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08/07/2002 01:47:16 PM · #1 |
One of the comments on my current submission said that my main "focus" of the pic was a bit out of focus. Now I KNOW that I didn't submit a photo that's not in focus so I clicked on it and sure enough my image has an overall softer focus and less detail than my original. I went back to my original and noticed that everything is sharp and crisp. So I guess when we compress these photos to 640x480 we loose a lot of image quality. I know there's always the sharpening tool but I didn't want to go too crazy with that to make it look competelly different from what I started with.
So I guess my point is ... I'm going to be less harsh on pics I see that have less than a perfect sharpness. I wish we could upload these photos in a bit of a higher resolution and then have the viewer decide if they want to see the high or low res pic ... this could be in form of a button underneath each thumbnail ... I'm not sure how realistically do-able this is ... but it's a thought.
I'm just a bit sad that my pic is getting lower scores because of a "submission issue" ... but like I said ... I'll keep this problem in mind when I vote on similar photos.
You live and learn. :-) |
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08/07/2002 01:53:54 PM · #2 |
I think the some of the methods used to get to the 640x480 image are the source of the problem. I rarely see any image degradation when I build my images for this site. I start out with a 2560x1920 (or something close to that) pixel image. When I resample (not resize) down to 640 on the long side, my image looks just as sharp as the original in most cases.
Resample and Resize do NOT do the same thing.
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08/07/2002 01:54:00 PM · #3 |
one thing you could do ahead of time is to upload your photo to dpc and then look at it on screen. that way, you see what others will see when they vote on it, and if the focus seems soft to you, try and adjust it and upload again.
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08/07/2002 02:23:44 PM · #4 |
JM:
Would you please explain how to resample without resizing? I have Photoshop LE and the menu options: Image > Image Size brings up a box named Image Size. Within that box is a checkbox option for Resample but it is not a stand-alone option. Resampling is a step done in the resizing. What I am figuring is that the full version of Photoshop has options I am not seeing. But just in case, I'm asking.
Bart
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08/07/2002 02:29:13 PM · #5 |
jmsetzler,
NOW I'm absolutely totally confused. Should we RESAMPLE or RESIZE? I'm sure that before, someone had said to resize, but don't resample. Oh I just don't know.
Ruthann
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08/07/2002 03:28:52 PM · #6 |
| As long as you size your photo down..instead of up...I don't see where it would matter. I always open mine up in PhotoShop, make my adjustments, choose the marquee tool and choose fixed size in the option box. Then I just put the numbers in. I click on my photo and since the photo is going to be bigger, because I shoot them larger..I resize the image down...never up. Then I figure where I want to crop and that's it...is this a bad way to be doing this? I've never had that much of a problem with it unless my photo is just bad to start with. |
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08/07/2002 03:38:04 PM · #7 |
I will post more later on this issue. I started a tutorial on it until I heard that someone else was already doing one. I think I saved what I had done so far... I will dig it out when I get home and make it available...
What I fear here, is that some people may be using the resize command without resampling turned on. If this is the case, it is IMPERATIVE that the DPI setting be monitored during the process...
The tutorial that I started on depends on Adobe software. I only assume that Photoshop, Photoshop Elements, and Photoshop LE look similar on these screens...
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08/07/2002 04:04:27 PM · #8 |
john, i always get confused with these things, too, but i have limited edition versions of adobe photoshop and ulead photoimpact at home ... i'll be happy to try and figure out a 'translation' to photoimpact if you want to add that.
Originally posted by jmsetzler:
I will post more later on this issue. I started a tutorial on it until I heard that someone else was already doing one. I think I saved what I had done so far... I will dig it out when I get home and make it available...
What I fear here, is that some people may be using the resize command without resampling turned on. If this is the case, it is IMPERATIVE that the DPI setting be monitored during the process...
The tutorial that I started on depends on Adobe software. I only assume that Photoshop, Photoshop Elements, and Photoshop LE look similar on these screens...
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08/07/2002 04:28:38 PM · #9 |
Thanks, John ... can't wait for that tutorial.
