Editing - DPChallenge Forums

Canon EF 28-135mm F/3.5-5.6 IS USM

09/30/2002 10:05:20 AM · #1

It seems more people are going beyond the editing rules each week. The picture quality is getting better for some, while the ones that are still driving 65 mph. are getting behind. We seem to be forgetting photograph guidelines for these contests. Open up the rules of editing for all or start policing the images.

ClubJuggle

Canon EOS-400D Rebel XTi

09/30/2002 10:11:52 AM · #2

Originally posted by bobgaither:
It seems more people are going beyond the editing rules each week. The picture quality is getting better for some, while the ones that are still driving 65 mph. are getting behind. We seem to be forgetting photograph guidelines for these contests. Open up the rules of editing for all or start policing the images.

Bob,

If there are any images this week that you feel violate the rules, please submit a disqualification request and we will research it. We need a DQ request to start the ball rolling as there's no way we can possibly check entries without missing something. The DQ request button is there for a reason. Please use it if you feel it's necessary, but use it appropriately, and keep in mind many interesting effects can be achieved using legal means.

-Terry

-Terry

lionelm

Canon EOS-10D

Canon EF 28-135mm F/3.5-5.6 IS USM

09/30/2002 10:12:18 AM · #3

Sorry I do not understand.

ClubJuggle

Canon EOS-400D Rebel XTi

09/30/2002 10:20:28 AM · #4

Originally posted by lionelm:
Sorry I do not understand.

Who don't you understand? Me or Bob?

Bob is saying that the images need to be policed better for illegal editing... I'm saying that in order to do that we need DQ requests on the illegal edits.

-Terry

09/30/2002 10:36:07 AM · #5

lionelm

Canon EOS-10D

09/30/2002 11:14:44 AM · #6

I did not understand bob ... your answer make sense. There is a policy and a ;echanism already in place to take care of that.

09/30/2002 08:54:19 PM · #7

I would not turn anyone in for disqualification. I will just vote accordingly. I am just saying that there are people breaking the rules. I know that it is human nature in today's society that they think it's all right to cheat especially if you don't get caught. I know that I am a dying breed for honesty but that is the way I was taught. The ones that are doing it know who they are.

sjgleah

Olympus C-2100UZ

09/30/2002 09:35:04 PM · #8

Bob, in my opinion you are not only compromising yourself with your refusal to employ the dq mechanism but diminishing the site by doing so.

It's your business and your choice if you choose to compromise yourself. It impacts all of us if you disregard the rules and conventions of dpchallenge.

I don't understand your thinking. You raise an objection to bad things that you perceive are going on at the site, and then you choose to ignore the mechanism that was expressly conceived to deal with just the stuff you're upset about.

It's admirable that you are as honest as you say you are. It's dishonorable, however, to deliberately vote out of accordance with the site's rules and conventions.

sjgleah

aelith

Olympus C-3020Z

09/30/2002 09:40:17 PM · #9

Bob in my mind it is not ethical to make general and unsuported accusations. All you have achieved is to poisen the air around you. That is all I will allow myself to say.

Canon EF-S 18-55mm f/3.5-5.6 IS

09/30/2002 09:53:45 PM · #10

This is completely dishonourable; slandering the rest of us to make a point that you are not even willing to follow up in the prescribed manner. And it is a point with NO evidence whatsoever -- repeat, NO evidence -- except in your own imagination, Bob, unless you take it to the DQ panel and have it reviewed.

Gordon

RIM BlackBerry Curve

Canon EF 85mm f/1.8 USM

09/30/2002 10:16:43 PM · #11

Originally posted by bobgaither:
I would not turn anyone in for disqualification. I will just vote accordingly. I am just saying that there are people breaking the rules. I know that it is human nature in today's society that they think it's all right to cheat especially if you don't get caught. I know that I am a dying breed for honesty but that is the way I was taught. The ones that are doing it know who they are.

Bob, I personally would much prefer if you would actually bring
to our attention those that you believe are breaking the rules. We
take this very seriously and go to a lot of effort each week to validate
all the entries where any level of objection is raised.

