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 04/19/2004 02:42:52 PM · #1
Several photographs have been the center of discussion with the Site Council over the past few days, and after much deliberation on our part, the Site Council has determined by a majority vote that 3 submissions violated the spirit and letter of the advanced editing rules. Generally, those entries had pieces that were fabricated or rendered and did not satisfy the rule that submissions could not come from multiple sources. The affected users have been notified, and the window View, Chaos, and Motion Blur challenges have all been recalculated.

Thanks for your patience with us in coming to our conclusions regarding these matters. We're still finishing up our efforts, but it was clear that the Site Council decided by a majority that these submissions needed to be disqualified, and so we've taken that step.

Drew
 04/19/2004 02:48:55 PM · #2
Thank you,
I have keept quiet about the matter up to this point. I just want to say that seeing that picture there in 2nd place after I had sent in a DQ request really disapponted me. I'm glad that I am not the only one who thought it violated the spirit of photography. Thanks again, now I think I'll go and take some pictures for this weeks challenge.
 04/19/2004 02:54:16 PM · #3
Thank you for doing the right thing!
 04/19/2004 02:55:42 PM · #4
Thank you from the non DSLR owning non graphic designers.

Message edited by author 2004-04-19 14:57:42.
 04/19/2004 02:57:06 PM · #5
Good job. But I have a question. Isn't the Blue Ribbon winner in Windows also an example of adding something to the original image? Not that it wasn't a beautiful result, but, did the Site Council consider DQing this picture as well?

::::shrug::: I'm sooooo confused now...
 04/19/2004 02:58:24 PM · #6
Now, if you can just get rid of two more in the Windows View category, I'll make it to the top 10 ;-)

Thanks for doing the right thing!
 04/19/2004 02:59:31 PM · #7
Originally posted by lenkphotos:
Now, if you can just get rid of two more in the Windows View category, I'll make it to the top 10 ;-)

Thanks for doing the right thing!


Mentioning Motion Blur got my hopes up, I have to confess :)


04/19/2004 03:02:25 PM · #8
Originally posted by boomer:
Good job. But I have a question. Isn't the Blue Ribbon winner in Windows also an example of adding something to the original image? Not that it wasn't a beautiful result, but, did the Site Council consider DQing this picture as well?

::::shrug::: I'm sooooo confused now...


And....the 1st place image was not even taken through, from, or into a window. The challenge clearly states the criteria and this image fails.
So I trust you will finish the job in due course!
 04/19/2004 03:02:30 PM · #9
Originally posted by boomer:
Good job. But I have a question. Isn't the Blue Ribbon winner in Windows also an example of adding something to the original image? Not that it wasn't a beautiful result, but, did the Site Council consider DQing this picture as well?

::::shrug::: I'm sooooo confused now...

We can't vote on that one until we receive the original image, which the photographer has 48 hours to submit. It may then require discussion; it will certainly take some time for all SC members to have a chance to review and vote.
 04/19/2004 03:05:25 PM · #10
Originally posted by ElGordo:
And....the 1st place image was not even taken through, from, or into a window. The challenge clearly states the criteria and this image fails.
So I trust you will finish the job in due course!

"Not meeting the challenge" is explicity NOT grounds for DQ. I am in favor of creative interpretations of the challenge. The image may or may not be DQ'd on other grounds.
 04/19/2004 03:07:38 PM · #11
thank you
 04/19/2004 03:16:08 PM · #12
Funny that the first place winner in the windows whas all day verry active sustaining photoshop manipulated images in the forums but did not have time to submit proof. Thank you Drew for deciding this should be a photography site.

Message edited by author 2004-04-19 15:17:00.
 04/19/2004 03:20:21 PM · #13
Originally posted by frumoaznicul:
Funny that the first place winner in the windows whas all day verry active sustaining photoshop manipulated images in the forums but did not have time to submit proof. Thank you Drew for deciding this should be a photography site.

Proof was not REQUESTED until some time after the challenge closed, after which they have 48 hours to submit the original image. There is nothing out of the ordinary in this procedure as of now ... please be patient and don't make assumptions.
 04/19/2004 03:24:46 PM · #14
ok sorry :) couldn't help it.
 04/19/2004 03:25:01 PM · #15
Originally posted by Gordon:
Originally posted by lenkphotos:
Now, if you can just get rid of two more in the Windows View category, I'll make it to the top 10 ;-)

Thanks for doing the right thing!


Mentioning Motion Blur got my hopes up, I have to confess :)


Did you think there was a DQ in the works somewhere in the Motion Blur top 3 Gordon? ;)
 04/19/2004 03:33:36 PM · #16

"Not meeting the challenge" is explicity NOT grounds for DQ. I am in favor of creative interpretations of the challenge. The image may or may not be DQ'd on other grounds. [/quote]

Does this mean that broad interpretations of the challenge theme are encouraged? For example, in the current challenge "Where You Live" could be construed to mean the entire planet or perhaps even, the entire universe!
 04/19/2004 03:44:37 PM · #17
Is there someplace where we can view the DQ'd entries? I only got a brief look at the former 2nd place window view entry and would like to go back and study it further. I'm also curious to see what else was disqualified.

