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DPChallenge Forums >> Business of Photography >> Time has come- Smugmug vs Zenfolio
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Showing posts 1 - 11 of 11, (reverse)
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 11/15/2015 01:29:21 PM · #1
I have been asked by a company that they want to purchase (commercial) some of my last photographs I have taken
I am pretty overwhelmed because 1. Photography its a hobby for me and I had no urge to go into business, if I start this I will have to go do the tax thing and take the next step = paid website then start the next new journey.

Right now, I have a free fun website now to which ppl can purchase stuff and I love using WHCC for all my prints and I use a local company for my canvas work.
For business is another territory. They want a commercial license thing release, this is territory I know nothing about nor the business of things. reading the blogs, google and many many sites, forums and even here My brain is swimming.

Any guidance on the percent profit of what you have done and that has worked would be awesome, smugmug had it as a 400% default just started a trial with them, but for a perma site, I am unsure if I should just do smugmug, zenfolio are the top ones I have been looking at or if there are other more reasonable sites that work just as well?
I know this has been asked tons of times here and I have read them.

I have already went ahead and redid my logo and invested in my own domain.

So, its this step with what websites I am having issues with esp with the default pricing and choosing a site because I am unsure of what my needs will be or even what I need. It is really hard to compare when you don't even know what you need or want LOL!

I have tried fine art america and hated it, so I am not even going back on there.

On to the upgrade step! Suggestions, guidelines, advice? TIA
 11/15/2015 01:53:17 PM · #2
Honestly they are both about the same. Over the years I have switched back and forth between the two and currently I am on Zenfolio. The main thing I like about Zenfolio is they use Mpix, who I have been using for years now (well Mpix Pro) for all my printing needs. Smugmug does allow a lot more customization of the site but after a lot of thought that did not really matter to me. A few years ago I was really into site design so that attracted me to Smugmug, but now I don't want to spend a lot of time messing with that. Would rather concentrate on my photos now and Zenfolio's default setups are really good, especially after making a few quick changes.

Now I am pretty much stuck with Zenfolio. A few months ago my year was up (paid by the year) and I could re-up for another year under my old plan. They no longer have the plan available that I have, it provides a bit more then their current Pro plan for half the price. So, until they force me to change my plan I will continue to upgrade my current plan. Their current Pro plan is $240 billed annually ($336 billed monthly) and Smugmug is $150 billed annually ($240 billed monthly). While Zenfolio is a bit more expensive I feel the way they handle price list is superior to Smugmug. I also do not think that with Smugmug you can do coupons for % off from orders, which I find is a nice way to give people a discount. When I hand out business cards I have a spot on the back to write a coupon code and by making a show of writing a code when I had the card to someone makes them think they are getting a deal and more likely to purchase (I do this a lot when shooting events, along with a special URL for that event which I write on the back of the card).

Honestly you can not go wrong with either of them.
 11/15/2015 02:24:28 PM · #3
I try to spend a lot of time editing my photos, I do not want to spend time designing a website, its why i love my Village website now for free I just upload and go :-))

So the less the better on that. I also did not find smugmug that user friendly as the designing goes, but the uploading was ok :)

Message edited by author 2015-11-15 14:25:41.
 11/15/2015 02:32:03 PM · #4
I believe Zenfolio has a trial period, you should give it a try and see which you like better.
 11/15/2015 03:56:57 PM · #5
I too use Zenfolio. I love its ease of use. I was disappointed when they eliminated the plan I was on and I had to upgrade to use the 'client access' feature - but such is life. Still simple.
 11/15/2015 05:59:46 PM · #6
Thank you :-)) I will give them a try as well :-)
 11/15/2015 06:44:35 PM · #7
For the same reasons as you I decided to add some method of commerce & fulfillment to my site. A key point for me was they had to have a printer in Australia as otherwise shipping was prohibitive. I already had an existing WordPress site which I primarily use for travel blogs but increasingly it is starting to house all my photographic output. To this end I tried Zenfolio but was unhappy with their blog module and as I could not find any similar service that ticked all my boxes I went back to WP. It was at this time I found Shootproof.com which was exactly what I wanted, and so in the end I just added them to my existing WP site for fulfillment only.

Everyone's needs are different and my solution may not be yours so think carefully about how you intend to implement your flow and consider other methodologies.
 11/15/2015 10:10:38 PM · #8
I was a smugmug customer for 2-3 years, then a Zenfolio customer since.