If you believe that you are honestly finding such submissions, I'd have
thought you'd be honour-bound to give them the chance to prove their
validity, rather than just making assumptions that you cannot verify
without the assistance of the original photographer and image.

Otherwise I don't particularly like the way you were taught, which seems
to hold suspicion in higher regard than the actual truth.

Zeissman

Canon EOS-500D Rebel T1i

09/30/2002 11:06:54 PM · #12

Get a rope!

aelith

Olympus C-3020Z

09/30/2002 11:31:45 PM · #13

Originally posted by Zeissman:
Get a rope!

lol don't you just love our esprit d'ecorp?

chrisab

Canon EF 24-70mm f/2.8L USM

09/30/2002 11:43:30 PM · #14

Bob, nice attitude. It must suck living life with a boogie man behind every tree.

What happens in your personal value system when your assumption of cheating is proven wrong? You stated publicly in another thread that you gave my Fruit and Vegetable shot a lower score because you thought I cheated, even though I had an admin note. And yet when I posted outtakes after the challenge which clearly demonstrated that I got my shot legally, I didn't get any apology from you. When you mark us down because you think we've cheated, and then you're wrong, is there any recourse for us? I guess we should confine ourselves to creativity free, simple, photos can be mistaken neither for something edited nor artful?

Given the choice between the occasional uncaught spot edit and your arrogant ignorance, Bob, I'd take the former every time.

ClubJuggle

Canon EOS-400D Rebel XTi

Canon EF 28-135mm F/3.5-5.6 IS USM

09/30/2002 11:56:38 PM · #15

Originally posted by bobgaither:
I would not turn anyone in for disqualification. I will just vote accordingly. I am just saying that there are people breaking the rules. I know that it is human nature in today's society that they think it's all right to cheat especially if you don't get caught. I know that I am a dying breed for honesty but that is the way I was taught. The ones that are doing it know who they are.

Bob,

Please do not take it upon yoruself to vote someone down for what you suspect to be a rules violation. Instead, make the disqualification request and vote as if the effect were created legally. Almost every week we receive requests for disqualification for illegal editing and it turns out the effects were created legally. It is not fair to penalize a photographer for this.

When users act as judge, jury and executioner that only stifles innovation and in the end hurts us all. Instead, please make the DQ recommendaton, vote assuming the effect was created legally, and give us the opportunity to do our jobs.

Thanks,
Terry

* This message has been edited by the author on 9/30/2002 11:58:28 PM.

myqyl

Nikon D3100

Nikon AF-S Nikkor 18-55mm f/3.5-5.6G DX VR

10/01/2002 12:20:42 AM · #16

Originally posted by aelith:
Originally posted by Zeissman:
[i]Get a rope!

lol don't you just love our esprit d'ecorp?[/i]

Don't you mean esprit d'corpse

10/01/2002 12:47:08 AM · #17

Originally posted by chrisab:
Bob, nice attitude. It must suck living life with a boogie man behind every tree.

What happens in your personal value system when your assumption of cheating is proven wrong? You stated publicly in another thread that you gave my Fruit and Vegetable shot a lower score because you thought I cheated, even though I had an admin note. And yet when I posted outtakes after the challenge which clearly demonstrated that I got my shot legally, I didn't get any apology from you. When you mark us down because you think we've cheated, and then you're wrong, is there any recourse for us? I guess we should confine ourselves to creativity free, simple, photos can be mistaken neither for something edited nor artful?

Given the choice between the occasional uncaught spot edit and your arrogant ignorance, Bob, I'd take the former every time.

That is the reason I don't bring things up like this. I just wanted you all to be aware of what is going on. Choose to listen or not, I don't care. By the way chrisab I gave you a ten on Postcards and I thought it was an excellent photograph. I haven't accused you of cheating. I told you I gave you a five because of the detail and flash on the lemon. I did ask you how you did it but you gave me no respond. Then someone else must have questioned your photograph also to get an administration note. If you feel guilty or angry towards me I am sorry. If I thought you were cheating I would have given you a 1. So with that out the way, how did you do it?

sjgleah

Olympus C-2100UZ

10/01/2002 12:56:49 AM · #18

Uh, Bob, I don't think you get it.

sjgleah

chrisab

Canon EF 24-70mm f/2.8L USM

10/01/2002 01:09:47 AM · #19

Come on Bob, if you're going to accuse people of cheating, at least be man enough to stand up and say so.