-Ryan
 04/19/2004 03:51:38 PM · #18
Originally posted by ElGordo:
Does this mean that broad interpretations of the challenge theme are encouraged? For example, in the current challenge "Where You Live" could be construed to mean the entire planet or perhaps even, the entire universe!


Yup - but that's okay. As long as a photo is 'legal' (i.e. not a result of two or more images superimposed) it is up to us voters to interprete the pictures and its relation to the challenge of the week.

I will vote for people that consider the planet "where you live" as long as the photo is equally ambigious.
For example: If a guy in Springfield takes a picture of Golden Gate I will not vote for it but if I see a picture of a spring flower sprouting out of the ground with a 'generic house' in the background I will vote for it (providing it has photographic value). If that symbolises where you live to you , then I'll take your word for it!

Message edited by author 2004-04-19 15:52:29.
 04/19/2004 03:55:57 PM · #19
Originally posted by ElGordo:
"Not meeting the challenge" is explicity NOT grounds for DQ. I am in favor of creative interpretations of the challenge. The image may or may not be DQ'd on other grounds.


Does this mean that broad interpretations of the challenge theme are encouraged? For example, in the current challenge "Where You Live" could be construed to mean the entire planet or perhaps even, the entire universe! [/quote]

As broad as I think challenge entries can, and should be interpreted, i think to say the earth and the universe would push the boundaries of this challenge a little to far.

Challenge Details: Show us your village, town or city, from a new perspective. Put the guide books to shame, and be creative.

Tom

04/19/2004 03:59:42 PM · #20
Thank You Site Council and admins. A major step in the right direction IMHO.
 04/19/2004 04:02:59 PM · #21
Originally posted by Are_62:
Originally posted by ElGordo:
Does this mean that broad interpretations of the challenge theme are encouraged? For example, in the current challenge "Where You Live" could be construed to mean the entire planet or perhaps even, the entire universe!


Yup - but that's okay. As long as a photo is 'legal' (i.e. not a result of two or more images superimposed) it is up to us voters to interprete the pictures and its relation to the challenge of the week.

I will vote for people that consider the planet "where you live" as long as the photo is equally ambigious.
For example: If a guy in Springfield takes a picture of Golden Gate I will not vote for it but if I see a picture of a spring flower sprouting out of the ground with a 'generic house' in the background I will vote for it (providing it has photographic value). If that symbolises where you live to you , then I'll take your word for it!


But how would you know the picture of the Golden Gate was taken by a guy in Springfield?
 04/19/2004 04:04:33 PM · #22
Isn't anywhere you happen to be standing 'where you live' ? If I wasn't alive when I took the picture then perhaps it wasn't where I live - but otherwise ?

Gordon MkII. Citizen of the world.
 04/19/2004 04:29:49 PM · #23
Originally posted by Gordon:
Isn't anywhere you happen to be standing 'where you live' ? If I wasn't alive when I took the picture then perhaps it wasn't where I live - but otherwise ?

Gordon MkII. Citizen of the world.


I'm just working with the specifics of "city, town or village". Hell i'm going camping this week, I should be able to get some great shots of the Catskills, but I don't live there. So, to preserve my own integrity within this community, I will not submit photos of the mountains. As far as I can recall, there are not to many mountain ranges in NYC. This directly relates to some of the nonsense going on at this site currently. What is really gained by decieving the other members of this site? I am a photographer, I take pictures with my digital camera, then put them on my computer. Do I use PS for post proccessing? Yes. However, I use it to adjust my photos color balance and tonal qualities. I use it to crop my image. Not having posted an entry to the members challenges yet (just became a member 4/17) I have not had the chance to use the cloning tool (use the clone tool to remove dust spots which is explicitly defined in the rules, so cloning major elements of my image from on spot to another seems to me to be bending, if not, outright breaking the rule. I joined this site because of its rules and dedication to photography. (continued)

Message edited by author 2004-04-19 16:50:41.
 04/19/2004 04:30:05 PM · #24
I want to learn to use my camera and become a better photographrer first and foremost. Am I learning to use PS? Of course. Do I want to be an artist with PS and not my camera? No. It is for these reasons that I do not, nor will I enter photos that "stretch" the rules. I understand JMSetzler's frustration, I hope that he sees that there are many people who feel the same way he does and changes his mind about removing his informative and well thought out articles. As Ben Franklin said, "We must all hang together or most assuredly, we shall all hang separately."
04/20/2004 02:24:50 AM · #25
Thanks CC for making the right decision. I think it is great to uphold photography in this site. I do think however, in response to Brooklyn, that PS is important to know how to use and to be very skilled at. Just as before, when taking pictures with film. Taking the pictures was only half of the skill. The other half was in the dark room. When taking pictures with film, just as much time, or more was spent in the dark room printing my shots (playing with contrast, dodging, burning, etc). PS, is the digital darkroom.
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