC is a camera terminal that you cable up your strobes to in order to synchronize shutter and flash.

Originally posted by DJLuba:
Originally posted by KiwiChris:
The Manual states that the 20D is good for 250V, either polarity on the PC connector. Not sure of the rating for the 10D...


What does PC refer to in this? What is this acronym?
01/15/2005 01:12:43 AM · #17
Originally posted by Olyuzi:
The PC is a camera terminal that you cable up your strobes to in order to synchronize shutter and flash.


Is this where I currently hook up my remote shutter release cable?

01/15/2005 01:23:23 AM · #18
Originally posted by micknewton:
The article doesn't mention the 20D, probably because it's so new, but I would expect it to be a 6V camera.

Anyway, a Wein Safe-Sync might have saved two very expensive cameras.


Hi-ho,

Yeah, low voltage on the hot-shoe, (Where you would put the wein Safe-Sync, BTW). On the sync connector (as others have mentioned...) it's good for 250V. I've used mine with a set of old elinchromes (sp?) that were 100V and had no problems..

I wouldn't dream of running them through the hot shoe, the only thing that goes on there is the dedicated flash. (580ex in this case.). The hot shoe is a direct digital interface of some sort into the cameras processor, not a place for old high-voltage flashes.

Cheers, Chris H.
 01/15/2005 01:26:13 AM · #19
Originally posted by DJLuba:
Originally posted by Olyuzi:
The PC is a camera terminal that you cable up your strobes to in order to synchronize shutter and flash.


Is this where I currently hook up my remote shutter release cable?


Nup.

The D100 dosn't have a pc-sync socket. I Just looked at the review on dpreview.com, it's one of the 'cons' in the conclusion. Odd thing to leave out on a 'pro' camera...

Cheers, Me.
 01/15/2005 01:30:08 AM · #20
Originally posted by DJLuba:
Originally posted by KiwiChris:
The Manual states that the 20D is good for 250V, either polarity on the PC connector. Not sure of the rating for the 10D...


What does PC refer to in this? What is this acronym?


See This on photonotes.org. I keep it bookmarked for people who ask. :-).
 01/15/2005 01:35:25 AM · #21
Originally posted by KiwiChris:
See This on photonotes.org. I keep it bookmarked for people who ask. :-).


Ok cool. The âPCâ here stands for âProntor/Compur,â via that link you sent. Nothing other than an electrical trigger. I don't think I'd use one anyway, so I guess I don't have to worry about blowing up my camera.

Thanks for the info.
 01/15/2005 01:49:32 AM · #22
Originally posted by DJLuba:
Originally posted by KiwiChris:
See This on photonotes.org. I keep it bookmarked for people who ask. :-).


Ok cool. The âPCâ here stands for âProntor/Compur,â via that link you sent. Nothing other than an electrical trigger. I don't think I'd use one anyway, so I guess I don't have to worry about blowing up my camera.

Thanks for the info.


Ay... In older cameras (And some modern ones...) the PC sync connector simply runs to the actual shutter mechanism.

There is a small metal contact, on the 'front' curtain of the shutter. When the shutter is fully open, the contact touches another bit of metal.. The two contacts are wired to the PC socket. I assume Prontor/Compur were the first firms to do this in their shutter mechanisims?

So when the first curtain is fully open, the flash(s) fire.

And, going a bit futher, because I'm avoiding paperwork... The 'X-Sync' speed is the fastest shutter speed that this will work at, because the 'hole' is fully open in the camera.. At faster than 'X-Sync' the second/back shutter starts to close before the first one is fully open, exposing a 'slot' of the sensor/film rather than the whole thing.

Also, hence the term 'front and back' shutter sync with some cameras (or 1st and 2nd curtain if you're a canon user). It refered to which curtain/blind/shutter contact you were running the sync port off.

Although 2nd shutter sync is activated just before the second curtain starts to close, so it's slightly more complex, but I'm not going to cloud what was a perfectly simple explanation with facts.. :-).

A link with more shutter trivia..

//www.cs.mtu.edu/~shene/DigiCam/User-Guide/EXT-FLASH/BASICS/sync-speed.html

(This is relevent for dSLR's as well, although the ones on the site are film).

Cheers, Chris H.
 01/15/2005 07:04:15 AM · #23
Why is it.. that everytime I find something I love to do.. I find out that you have to pretty much become an expert tradesman in something I *DESPISE* doing, in order to do it?

Now I'd have to be a certified electrician just to have a studio set-up!? ARRGGHH!!

That's it.. I'm curling up in bed and saying screw the world.
 01/15/2005 07:21:52 AM · #24
No you don't have to be a certified electrician - but anytime you're dealing with electricity it helps to know what's going on, don't you think? It's one of the most dangerous things we use on a daily basis - it can kill you, it can start fires etc. - and the level of lack of knowledge about it generally is frightening.

It's really quite simple to grasp tha basics, and enough to keep you out of trouble.

Ed
 01/15/2005 07:24:16 AM · #25
Originally posted by e301:
No you don't have to be a certified electrician - but anytime you're dealing with electricity it helps to know what's going on, don't you think? It's one of the most dangerous things we use on a daily basis - it can kill you, it can start fires etc. - and the level of lack of knowledge about it generally is frightening.

It's really quite simple to grasp tha basics, and enough to keep you out of trouble.

Ed


I hate knowing what's going on.. I get into more trouble knowing than not.

I've managed to survive 31 years without having the slightest clue what can happen if I stick my tongue in a socket, and that's good enough for me! :) I just think that camera *equipment*, and cameras, should have a standard, and that everything should be able to plug into everything else and just.. work.
Is that so wrong?
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