I have grown increasingly unhappy with Zenfolio, though for these reasons:

1) Big price increase for me last year (or was it the year before)...from $99 to $140 per year. Still in line with others, but given the next few points, I'm reconsidering.
2) Poorer uptime this year--there have been a lot of outages. Even after they said they nailed the reason, there were more outages
3) Poor SEO performance. That may be in part my problem, since I haven't followed through on all their SEO instructions. But my stuff is keyworded, described, etc. And recently doing Google searches looking for stolen images, ironically, I've found they ALL have better rankings than my Zenfolio site.
4) VERY expensive shipping fees. More expensive than ordering from Mpix alone. For some of my personal galleries, or theatre shot galleries, I think I lose a lot of the smaller orders because the minimum shipping charges are pretty high. I think Smugmug is similar in this regard, but I can't see why these guys should charge siginificantly more than MPIX for example, since all they do is pass the order through...and we're already paying them twice...once for the website, once for the profit margin on the prints.

so I'm in the market for a new alternative myself.

As far as licensing, Zenfolio does work, they provide templates, and allow people to see the license before purchasing, though they take a relatively big chunk of your profit (as I recall it's around 7%). I've used it a number of times, but I think it's better for licensing to do it direct, and invoice the client (and let them pay direct).

BTW - I'm a fan of WHCC too, and only Smugmug has a contract with them. Zenfolio uses MPIX. They're good too, but when I order prints for people direct, I use WHCC, and their shipping policies are wonderful and inexpensive.

I have another website I use as a print showcase, which is much cheaper than all of the above, and it's not bad. It's best for just "art print" sales, not custom work like portraits weddings, etc. It's artistswebsites.com ... I think it's only $35 per year or so, and you do get traffic to your site driven by their sister website, finartamerica.com. My site there is //neilshapiro.artistwebsites.com/

I hear a lot of good things about squarespace.com, especially for SEO. If the new prices I see on Zenfolio are the only plans now, I think Squarespace is even a bit less expensive than Zen now. also, they have a 20 page/gallery plan for under $100 per year. There's a free trial too. I will try it, but my Zenfolio account doesn't expire until April, so I have time.
11/24/2015 12:08:28 AM · #9
I am half way through the trial I decided not to go with Zenfolio because I LOVE WHCC for my prints. For me to do WHCC, Zenfolio wanted to charge me 6% fee with the prints and I was not to keen on Mixpro or whatever they used.

Theses are my personal prints I did and these photos were just taken very super recently. My clients that have ordered loved them as well, As of now I have three scheduled shoots within the next two weeks.. my website right now that I sell them through is free for me to use, however, they don't offer canvas or set ups.

I am also on smug mug but for me the uploading is easy but still not how I wish things to get, I feel they are very pricy on their items and people can get prints for half the price on my website now.

Also, news for ya all, As of today my crafts and photography is no longer a hobby, I am considered a legal legit business through the IRS as of today!
I decided to take the plunge in it and get super serious and really start treating it like a business. I am staying away from weddings though LOL!! Won't touch them with a 10 foot pole!
Pretty excited about it and I owe a lot of my growth to all of you who really helped me along the way and really were straight up with me and didn't beat around the bush and were sugar coating things. I feel I found my groove in the editing side of the world lately and things just seem to really come together! I feel the mojo groovin and I kinda like it :-0)

I will check out those that you mentioned Neil, I appreciate it! As of now I am just going to let those trials run out

Message edited by author 2015-11-24 00:25:59.
 11/24/2015 12:24:53 AM · #10
Originally posted by MichaelC:
For the same reasons as you I decided to add some method of commerce & fulfillment to my site. A key point for me was they had to have a printer in Australia as otherwise shipping was prohibitive. I already had an existing WordPress site which I primarily use for travel blogs but increasingly it is starting to house all my photographic output. To this end I tried Zenfolio but was unhappy with their blog module and as I could not find any similar service that ticked all my boxes I went back to WP. It was at this time I found Shootproof.com which was exactly what I wanted, and so in the end I just added them to my existing WP site for fulfillment only.

Everyone's needs are different and my solution may not be yours so think carefully about how you intend to implement your flow and consider other methodologies.


I have heard of shootproof and have yet to check them out, You are the third person that mentioned that one :-)
 11/26/2015 10:27:33 PM · #11
I've been using https://www.photoshelter.com as a host . Haven't tried the print sale feature though. Worth trialing out.
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