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DPChallenge Forums >> Current Challenge >> DQ for fake DOF?
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 01/16/2006 01:02:09 AM · #1
In the Singled Out challenge, shallow DOF is supposed to be an "important part" of the photograph.

So... if the shallow DOF is achieved in software rather than in-camera, does it become cause for DQ because a "major element" in the photograph for this challenge has been created rather than captured?
01/16/2006 01:03:31 AM · #2
AGREE!
 01/16/2006 01:05:52 AM · #3
no. It is legal. The way I am going to interpret it is the following...Does the picture work? Do I like the picture? Did the photographer succeed in the story he/she was trying to tell?

I am all for artistic freedom within the realm of assisting the photograph. And that includes using whatever tools are available both in and out of camera.

....as long as it is legal....
 01/16/2006 01:07:42 AM · #4
Nonsense! Half the members of this site do not have cameras that ALLOW shallow DOF; they use point 'n shoot cams with tiny sensors and very short lenses, and it's almost impossible to shoot shallow DOF in non-macro mode. Just relax and vote the image :-)

R.
 01/16/2006 01:07:57 AM · #5
no why should it?

Not everyone has a fancy lense and a dslr, some people cannot control thier aperture and therefore would have to use post processing to intensify an appearnace of shallow DOF.

There was no yellow flag on this challenge - so there is no reason why editting rules would be different than in any other challenge.
 01/16/2006 01:08:06 AM · #6
This is going to be an interesting discussion...

Spiritually, I'm with dwterry and pitsaman. I think dof play in camera is a crucial requirement for this challenge.

Practically, though, I think Cutter's point will have its way.
 01/16/2006 01:12:17 AM · #7
Originally posted by Bear_Music:
Nonsense! Half the members of this site do not have cameras that ALLOW shallow DOF; they use point 'n shoot cams with tiny sensors and very short lenses, and it's almost impossible to shoot shallow DOF in non-macro mode. Just relax and vote the image :-)

R.


Yup, that's how I'm voting.

But I purposely avoided any "added blurring" to my own shallow DOF figuring that it would not be legal in a challenge where DOF is supposed to play an important part. And since I see it happening in several of the images I've seen so far, I figure we better talk about it, get it out in the air.
01/16/2006 01:16:48 AM · #8
dwterry to indicate this needs discussion would be the say as discussing every photo entered in black and white that wasn't taken in camera as black and white being allowed because the photog desat'd in PP.

The rules allow selective blur in all challenges, this one included.
 01/16/2006 01:19:29 AM · #9
Originally posted by mesmeraj:
dwterry to indicate this needs discussion would be the say as discussing every photo entered in black and white that wasn't taken in camera as black and white being allowed because the photog desat'd in PP.

The rules allow selective blur in all challenges, this one included.


MES! I agree totally with you, and I think this is the first time too!

Horray! :)

Rose
 01/16/2006 01:21:01 AM · #10
The photos with 'fake' DOF will not be DQed simply because the DOF was achieved pp, since the DOF part was in the challenge description, which is seperate from the rules. This same discussion was held for the 'pink' challenge, where the hue was shifted on a particular subject to make it pink, when it wasn't.
It's no more of a major element than it is in every other photo. IF however, the fake DOF removes elements in the background, or the entire background, then maybe it could be DQed.
So no DQ for fake DOF.
01/16/2006 01:22:55 AM · #11
Funny thing is that my photo had amazing dof naturally but I edited the photo the way I edit most of my photos and I now realize that it gave the photo the appearance that the dof might have been added with post processing. hadn't thought about that till too late. stupid stupid stupid...

Message edited by author 2006-01-16 01:23:12.
 01/16/2006 01:28:45 AM · #12
Well, here's the question: How do you tell if dof is applied in camera or in pp? Some of us might have the expertise and experience to know on sight, but I'd reckon the vast majority of voters won't have a clue about the difference.

Any thought?
 01/16/2006 01:31:27 AM · #13
look for edges... sloppy PS will reveal sloppy edge blurs :)
 01/16/2006 01:33:26 AM · #14
Originally posted by rgo:
Well, here's the question: How do you tell if dof is applied in camera or in pp? Some of us might have the expertise and experience to know on sight, but I'd reckon the vast majority of voters won't have a clue about the difference.

Any thought?


The images that I noticed it on, had blurred people or objects right next to the person in focus. And yet, if you look around the image, you can see other objects or parts of the image that are amazingly in focus outside of the range of the main subject. It makes it look entirely fake because a lens can't do that.
 01/16/2006 01:34:46 AM · #15
RGO...if it's poorly done, it can be quite obvious, such as smear marks around the subject or something, but it doesn't matter if it's fake or real DOF, the photos will not be DQed, so please don't request them to be DQed for the reason that the DOF is 'fake'.
 01/16/2006 01:36:17 AM · #16
It does kinda kill the spirit of the Challenge, as I read it but it's perfectly legal.

If done well it's hard to tell but overkill is a piece of cake...look for some gradient continuity.

Message edited by author 2006-01-16 01:41:04.
 01/16/2006 01:42:53 AM · #17
Don't worry, I'm not looking for it. I'm just wondering how people would do that.

Even if it's legal, and all, I have no doubt people will look for fake dof and downvote. Would be a shame if someone who thinks s/he knows what s/he is doing ends up not giving the benefit of the doubt...
 01/16/2006 01:48:56 AM · #18
Originally posted by Rikki:
look for edges... sloppy PS will reveal sloppy edge blurs :)


Sloppy PS deserves a sloppy score anyway. Someone good with PS can probably fool 95% of the voters here though.
 01/16/2006 01:52:58 AM · #19
Originally posted by nsbca7:
Originally posted by Rikki:
look for edges... sloppy PS will reveal sloppy edge blurs :)


Sloppy PS deserves a sloppy score anyway. Someone great with PS can probably fool 100% of the voters here though.


Had to fix it. ;o)
 01/16/2006 02:00:57 AM · #20
I wish I'd thought to use this technique on my entry : (

Message edited by author 2006-01-16 02:01:35.
 01/16/2006 02:02:09 AM · #21
My score started off great and it's been going down in the last few votes. I think this Challenge might be a mess for me and I believe I covered every possible base, so Not to hear DNMC...or whatever. I though I left no room for voter error...but I was wrong. LOL
 01/16/2006 02:39:02 AM · #22
Originally posted by rgo:
Don't worry, I'm not looking for it. I have no doubt people will look for fake dof and downvote.

I wasn't looking for it, in fact the idea hadn't entered my conciousness ... then came an image that just looked seriously wrong. It took about 10secs to understand why.

Brett
 01/16/2006 02:48:54 AM · #23
Originally posted by KiwiPix:
Originally posted by rgo:
Don't worry, I'm not looking for it. I have no doubt people will look for fake dof and downvote.

I wasn't looking for it, in fact the idea hadn't entered my conciousness ... then came an image that just looked seriously wrong. It took about 10secs to understand why.

Brett


If it looks wrong, it looks wrong. Judge it that way.
 01/16/2006 03:00:58 AM · #24
If it's done right, then we shouldn't know it is a fake DOF. :-D

I'm with my old point and shoot buddies, photoshop is the way to go. I didn't enter the challenge, but I'd rather have a version with everything in focus that I can use for other things, and a specific edit for the challenge.

This background blurring was done with PS :-)
01/16/2006 07:48:04 AM · #25
Originally posted by Joey Lawrence:

This background blurring was done with PS :-)

There's a quite obvious giveaway halo of sharpness just past the edge of the santa hat :P
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