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01/31/2004 05:30:12 AM · #1 |
I have read a lot about DSC-F828, I decided to buy f717, but now I am doubting again, because if I buy a camera I'd like to buy a very good one, and for $300 more I could buy the dsc-f828.
I have seen a lot of SLR cameras, but you can't see the photo in the LCD, they are big, heavy, but also they have a very good image quality and very little noise, and you can change the lenses, although with a 26-200 mm, you mustn't change anything (SONY DSC-F828).
So I want your advice, I saw the new Nikon D70, and I like it, but it is very expensive.
THANKS
Message edited by author 2004-01-31 05:32:38.
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01/31/2004 05:39:28 AM · #2 |
I appreciate my 300D, but bear in mind I spent way beyond the $1000 (or what it would be if I were in the US) just for the camera.. The main extra expense is lenses. Had I not borrowed a lens from my dad, I'd have spent ~$800 just on lenses. And that's for a relatively basic set - I'm not talking expensive stuff.
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01/31/2004 06:23:26 AM · #3 |
I think I'm in the $5k range already. Camera + 5 lenses + filters + battery grip + remote trigger/timer + CF cards + extra battery + neckstrap + hand strap + flash + whatever I'm forgetting. Granted a lot of items were gifts so I can't exactly say I'm out of pocket for all of it but it adds up rather quickly.
That being said I would personally spend the extra $300 and call it an investment. The feature set of the 828, in my opinion, more than justify the extra money and I think it is the more capable camera. The only reason I would suggest a person not get the 828 over the 717 is if they were a camera hopper. If you don't plan on having the same camera next year or the year after save the money and get the lesser camera. |
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01/31/2004 06:35:40 AM · #4 |
Do you know if Sony is going to bring out a new proffesional camera? Or a "DSC-F838"?
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01/31/2004 07:18:31 AM · #5 |
| If current naming conventions hold it would probably be a 939. The one thing you can count on though is there will always be another new camera coming out in a fairly short period of time. If you're really concerned about a new camera coming out I wouldn't buy one until after PMA which ends on Feb. 15. |
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01/31/2004 07:22:10 AM · #6 |
Dani - go with the 828 for now. Then maybe upgrade to a dslr, if you need to, later. Dont forget if you go dslr you will find you will be carrying round more kit. With the 828 its all in one. Having said all that I would not be without my 300D. I had a fuji s602z and it was (still is, my son has it now) a great camera but I found that it had its limitations with regard to the zoom range.
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01/31/2004 08:05:59 AM · #7 |
Do not hurry!!!
I won't buy a digital camera until July, so I can wait.
Where did you read that Sony is going to bring out the dsc-f939?
Yes I know if I buy a digital camera maybe the day before would be a better one. And that is what I can't cope!! :-(
Message edited by author 2004-01-31 08:37:53.
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01/31/2004 08:42:50 AM · #8 |
| I didn't mean to imply that I read that Sony announced a 939 only that following their way of naming it would most likely be a 939 instead of an 838. 717 -> 828 -> 939 |
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01/31/2004 09:02:42 AM · #9 |
Wait for Nikon Coolpix 8700 or Nikon D70.
You can compare Sony 828 with Nikon 8700 and Canon 300D with Nikon D70. Nikon 8700 goes out March while Nikon D70 by April. |
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01/31/2004 10:40:30 AM · #10 |
Dani,
I'd reiterate Shroom's comment about extra expense. Since you're just getting into this I'd suggest you go with the all-in-one idea of the DSC-F828. I started with the Sony DSC-S85 and loved it. When I decided to go with a dSLR I got the best body I could find that was compatible with the lens (singular) that I had. Since then I've invested (blown) several thousand dollars adding to my collection. If you have a top budget of $1000 then definitely go for the complete package in one piece and the 828 looks like its a great deal. If you don't mind sinking $4-5,000 on body, nice lenses, large flashes, etc then maybe you're in the market for a dSLR. You can almost always buy accessories for point-n-shoot but it seems to me that SLR equipment is just more expensive.