In this thread:

//www.dpchallenge.com/forum.asp?action=read&FORUM_POST_ID=26546

You wrote, when explaining why you gave me a 5:

"The most important thing is I didn't know if this was editing or not?"

Not just a reason, Bob, but "the most important" reason you gave me a 5 is because you suspected me of editing my shot. Yet you didn't nominate it for DQ. And when I posted in comments how I got my shot at the end of the challenge, you didn't even bother to go and check to see if there was an explanation. And you didn't bother to offer an apology for marking me down due to your own ignorance and lack of imagination. What if your false assumption had cost me the difference between a 3rd place ribbon and 5th place... would you feel bad at all about your mistake? Or does it all balance out in the end because you eventually get around to marking everyone down at some point?

The fact that you'd stand up and admit to making such judgements is not something worthy of praise. In fact, it makes you look that much worse for somehow thinking your actions are justifiable.

If you'd still like to know how my shot was done, read my comments and look at my outtakes. I posted that information minutes after the challenge ended for people just like you.

Originally posted by bobgaither:

That is the reason I don't bring things up like this. I just wanted you all to be aware of what is going on. Choose to listen or not, I don't care. By the way chrisab I gave you a ten on Postcards and I thought it was an excellent photograph. I haven't accused you of cheating. I told you I gave you a five because of the detail and flash on the lemon. I did ask you how you did it but you gave me no respond. Then someone else must have questioned your photograph also to get an administration note. If you feel guilty or angry towards me I am sorry. If I thought you were cheating I would have given you a 1. So with that out the way, how did you do it?

lisae

Olympus C-720UZ

10/01/2002 01:18:28 AM · #20

Bobgaither only has one vote out of over 200. If he refuses to use it properly, it's not such a big deal.

JeB

HP PhotoSmart 945

10/01/2002 01:23:34 AM · #21

Lisae,
I view it more as an issue of integrity... He's blatantly accusing a lot of people of cheating. No if's, and's, or but's... they cheated! Then he asks the moderators to police each submission, when he has ample opportunity... *shrug* I don't get it :)

JB

Journey

Canon PowerShot G3

10/01/2002 01:35:09 AM · #22

Originally posted by bobgaither:

That is the reason I don't bring things up like this. I just wanted you all to be aware of what is going on. Choose to listen or not, I don't care. By the way chrisab I gave you a ten on Postcards and I thought it was an excellent photograph. I haven't accused you of cheating. I told you I gave you a five because of the detail and flash on the lemon. I did ask you how you did it but you gave me no respond. Then someone else must have questioned your photograph also to get an administration note. If you feel guilty or angry towards me I am sorry. If I thought you were cheating I would have given you a 1. So with that out the way, how did you do it?

Yes, you do bring it up: as a forum thread without specifying with which particular picture you have a problem so that, in essence, you taint all pictures.
You say "If I thought you were cheating I would have given you a 1". How do YOU know for sure someone is cheating? You may be dead wrong and it doesn't seem to bother you that you have given a perhaps very good, and probably very creative, picture a 1.

When voting started, there were 250 pictures to vote on, now there are only 248. In other words, the system works very well and we should rely on the System to either DQ a picture or clear the image, and any suspicion against the submitter, with a red Admins note.

10/01/2002 02:28:48 AM · #23

Chris if we continue this debate it will only get worst and we will only find out who will make a bigger ass of himself. I apologized and I am sorry. I never saw how you did your fruit picture for it was not on that thread. Now as far as art goes on this website there has not been that much for most of us are amateurs. Maybe witty and creative but just no art as yet. Your Seattle skyline was a very good picture and you should be proud of that one.

10/01/2002 07:56:20 AM · #24

I was gonna reply, but clearly bobgaither has no intention of seeing logic or sense or anything other than his own fevered imagination. Pointless dealing with children when they act this way.

* This message has been edited by the author on 10/1/2002 7:57:24 AM.