Also, I found out (after my initial post) that when compressing a jpg it's better to downsize in several steps instead of just one step. In other words, when you have a 2560x1920 image and you want a 640x480 it's better to go to 1280x960 first and then to 640x480 ... or use even more steps. The way a jpg compresses it looses more quality by doing it in one step. |
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08/07/2002 04:29:26 PM · #10 |
| While we are at this whole resizing business, I am confused about size: 640x480/480x640. Is this the maximum size, or is it the required size?? If I crop an image, and it is not exactly 640x480, is that acceptable? |
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08/07/2002 04:31:09 PM · #11 |
Originally posted by lhall:
While we are at this whole resizing business, I am confused about size: 640x480/480x640. Is this the [i]maximum size, or is it the required size?? If I crop an image, and it is not exactly 640x480, is that acceptable?[/i]
It is one of the required sizes. Currently, you have to submit with 640x480 or 640x427 (or the opposites). If you don't you will have padding and will be disqualified. I believe that, in the future, this may be changed...
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08/07/2002 04:32:48 PM · #12 |
Originally posted by sylk:
Thanks, John ... can't wait for that tutorial.
Also, I found out (after my initial post) that when compressing a jpg it's better to downsize in several steps instead of just one step. In other words, when you have a 2560x1920 image and you want a 640x480 it's better to go to 1280x960 first and then to 640x480 ... or use even more steps. The way a jpg compresses it looses more quality by doing it in one step.
I have never tried this... I really don't see how it would affect anything though... No compression takes place at all until you actually save the file to disk. I resize from whatever pixel size I am working with directly to 640x480 right before i'm ready to save...
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08/07/2002 04:34:43 PM · #13 |
Originally posted by jmsetzler:
It is one of the required sizes. Currently, you have to submit with 640x480 or 640x427 (or the opposites). If you don't you will have padding and will be disqualified. I believe that, in the future, this may be changed...
Thanks for the guidance, it is most appreciated ! |
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08/07/2002 04:40:53 PM · #14 |
sylk:
That really shouldn't be the case. When do turn a 2048x1680 image (or whatever) into a 1280x960 image, each pixel in the new image is simply a blend of several pixels from the old, larger image. This is called sampling, and it is why you lose detail when you downsize.
If you resize (and resample) again from 1280x960 to 640x480, the new pixels are again created by simply blending several pixels from the larger image (which already does not look like the original).
It is (or should be, if everything is done properly) much better to simply resample and downsize just once-- just like it is better to make a photocopy of an original image than it is to make a photocopy of a photocopy. |
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08/07/2002 04:58:23 PM · #15 |
I used to do all my edits on a copy of the original in full size out of the camera.
Then, I would use the constrain command to a 640 x 480 x 100 dpi (or one of the other 3 allowed sizes). Sharpen this image, choose a quality level that would get me under the 150k limit and submit. I thought I had decent quality with that method.
Then I changed when I got a full version of Photoshop to doing all my edits as I had always done, Cropped using constrain with the 640 x 480 x 100dpi, sharpened BUT!!!!..then I would use the "Save for the web" function and I started to get som grain.
What I found out is "Save for the Web" samples the photo to 72 dpi and resizes the image..Increasing the physical size to maintain the pixel dimensions. That introduced grain.
So..now...I have the crop tool to constrain at 640 x 480 x 72..then I sharpen then I "Save for the Web" and it seems to have helped. |
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08/07/2002 05:30:04 PM · #16 |
Bingo, Hokie. That's what I have found that works best for me as well. And by sharpening, I'm assuming you are using the Unsharp Mask filter.
There are some photos that I sharpen, very slightly, first. If the original image is slightly soft to begin with then I might use the Unsharp Mask filter to improve it. I have pretty specific settings that I use and I am very careful not to over sharpen the photo. I am simply preparing a very good original before I do my resizing. Then I will probably sharpen it slightly once again after I have resized it. I use this technique when I am resizing UP as well. I know many people will say not to sharpen before you have resized the image but I think the main point is not to over-sharpen it like too many people will tend to do. I only use the Unsharp Mask filter and I have experimented enough to know what settings I think work best. It is a technique that requires some experimentation to learn how to use judiciously.
T |
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