Kev
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01/31/2004 10:49:55 AM · #11 |
Yes, Sony could bring out a 939 but it can also be a 838, like dsc-f707 and dsc-f717.
Why should I wait for Nikon's cameras?
I have seen the Coolpix 8700, but I don't like its lenses, I prefer dsc-f828.
And Nikon D70... I think it's too expensive, my budget is $1300 and only the body and lenses cost $1300. I would like to buy memory, some filters and a bag.
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01/31/2004 11:12:30 AM · #12 |
Purchasing my 10d and goodies is getting close to the $4000 mark already.
The $1500 camera just begs for lots of extra money to be spent along the way...
$1500 - Canon 10d
$359 - Sigma 105mm macro lens
$414 - Canon 75-300mm lens
$209 - Canon 28-105mm lens
$179 - Canon 420ex flash
$249 - 1gb CF Card
$235 - Kanguru 20gb portable hard drive
$49 - Extra battery
$99 - New Camera bag
$175 - Bigazz Bogen Tripod rig from Ebay
$99 - Portable Bogen Tripod rig
$106 - Bogen monopod and ball head
$65 - 3 new ND filters
$59 - new polarizer
$49 - warm/soft fx filter
$22 - Lens hood for the 300mm canon lens
$250 - Phase One Capture One SE software
I think that is about everything but i'm not finished buying yet. That totals up to a little over $4100. That also doesn't include the new computer that I put together to get me out of the slow post processing... I needed a new computer anyway so I don't lump that into the cost of doing photography :)
Now... to the original question...
The DLSR and cameras like the Sony 828 shouldn't really be compared side by side in most cases. They are targeted at two different markets (possibly excluding the 300d and the D70). We have about 4 different markets of buyers in my estimation...
1. The professional
2. The advanced amateur hobbyist / semi pro
3. The hobbyist
4. The point and shooter
The Canon 10d / Nikon D100 and cameras above this level are most likely targeting group 1 and 2. The camera body is only a small part of the overall expense of buying into this market. These cameras offer added flexibility and durability.
The Nikon D70 / Canon 300d / Sony 828 level of cameras are likely targeting group 2 (and group 3 people who don't mind spending money.) These cameras offer high quality imaging but do not include all the flexibility and durability of the group 1 cameras. I believed they are designed to fill a gap between enthusiasts and more serious photographers. Each of these (and the others in the class) are formidable cameras and are capable of producing excellent work.
The rest of the cameras in the market ( <$600 ) are targeted at group 3 and 4 buyers. The flexibility and durability are more limited. They are for the more casual shooters and do not often offer the flexibilities that are required from the other groups.
My own philosophy on buying cameras is a bit different that what I see around here and in my own community. The price should not really dictate what you buy. Your needs should do this. If you are a first time buyer, this is more difficult to see. You don't know what your needs are other than the need to 'take pictures' :). This being the case, set yourself a budget and spend the maximum amount you have available on a camera. It may turn out to be more than you need, but that is not a bad thing. If you end up buying less than you need, you could get discouraged... stop shooting... or turn around and go buy a new more expensive camera pretty quickly.
For a hobby, it's not usually a good idea to look for the cheapest solutions.
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01/31/2004 11:27:49 AM · #13 |
I am completely agree with you. My budget is around $1300 and I want to buy a good digital camera.
I want to photograph only as a hobby.
And I want to buy a camera, memory (around 128-512MB), a bag and a polarizer.
So I can't spend all the money in a SLR which costs $1300, because I won't have enough money for the memory.
What do you think?
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01/31/2004 11:35:56 AM · #14 |
| Not to change the queston, but will I be happy with a Digital rebel? |
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01/31/2004 02:46:20 PM · #15 |
Depends...what don't you like about your DSC-S75? When I went from an F717 to a 10D I had very specific list of things I wanted that the F717 didn't have but the 10D had. Cost and weight are a big disadvantage with a DSLR - as much as I love the images from the 10D I also know that to get the same quality and versatility as my F717 from the 10D, I need to carry a lot more gear. This is a sacrifice I was willing to make. If you prefer a small, highly flexible package that doesn't cost a lot of money, maybe you'd be happier with something smaller - the new Nikon 5700 replacement or the F828 looks like a good alternative for someone who's not sure what they want but who certainly wants a quality camera.
Originally posted by dtouch1:
Not to change the queston, but will I be happy with a Digital rebel? |
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01/31/2004 03:41:47 PM · #16 |
Originally posted by dtouch1:
Not to change the queston, but will I be happy with a Digital rebel? |
I'm extremely happy with the images that i get from the 300d. I do quite a bit of unconventional photography with it, and have so far only once missed a feature from the 10D that isn't included on the 300d - the 9-shot burst. the rebel only does 4 shots, missed a bird landing that I'd have liked to capture. Otherwise i occasionally think mirror lockup would be nice, but i don't notice the mirror-shake much since i have a kickass tripod.
Setz has concerns about the 300d durability because of the plastic body, which i disagree with. I think the body will outlast the technology...it'll be obsolete before it's broken :) They made lens mount metal, and that's where they tend to wear with repeated lens changes, so no worries there. The 300d even has a few advantages over the 10d, including a faster AF and a new line of digital-only lenses that aren't compatible with the 10d.
As for the lcd thing - I kept my 5700 so i get the best of both worlds.
This is not to say i won't eventually want the 10d/D100...I'm just saying you won't be disappointed with the 300d.
edit: @setz: just because i disagree with you doesn't mean i don't still love you, man /highfive
Message edited by author 2004-01-31 15:44:17. |
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10/07/2004 05:32:45 PM · #17 |
I bought an F828 several weeks ago. I did a lot of research before buying the camera and I finally decided it was what I needed. However, when I opened the camera and started taking pictures, everything was slightly out of focus. It was SO annoying! I'm an amateur photographer and haven't really got into manual focus "stuff." I had everything on fully automatic. But everything was slightly out of focus. I finally returned the camera.
I still want to buy a new F828, but now I'm pretty skeptical. What are the chances of getting a defective camera two times in a row! Most stores have a 15% restocking fee, which makes me even more paranoid about buying a new one and having it "break" again! Has anyone else had this problem? Could it have just been a setting that I was overlooking?
I'd appreciate any help out there. Thanks! |
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10/07/2004 05:35:16 PM · #18 |
Originally posted by chafer:
I bought an F828 several weeks ago. I did a lot of research before buying the camera and I finally decided it was what I needed. However, when I opened the camera and started taking pictures, everything was slightly out of focus. It was SO annoying! I'm an amateur photographer and haven't really got into manual focus "stuff." I had everything on fully automatic. But everything was slightly out of focus. I finally returned the camera.
I still want to buy a new F828, but now I'm pretty skeptical. What are the chances of getting a defective camera two times in a row! Most stores have a 15% restocking fee, which makes me even more paranoid about buying a new one and having it "break" again! Has anyone else had this problem? Could it have just been a setting that I was overlooking?
I'd appreciate any help out there. Thanks! |
If I were you, id get a f717. ::cough cough:: I am actually selling one right now.
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10/07/2004 05:45:09 PM · #19 |
LOL Nice plug Hsteg.
I'm not sure about the Sony F line, but with alot of digital point-and-shoots, the reason you use the screen is because of the inferior mechanics which make it nearly impossible to accurately predict what the image will look like using the viewfinder.
Layman's terms: what you see ain't what you get. In the higher end cameras, you don't need an LCD for previewing because what's in the viewfinder is what will be captured. |
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10/07/2004 06:10:37 PM · #20 |
Get what you think is best, try some and go with your heart...but, beware, cos you will soon reach the limitations of your camera.
Whatever you choose, will not be right next week, next year...whatever!
The wise move is to go to DSLR, but the financial move is to keep within your budget and get the best you can within it. |
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10/07/2004 06:18:35 PM · #21 |
Originally posted by dani1989:
I am completely agree with you. My budget is around $1300 and I want to buy a good digital camera.
I want to photograph only as a hobby.
And I want to buy a camera, memory (around 128-512MB), a bag and a polarizer.
So I can't spend all the money in a SLR which costs $1300, because I won't have enough money for the memory.
What do you think? |
I just decided to upgrade from to an SLR, with a budget not too different. I bought a used 300D kit with lots of extras for $700, and now I can go out and get a reasonable telephoto lens.
If you don't mind buying used, there are many people now selling 10D's and 300Ds to upgrade to the 20D... and that way you can get a good SLR with memory and a lens or so and stay within budget.. |
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10/07/2004 06:40:16 PM · #22 |
> dani
When I 'upgraded' to the 10D with all the lenses and accessories I 'needed' to make my kind of shooting possible, I was not only broke but also found that I was missing shots I would not have missed with my F717.
Man, the thing, to me, is just a point and shoot: you raise it to the eye and, click, there's the pic - beautiful! It is, in my book, the best camera like it out there 'cept, perhaps, the F828.
I never used the LCD in the Sony, but I do rely on the viewfinder. It's very useful to see what your image looks like before you take it. The swivel body also is indispensable for many macros, high and low shots. It's useful for taking candids. It has functional spot meter. On the DSLR, I have a partial meter.
Yes, I do not regret having bought a DSLR. It is a different beast altogether. For all-around photography though, I can't live without my little, reliable, handy 717. It's a poor man's Leica, isn't it, hsteg? ;-)
I'd consider the Sonys, especially with your budget.
Message edited by author 2004-10-07 18:40:40.
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10/07/2004 06:54:34 PM · #23 |
Originally posted by zeuszen:
> dani
When I 'upgraded' to the 10D with all the lenses and accessories I 'needed' to make my kind of shooting possible, I was not only broke but also found that I was missing shots I would not have missed with my F717.
Man, the thing, to me, is just a point and shoot: you raise it to the eye and, click, there's the pic - beautiful! It is, in my book, the best camera like it out there 'cept, perhaps, the F828.
I never used the LCD in the Sony, but I do rely on the viewfinder. It's very useful to see what your image looks like before you take it. The swivel body also is indispensable for many macros, high and low shots. It's useful for taking candids. It has functional spot meter. On the DSLR, I have a partial meter.
Yes, I do not regret having bought a DSLR. It is a different beast altogether. For all-around photography though, I can't live without my little, reliable, handy 717. It's a poor man's Leica, isn't it, hsteg? ;-)
I'd consider the Sonys, especially with your budget. |
Poor mans leica? I think not, the sony is better. haha yeah right. but seriously, someone buy my f717.
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10/07/2004 07:11:18 PM · #24 |
Originally posted by GoldBerry:
I'm not sure about the Sony F line, but with alot of digital point-and-shoots, the reason you use the screen is because of the inferior mechanics which make it nearly impossible to accurately predict what the image will look like using the viewfinder.
Layman's terms: what you see ain't what you get. In the higher end cameras, you don't need an LCD for previewing because what's in the viewfinder is what will be captured. |
I don't know about you but I would rather twist the lcd on the body to get a shot then lie on the floor to get the same low angle.
Notice that the most ribbon winner jjbeguin moved to a F828.
Message edited by author 2004-10-07 19:15:14. |
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10/07/2004 09:28:30 PM · #25 |
I used to own the Sony F828 and found that the focusing issue was fixed by installing their latest firmware update from the sony website. After i did that it was taking fantastic pictures, the Carl Zeiss 28-200 f2.2 lens is very high quality. The only reason i sold mine was because i needed to be able to change lenses. Also being in Japan, my wifes father went to school with the president of Sony company and he said that they are releasing a body that accepts Carl Zeiss lenses. Sorry I have no dates I simply heard about it over dinner. He used to be a great photog himself and has several Nikon cameras (SLR FILM).
Anyway I highly reccomend the Sony F828 if you have no problem with a fixed lens it is surely one of the best prosumenr cameras on the market but you will need the firmware update...>HERE |
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